Location of Neville's body and the importance of the BLOCKED staircase

[Nigel]

My understanding is that all access to the kitchen was blocked?

Door blocked by Neville. (Left hand side of Aga)

Staircase blocked (Right hand side of Aga)

Is this correct?

If it was Jeremy he wasn't trying to make it look like it was Sheilla, was he?

Thanks

ps
do any CS photos of Staircase blocked (Right hand side of Aga) show DOOR SHUT, thanks

[Nigel]

Mike,

Is there any photographs of 'Blocked staircase'?

Thanks

[mike tesko]

Mike,

Is there any photographs of 'Blocked staircase'?

Thanks

Many of the original photographs were deliberately concealed from the defence, a total of at least 358 by the time of the October 1986 trial! Today I believe there are still over 200 of these still withheld, with Essex police refusing to disclose them for reasons best known to themselves! The only photographs in the public domain which we have access to are incorporated in kitchen view images which show the doorway at the foot of the spiral stair which you are alluding to, and a cluttered view of the first half dozen or so steps!

[Nigel]

Many of the original photographs were deliberately concealed from the defence, a total of at least 358 by the time of the October 1986 trial! Today I believe there are still over 200 of these still withheld, with Essex police refusing to disclose them for reasons best known to themselves! The only photographs in the public domain which we have access to are incorporated in kitchen view images which show the doorway at the foot of the spiral stair which you are alluding to, and a cluttered view of the first half dozen or so steps!

Thanks for the reply Mike,

Have you spoken to Jeremy about the said Blocked Staircase (above)?

As its rather quite important baring mind it's the only way Sheilla could have got to Parent's bedroom.

Whats your view on Blocked Staircase (above)?

thanks

[Nigel]

If it was Jeremy he would have pulled Neville's body away from door and left door open.

Surely?

[Reader]

What are you suggesting was blocking the kitchen staircase?

[Nigel]

What are you suggesting was blocking the kitchen staircase?

Well I'm not sure.

Firstly the word 'Blocked' in say cricket, to 'block the ball' and 'road block' implies that nothing gets through.

I have seen a colour photograph of miscellaneous items at bottom of the stairs.

But when you consider the importance of that staircase, you expect a better photograph. ie one of the staircase itself.

Do you know if the Jury heard or saw the word BLOCKED as per diagram above, in relation to staircase right hand side of Aga?

I can not over emphasize the importance of this question.

and was it BLOCKED as in the cricket term? or not?

thanks

[mike tesko]

Well I'm not sure.

Firstly the word 'Blocked' in say cricket, to 'block the ball' and 'road block' implies that nothing gets through.

I have seen a colour photograph of miscellaneous items at bottom of the stairs.

But when you consider the importance of that staircase, you expect a better photograph. ie one of the staircase itself.

Do you know if the Jury heard or saw the word BLOCKED as per diagram above, in relation to staircase right hand side of Aga?

I can not over estimate the importance of this question.

and was it BLOCKED as in the cricket term? or not?

thanks

What we do know, is that the spiral staircase in question, was not blocked to the extent that it prevented Sheila Caffell or anyone else for that matter, using it to get upstairs from downstairs, or vice versa! We know this because according to one account given by a member of the raid team, he 'crept up those stairs' shouting as he did so, 'Sheila Bamber, show yourself', or words to this effect! This took place after her body was discovered missing from the kitchen! Albeit, when spoken about by the officer concerned he does not say that he did this after Sheila's body went missing from the kitchen, he says this as though it was just one thing he did in response to hearing movement upstairs!

[Nigel]

What we do know, is that the spiral staircase in question, was not blocked to the extent that it prevented Sheila Caffell or anyone else for that matter, using it to get upstairs from downstairs, or vice versa! We know this because according to one account given by a member of the raid team, he 'crept up those stairs' shouting as he did so, 'Sheila Bamber, show yourself', or order to this effect! This took place after her body was discovered missing from the kitchen! Albeit, when spoken about by the officer concerned he does not say that he did this after Sheila's body went missing from the kitchen, he says this as though it was just as one thing he did in response to hearing movement upstairs!

thanks Mike,

So it wasn't blocked.

Was the word BLOCKED (as in above diagram)  SHOWN or SAID to the Jury?

Also, if possible could you post the colour photograph of first half dozen approx steps.
I cant locate it, appreciate it.
Would like to try and answer @Reader 's question...

[mike tesko]

What we do know, is that the spiral staircase in question, was not blocked to the extent that it prevented Sheila Caffell or anyone else for that matter, using it to get upstairs from downstairs, or vice versa! We know this because according to one account given by a member of the raid team, he 'crept up those stairs' shouting as he did so, 'Sheila Bamber, show yourself', or words to this effect! This took place after her body was discovered missing from the kitchen! Albeit, when spoken about by the officer concerned he does not say that he did this after Sheila's body went missing from the kitchen, he says this as though it was just one thing he did in response to hearing movement upstairs!

Jeremy treats this event as evidence that the firearms team knew that Sheila was downstairs in the kitchen before they actually entered, but that Sheila fled upstairs when the police started banging the courtyard door in, and that she used those spiral stairs to get from downstairs to upstairs at that time, and that the officer pursued Sheila up those stairs' calling out her name, requesting her to give herself up!

[Nigel]

Jeremy treats this event as evidence that the firearms team knew that Sheila was downstairs in the kitchen before they actually entered, but that Sheila fled upstairs when the police started banging the courtyard door in, and that she used those spiral stairs to get from downstairs to upstairs at that time, and that the officer pursued Sheila up those stairs' calling out her name, requesting her to give herself up!

Have you asked Jeremy why his mum stored random items at the bottom of a staircase?
Baring in mind the house appeared to have plenty of storage space.
Was his mum normally known to be untidy?
Also did they have a home help/cleaner?
thanks

I'm guessing photo in question was taken after burly raid team clamoured up the said staircase (right hand side of Aga).

[mike tesko]

Jeremy treats this event as evidence that the firearms team knew that Sheila was downstairs in the kitchen before they actually entered, but that Sheila fled upstairs when the police started banging the courtyard door in, and that she used those spiral stairs to get from downstairs to upstairs at that time, and that the officer pursued Sheila up those stairs' calling out her name, requesting her to give herself up!

Yet...

Jeremy's account does not sit well with the contents of the timed police radio message log contents, and various other timed police events, stating that two bodies were present downstairs when the firearm officers entered the premises, the body of one dead male, and the body of one dead female, a murder and a suicide, etc, etc, etc, at 7.35am, 7.37am, 7.38am, 7.42am and 7.45am - if Sheila had fled upstairs as claimed by Jeremy when firearm officers started smashing the rear farmhouse door in by sledgehammer, there wouldn't exist any of these police messages confirming the presence of two bodies in the kitchen!

Not only that, but Jeremy's claim was that after his sister fled upstairs that she shot herself twice in her parents bedroom and fell dead on the bedroom floor, where he suggests the police originally found her body in possession of the rifle which had fired both shots!

Well, that can't possibly be true for a number of different reasons!

[mike tesko]

Yet...

Jeremy's account does not sit well with the contents of the timed police radio message log contents, and various other timed police events, stating that two bodies were present downstairs when the firearm officers entered the premises, the body of one dead male, and the body of one dead female, a murder and a suicide, etc, etc, etc, at 7.35am, 7.37am, 7.38am, 7.42am and 7.45am - if Sheila had fled upstairs as claimed by Jeremy when firearm officers started smashing the rear farmhouse door in by sledgehammer, there wouldn't exist any of these police messages confirming the presence of two bodies in the kitchen!

Not only that, but Jeremy's claim was that after his sister fled upstairs that she shot herself twice in her parents bedroom and fell dead on the bedroom floor, where he suggests the police originally found her body in possession of the rifle which had fired both shots!

Well, that can't possibly be true for a number of different reasons!

Firstly..

For what Jeremy is trying to prove to be true, there would have been four bodies upstairs by 8.10am, but according to a contemporaneously recorded police message, there were only three bodies found upstairs!

So, that kind of weakens Jeremy's claim, in other words, what Jeremy is saying happened involving his sister after police got into the farmhouse can't possibly be true, and he should cease from trying to pursue something that cannot possibly be true or accurate! Since, what we know with a degree of certainty, is that based on the content of variously timed police log contents, that between 7.35am and 8.10am, there were two bodies downstairs, and only three bodies upstairs!

[Nigel]

Firstly..

For what Jeremy is trying to prove to be true, there would have been four bodies upstairs by 8.10am, but according to a contemporaneously recorded police message, there were only three bodies found upstairs!

So, that kind of weakens Jeremy's claim, in other words, what Jeremy is saying happened involving his sister after police got into the farmhouse can't possibly be true, and he should cease from trying to pursue something that cannot possibly be true or accurate! Since, what we know with a degree of certainty, is that based on the content of variously timed police log contents, that between 7.35am and 8.10am, there were two bodies downstairs, and only three bodies upstairs!

Mike,

With respect please can we focus on the Kitchen staircase right hand side of Aga.

Thanks

[mike tesko]

Additionally,  what then of the other independent accounts, for example, Dr Craig seeing Sheila's body on the far side of the herewith only one bullet wound on her neck? What about when DS Jones and DC Clark saw the bodies of June and Sheila laid on top of the bed in the parents bedroom, side by side, with the rifle laid on the bed in-between both of their bodies, and with Sheila having a Bible placed on top of her chest at that stage, seen by these two police officers at around 9.10am, that morning! What about the Coroner's Officer, PC Wright who visited the parents bedroom at 9.30am, and remembers that there was no rifle with Sheila's body at that stage, but he noted that Sheila had got two bullet wounds on her neck by that time? What about the rifle being photographed resting against the inside of the parents bedroom window (photo' no.21), prior to it then being photographed in Sheila Caffell's possession on the bedroom floor (as evidenced by Photo's no. 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32 and 33)?

Sheila Caffell was only shot once upstairs in the bedroom!

She was originally shot downstairs in the kitchen at the time the firearm team entered the premises, at a time when the rifle was resting against the first floor box room window! How is it possible for Sheila to have been shot downstairs in the kitchen by a rifle that at the time of the original shooting, the rifle which supposedly fired both inflicted shots was presently still resting against the first floor box room window?