Author Topic: Audio  (Read 20179 times)

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Offline Roch

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Re: Audio
« Reply #15 on: May 21, 2011, 09:42:AM »
A lie is a lie. If you were innocent, there would not be a lie. Jeremy is lying. And probably guilty of this horrible crime.
I wish his own parents would have kept him and loved him + the grandparents that forced his parents to give him up! Fuck them all!

I'm at work... and so cant listen to the audio links that have secured abs believing in Jeremy's guilt  :o Frustrating!!!  >:(
« Last Edit: May 21, 2011, 09:44:AM by Rochford Shields »

Offline grahameb

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Re: Audio
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2011, 09:45:AM »
I personally resent being called part of a "fan club". I am interested in this case because I believe this man has suffered a gross miscarriage of justice of great magnitude. My main problem keeps nagging me. Why was it deemed necessary that so much evidence to be witheld from the defence team? I believed that he was innocent when I first heard the verdict and I still think he's innocent today the more I hear. Why therefore should so many people who think the same as I do be called a "fan club". That is patronising in the extreme. And for someone who is always going on about people having the right to believe what they want, this is a blatant contradiction of that belief. In other words. Those who think he's guilty they have the right to believe what they like without being contradicted by anyone.

But on the other hand those who think he is not guilty but has suffered at the hands of our flawed justice system are to be termed "fans" of Jeremy Bamber. If you had suffered at the hand of a corrupt justice system I would also fight for you and not follow other "fans" of our so called justice system like sheep, who believe the decisions of the appeal courts just because they are appeal courts without really looking at the unjust decisions they have made in the past and the CCRC decision this time around. Their decision was floored and it is obviously floored to those who won't take the blinkers from their eyes and see it for themselves. The truth is the CCRC need to be investigated themselves.

There is so much corruption in this system it is unbelievable. abs, start looking at the other evidence instead of hanging on the bad memories of Jeremy Bamber. Try remembering all you said 25 years ago. In fact if he had rehearsed it all over 25 years wouldn't you think that he would tell it the same each time? Sure he would. The very fact that his words are different each time round indicates that he hasn't rehearsed it. Look at every accusation that those who think he is guilty say. It is mostly based upon things they think possible or impossible, such as "We don't think Sheila did it" Why? "Oh because she was a frail person". That is an assumption. Or if you contend with them when they say that Sheila was "spotlessly" clean and you mention that so was Jeremy, They don't judge it on the same level as they do Sheila. Rather they have to bring in a "hit man" to explain why Jeremy himself was clean. So you have all these assumptions they make. Again, rather than believing Mugford was a lier (which she was proved to be after her story of a hitman was found out to be false) they would rather believe JB to be the lier.

My great question is, why did not the defence barrister not question the relatives more rigorously about the silencer and the very real possibility of them contaminating it with the blood left at the scene or with the bloodied clothes found soaking in the bucket which Ann Eaton "took home" to "wash" of all things. Why oh why did he not question them on that? That silencer should never ever have been entered as evidence and Julie Mugford should have been deemed an unreliable witness as soon as her story of the "hit man" didn't hold water. Those are the two key elements that made that trial a miscarriage of justice. Not what Jeremy Bamber said or did not say.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2011, 09:49:AM by grahame »

Offline Roch

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Re: Audio
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2011, 10:03:AM »
I personally resent being called part of a "fan club". I am interested in this case because I believe this man has suffered a gross miscarriage of justice of great magnitude. My main problem keeps nagging me. Why was it deemed necessary that so much evidence to be witheld from the defence team? I believed that he was innocent when I first heard the verdict and I still think he's innocent today the more I hear. Why therefore should so many people who think the same as I do be called a "fan club". That is patronising in the extreme. And for someone who is always going on about people having the right to believe what they want, this is a blatant contradiction of that belief. In other words. Those who think he's guilty they have the right to believe what they like without being contradicted by anyone.

But on the other hand those who think he is not guilty but has suffered at the hands of our flawed justice system are to be termed "fans" of Jeremy Bamber. If you had suffered at the hand of a corrupt justice system I would also fight for you and not follow other "fans" of our so called justice system like sheep, who believe the decisions of the appeal courts just because they are appeal courts without really looking at the unjust decisions they have made in the past and the CCRC decision this time around. Their decision was floored and it is obviously floored to those who won't take the blinkers from their eyes and see it for themselves. The truth is the CCRC need to be investigated themselves.

There is so much corruption in this system it is unbelievable. abs, start looking at the other evidence instead of hanging on the bad memories of Jeremy Bamber. Try remembering all you said 25 years ago. In fact if he had rehearsed it all over 25 years wouldn't you think that he would tell it the same each time? Sure he would. The very fact that his words are different each time round indicates that he hasn't rehearsed it. Look at every accusation that those who think he is guilty say. It is mostly based upon things they think possible or impossible, such as "We don't think Sheila did it" Why? "Oh because she was a frail person". That is an assumption. Or if you contend with them when they say that Sheila was "spotlessly" clean and you mention that so was Jeremy, They don't judge it on the same level as they do Sheila. Rather they have to bring in a "hit man" to explain why Jeremy himself was clean. So you have all these assumptions they make. Again, rather than believing Mugford was a lier (which she was proved to be after her story of a hitman was found out to be false) they would rather believe JB to be the lier.

My great question is, why did not the defence barrister not question the relatives more rigorously about the silencer and the very real possibility of them contaminating it with the blood left at the scene or with the bloodied clothes found soaking in the bucket which Ann Eaton "took home" to "wash" of all things. Why oh why did he not question them on that? That silencer should never ever have been entered as evidence and Julie Mugford should have been deemed an unreliable witness as soon as her story of the "hit man" didn't hold water. Those are the two key elements that made that trial a miscarriage of justice. Not what Jeremy Bamber said or did not say.

Passionate response that grahame....  Pretty much concur, no suprises there though, me being a fellow 'moderate lefty'  ;)

CHRIS T

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Re: Audio
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2011, 10:07:AM »
Very well said, grahame! I would applaud you for that, but already gave you one less than an hour ago ;)

All the reasons you give here for believing in Jeremy's innocence, are the same for me. There is no doubt about it that the relatives should have been investigated regarding the convenient finding of the silencer. And if the White House Farm murders had occurred today, i feel certain that the silencer evidence would have been thrown out, and the testimony of a jilted girlfriend. If this had been a fair trial, Jeremy would not be where he is today, in my opinion.



Offline curiousessex

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Re: Audio
« Reply #19 on: May 21, 2011, 10:32:AM »
Interesting audio in the 1.15 clip.

The last 15 seconds, in my opinion, are not consistent with other statements made at the time of the killings and discussed at the original trial.

Jeremy says in the interview "...and I specifically remember getting the engaged tone because I then pressed the last number redial at least twice more and both times got the engaged tone.  (Long pause) And that is when I rang the Police."

Well, according to other statements this is not strictly true because in some accounts.........Jeremy rang Julie, Jeremy apparently looked up the telephone number for Chelmsford Police Station instead of dialling 999, Jeremy rang the Police a good while after apparently getting the engaged tone having pressed the last number redial at least twice more. For me, given Jeremy in his own words is talking about something he specifically remembers the inconsistancy raises question. Additionally, for me, there is a distinct change in the tone of Jeremy's voice when he pauses and then states "And that is when I rang the Police" ...........


Offline joolz1975

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Re: Audio
« Reply #20 on: May 21, 2011, 10:45:AM »
Graeme i think maybe fanclub was the wrong word so i apologise!

Its not peoples opinions or beliefs that make me think like that it is certain peoples way of expressing them! Theres a minority on here that would believe he was innocent no matter what they read, infact one person has openly admitted that they havnt read appeal documents because they disagree with what is in them!

If people think he is innocent then i respect that opinion but a few posters do his cause no favours as they are so sure hes innocent that they go off on a tangent as soon as anyone suggests otherwise!

Ive said all along the investigation was seriously flawed and i 100% support a retrial so the truth whatever that may be can finally come out!

I agree the relatives and JM acted very suspiciously but JBs team had the chance to discredit JM at his appeal and they chose not to! So its either a case of shoddy defence lawyers that didnt do their job or that they knew JM wasnt lying!

People can say she lied, commited perjury etc... But his team have not proven she did so!

Offline VORTEX

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Re: Audio
« Reply #21 on: May 21, 2011, 10:51:AM »
A lie is a lie. If you were innocent, there would not be a lie. Jeremy is lying. And probably guilty of this horrible crime.
I wish his own parents would have kept him and loved him + the grandparents that forced his parents to give him up! Fuck them all!

I'm at work... and so cant listen to the audio links that have secured abs believing in Jeremy's guilt  :o Frustrating!!!  >:(

Rochford, don't get too excited about the audio as I have listened and it's not doing anything for me either way. I think the reason Jeremy is highlighting the "THEY SAW SOMETHING" is because that is what matters. There is no point in saying HE saw something as that means nothing at all (HE is the same chap who has been telling the Police for 26 years that he didn't kill his family and they haven't believed what he has said so far). So the fact that THEY saw something (as in the Police) is the key point which is why he is highlighting it. They half admit THEY saw something with the "trick of the light" fairy story. Set it all up and let's have a demonstration of a trick of the light as I'm trying my hardest to believe it. They saw something and it wasn't a trick of the light. Remember they were calling senior members of EP very early that morning telling them of a possible siege situation at WHF. Justify why they were using the word "Siege" if they had no other intel apart from what Jeremy Bamber had told them in the initial phone call and conversations on site with Police?


Jackiepreece

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Re: Audio
« Reply #22 on: May 21, 2011, 10:53:AM »
So well put Grahame (who yesterday was saying the forum had gone to pot with the type of people who pot)I couldn't have put that across as well as that.

As someone who is constantly being accused of being one of JB s biggest fan I bet I have tried harder to find things that would make me decide he was guilty than the people who think he is guilty have looked at reasons he could be innocent.
I have looked at his background no history of violence to anyone including his family no motive he had a wonderful lifestyle if we are talking about money the relatives had more motive planting the silencer to make money, mugford an accomplished liar when she went from shop to shop committing fraud why believe her this time I might have the tiniest bit of doubt if she hadn't sold her story after the trial.  JBs behaviour after the murders stupid thick whatever he would not have left the relatives raking around Whf if he was guilty.  His behaviour in the witness box I defy anyone to say his behaviour was someone putting on a brilliant performance to prove he was innocent remember he apparently told mugford what a good actor he was.

Where had JB s brilliant acting skills gone when he should have been putting on the performance of his life I think that went to Miss Mugford
I think a lot of people might agree his so called performance was an arrogant young man thinking how ridiculous he was sitting there accused of murdering his whole family.
Nobody who had committed those murders would have baited the prosecution the way he did.
JB was not someone who had been in and out of prison all his life if he was responsible he would have been scared out of his life he could have been going to prison for the rest of his life and as for the hitman theory isn't the reason a hitman is usually used so the person has an alibi.  Why didn't JB go and see Julie and let the police find the staged suicide and don't forget JB had to leave the hitman details of where to find the bible what if sheila had moved it

I could go on and on the grateful relatives giving one of the investigating officers a job at the caravan

Gratitude above and beyond

But Abs if we are down to scrutinising words think of JB s reaction when he was told all his family were dead

Well the police must have killed them

What part of his master plan was that

Shouldn't it have been I knew Sheila would do this before

If JB had spoken to Neville a few hours before (Sheila had kicked off on previous occasions)and if JB and the police thought they had seen someone move around in the house wouldn't that be a natural response I can see myself saying that also

Abs why do you think he would say that

chochokeira

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Re: Audio
« Reply #23 on: May 21, 2011, 10:53:AM »
Perhaps if you can find another link or two to any audio I can have a listen too. Happy to receive a PM too.

6 minutes here http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/audio/2011/jan/30/jeremy-bamber-murder-appeal-audio

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-stories/2011/01/31/the-jeremy-bamber-files-exclusive-audio-extracts-of-the-convicted-killer-discussing-his-case-115875-22887323/

Had not heard that before. Thanks.
He should shut up. He gives himself away all the time. Just my opinion.


Are you being fair to Jeremy, Abs? If you were interviewed by a broadcasting company about a highly complex subject that you must simplify, something you care deeply about, how well do you think might do? Do you think you would be able to explain yourself clearly, make your points in a natural, 100% accurate, honest and compelling manner and come across as you do here? In my experience, it is most unlikely that you would do so.

I've been interviewed a few times by the media in respect of protest campaigns and a charity I'm involved with and I can tell you that the experience is not at all how you might think it would be. Being interviewed by the media is not something the average person does very often. It's a surreal and stressful experience. I am in awe of anyone who can do a good interview without becoming so stressed out that they mess it up: which is what happened to me.

On one occasion I was interviewed, I was first approached by a researcher a week or two prior to the interview. She was lovely and very sympathetic to our campaign. She asked me lots of questions, gave me time to think about my answers and wanted all the background information she could gather in order to understand our protest. I was left with the impression that the interviewer would interview me just as the researcher had done. Another time I had to go to the BBC studios to be interviewed. Neither experience turned out as I'd expected.

In the intervening period until the day of each of the interviews, I worried about what I would say: would I remember to make all the key points or would I say the wrong thing and mess it up? I kept rehearsing what I wanted to say in my head so that I could reproduce these points in the interview.

The interview at the BBC was a nightmare. I sat dripping with sweat in an otherwise completely darkened, windowless room with this fiercely hot, bright lamp shining in my face. I couldn't see the interviewer, I just heard this disembodied voice that I struggled to hear going over and over and the same points and questions. I felt pressured to give different answers each time. It was so surreal, I can't see how I could have behaved naturally under such pressurised and artificial circumstances. The interview took ages and kept stopping and starting. I became so confused and stressed that I ended up giving nonsensical answers, I just wanted to get out of there.

The other interview was recorded at a demo, so should have been better, however, I lost track of the points I wanted to make when the interviewer I'd expected to be sympathetic began by attacking us: "This protest is unlikely to change anything, is it?", he said and it got worse from there on.

The, heavily edited, final versions of the above interviews seemed manipulated and to bear little or no relation to what I'd said. The interviewers' questions were edited out and a number of sections of my replies seemed stitched together as though I was making an - incoherent - statement.

Unlike Jeremy Bamber, I hadn't been locked away in prison in a surreal and artificial, 25 year time warp when I was interviewed. My freedom did not partly depend on how well I might do in those interviews.  How hard must it be to come across as natural under such circumstances!

When I listen to these clips of Jeremy's interview I recall the dreadful interviews I did. Given the circumstances, I'm not all surprised that I messed up my interviews, nor am I surprised that stressed out Jeremy messed up his: perhaps it's in the nature of the media beast to distort and manipulate interviews, abs.



Offline Roch

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Re: Audio
« Reply #24 on: May 21, 2011, 11:02:AM »
A lie is a lie. If you were innocent, there would not be a lie. Jeremy is lying. And probably guilty of this horrible crime.
I wish his own parents would have kept him and loved him + the grandparents that forced his parents to give him up! Fuck them all!

I'm at work... and so cant listen to the audio links that have secured abs believing in Jeremy's guilt  :o Frustrating!!!  >:(

Rochford, don't get too excited about the audio as I have listened and it's not doing anything for me either way. I think the reason Jeremy is highlighting the "THEY SAW SOMETHING" is because that is what matters. There is no point in saying HE saw something as that means nothing at all (HE is the same chap who has been telling the Police for 26 years that he didn't kill his family and they haven't believed what he has said so far). So the fact that THEY saw something (as in the Police) is the key point which is why he is highlighting it. They half admit THEY saw something with the "trick of the light" fairy story. Set it all up and let's have a demonstration of a trick of the light as I'm trying my hardest to believe it. They saw something and it wasn't a trick of the light. Remember they were calling senior members of EP very early that morning telling them of a possible siege situation at WHF. Justify why they were using the word "Siege" if they had no other intel apart from what Jeremy Bamber had told them in the initial phone call and conversations on site with Police?

I've heard them before Vortex but i wanted to see if I could get what the other posters were picking up from it.  I've read a lot of your posts and i would say from my point of view we're on a similar wavelength re this case.

Jackiepreece

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Re: Audio
« Reply #25 on: May 21, 2011, 11:20:AM »
I wonder has this forum gone to pot with people like Grahame, Vortex Chochokeira etc

Far far from it

(mine was rubbish my excuse using my iPhone and not checking what I had written but I hope everyone gets my drift)

Offline joolz1975

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Re: Audio
« Reply #26 on: May 21, 2011, 11:56:AM »
I wonder has this forum gone to pot with people like Grahame, Vortex Chochokeira etc

Far far from it

(mine was rubbish my excuse using my iPhone and not checking what I had written but I hope everyone gets my drift)

Lol iphone has a lot to answer for, i do the same!

Offline Alias

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Re: Audio
« Reply #27 on: May 21, 2011, 05:11:PM »
Thank you for your thoughts on this.

chocho: "Unlike Jeremy Bamber, I hadn't been locked away in prison in a surreal and artificial, 25 year time warp when I was interviewed. My freedom did not partly depend on how well I might do in those interviews.  How hard must it be to come across as natural under such circumstances!"

That could be true.

I don´t know what to think - I wish I could make up my mind!



John

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Re: Audio
« Reply #28 on: May 21, 2011, 05:14:PM »
He is well institutionalised by now as can be heard by the latest audio messages. Flogging a dead horse comes to mind?
« Last Edit: May 21, 2011, 05:14:PM by John »

Offline Roch

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Re: Audio
« Reply #29 on: May 21, 2011, 05:16:PM »
Thank you for your thoughts on this.

chocho: "Unlike Jeremy Bamber, I hadn't been locked away in prison in a surreal and artificial, 25 year time warp when I was interviewed. My freedom did not partly depend on how well I might do in those interviews.  How hard must it be to come across as natural under such circumstances!"

That could be true.

I don´t know what to think - I wish I could make up my mind!

Assisted Breaking System.  That's what I think of every time I see abs  ;)

Are you back on the fence after your trip over to the other side?  ;D