Bullets fired and reloading

[Kaldin]

Hi Kaldin
wow this is so strange is this the bullet case that was transferred on somebody's foot this has been posted Patti and hartley discussed the bullet casings in great length wish she was here

The one on the kitchen stairs is the one which was allegedly transferred there on someone's foot, yes. DC Hammersley didn't mention that one in his statement or in his court evidence as far as I can see. This is very odd as it makes even less sense than it did before.

[Kaldin]

The only reference to the one on the kitchen stairs is what you had pointed out to me the other day.

If the kitchen stairs shell case is real, then does it point to a missed shot maybe?

There were 25 cases found, and there were 25 bullet injuries, so it seems that none of them missed. I just can't understand why some sources say there were 14 in or outside the bedroom, and others say there were 13. The three in the kitchen are even more of a mystery as Nevill sustained four serious head wounds.

[guest2181]

The one on the kitchen stairs is the one which was allegedly transferred there on someone's foot, yes. DC Hammersley didn't mention that one in his statement or in his court evidence as far as I can see. This is very odd as it makes even less sense than it did before.

Yeah, thanks for that.     

It is odd.

[Kaldin]

Yeah, thanks for that.     

It is odd.

I know. 

If there were only three cases in the kitchen, that means that Nevill was shot five times upstairs, including one serious shot to his head, and yet he went downstairs to the kitchen.

I'll so some more research because the info in the appeal document seemed quite clear.

[guest2181]

I know. 

If there were only three cases in the kitchen, that means that Nevill was shot five times upstairs, including one serious shot to his head, and yet he went downstairs to the kitchen.

I'll so some more research because the info in the appeal document seemed quite clear.

Well let me know how you get on. It would be good to get to the bottom of it.

[David1819]

I know. 

If there were only three cases in the kitchen, that means that Nevill was shot five times upstairs, including one serious shot to his head, and yet he went downstairs to the kitchen.

I'll so some more research because the info in the appeal document seemed quite clear.

Nevill was most likely shot four times in kitchen. The trajectories to his head are all similar. It's far more likely they never found the fourth casing. The alternative is Nevill moving around with a head shot, very unlikely imo.

[Kaldin]

Nevill was most likely shot four times in kitchen. The trajectories to his head are all similar. It's far more likely they never found the fourth casing. The alternative is Nevill moving around with a head shot, very unlikely imo.

But if there were 13 cases in the bedroom, and one just outside the bedroom, making 14 in total, 7 would be associated with June, 2 would be associated with Sheila, and the other 5 must be associated with Nevill, so how can he have been shot four times in the kitchen?

Malcolm Fletcher also recorded a total of 13 bullet cases in the bedroom, and one on the stairs. He didn't specify which stairs, but DC Hammersley said it was on the landing outside the bedroom.

[Kaldin]

There has to be something wrong here. If there were only three cartridge cases in the kitchen, how could Nevill have been shot four times in the head in the kitchen? I don't know where the appeal judges got their information from, but I can't find a reference to another cartridge case being found on the stairs leading from the kitchen other than in the appeal document.

[susan]

There has to be something wrong here. If there were only three cartridge cases in the kitchen, how could Nevill have been shot four times in the head in the kitchen? I don't know where the appeal judges got their information from, but I can't find a reference to another cartridge case being found on the stairs leading from the kitchen other than in the appeal document.

Kaldin hope you can get to the bottom of this I am totally out of my depth here.

[David1819]

But if there were 13 cases in the bedroom, and one just outside the bedroom, making 14 in total, 7 would be associated with June, 2 would be associated with Sheila, and the other 5 must be associated with Nevill, so how can he have been shot four times in the kitchen?

Malcolm Fletcher also recorded a total of 13 bullet cases in the bedroom, and one on the stairs. He didn't specify which stairs, but DC Hammersley said it was on the landing outside the bedroom.

June had a grazewound. It was mentioned at trial she could have been shot 8 times.

[Roch]

I know. 

If there were only three cases in the kitchen, that means that Nevill was shot five times upstairs, including one serious shot to his head, and yet he went downstairs to the kitchen.

I'll so some more research because the info in the appeal document seemed quite clear.

Some people are of the opinion that Nevill was downstairs when the incident began. 

[Kaldin]

June had a grazewound. It was mentioned at trial she could have been shot 8 times.

Then there would be 26 cartridge cases, but there were 25. The problem is that one of them should have been in the kitchen, but it was upstairs.

If one bullet can be transferred upstairs, maybe more could have been.

[Kaldin]

Here is Mr Fletcher's statement.
 
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,4019.0.html

It lists DRH/14 as being found on the stairs, but he didn't say which stairs. That same item was described by DC Hammersley as being found on the floor on the landing. They both list DRH/19, DRH/20, and DRH/41 as being found in the kitchen. I assume that Mr Fletcher simply followed what DC Hammersley had written down, although he did miss out a cartridge case in the children's bedroom.

[Kaldin]

Kaldin hope you can get to the bottom of this I am totally out of my depth here.

I haven't yet Susan - sorry. 

[susan]

I haven't yet Susan - sorry. 

Kaldin I am sure you and hartley will get it sorted and david seems well up on the casings I know nothing about them sorry I cannot help