Kitchen telephone

[Roch]

No it isn't, as Justice just said, if you go into a public toilet and it's filthy, you wouldn't use the toilet on the assumption that it will be filthy too. However, to make the leap from the phone being dirty to the dirt being blood is just more conspiracy nonsense.

I'm sorry but this is just baloney.  For one, it's not a public toilet - it's a kitchen and a crime scene.  Police are present, assessing the situation (in the context of four murders and one suicide).  It has nothing to do with Justice making a snap judgement about whether or not he would use a particular toilet.  Secondly, a telephone isn't a toilet.

[guest7363]

I'm sorry but this is just baloney.  For one, it's not a public toilet - it's a kitchen and a crime scene.  Police are present, assessing the situation (in the context of four murders and one suicide).  It has nothing to do with Justice making a snap judgement about whether or not he would use a particular toilet.  Secondly, a telephone isn't a toilet.

Roch, all that was used was an example of how we read things, it was no snap judgement but a similar phrasing, it's always better when you read the real Mcoy, you might be right what your saying but it can be read differently and I want to see the transcript for myself.

[guest2181]

6 August 2002 Stokenchurch investigation. Room 101 Trenchard House. DS 21 Stanley Jones speaking to DCI Jeannette McDiarmid about the kitchen telephone.

Jones) “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

Every known photograph of the ivory coloured kitchen phone, including those on this website, shows the phone in pristine condition. What could Jones have meant by "the state of it"? Blood all over it?

Where is this actually taken from?

[guest2181]

Where is this actually taken from?

Context is king.

For all we know they are discussing a pay phone in the police canteen.

[Caroline]

I'm sorry but this is just baloney.  For one, it's not a public toilet - it's a kitchen and a crime scene.  Police are present, assessing the situation (in the context of four murders and one suicide).  It has nothing to do with Justice making a snap judgement about whether or not he would use a particular toilet.  Secondly, a telephone isn't a toilet.

As is the assumption that this statement means he was referring to blood “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

I used an analogy as did Justice, it doesn't have to be a toilet - if a house is dirty, I would use the phone either.

[Caroline]

Context is king.

For all we know they are discussing a pay phone in the police canteen.

Good point! I wish people would post references when they make claims.

[guest2181]

Where is this actually taken from?

Trenchard House was basic Metropolitan police accommodation. The building stopped being used in 1999, was sold off in 2004 and converted by 2016 by Barratts in to plush apartments.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/brizzlebornandbred/5856698546

Seems to be awfully quiet on the source of the quote, but could it be that the phone in the communal kitchen of Trenchard house was the subject of discussion reminiscing the past?   

[Roch]

It's funny how sources of quotes takes on an importance when it suits. I remember the allegation document from about six or seven years ago. It was extensively referenced. A fact which Hartley remained very aloof about. You cant have it both ways.

[Caroline]

It's funny how sources of quotes takes on an importance when it suits. I remember the allegation document from about six or seven years ago. It was extensively referenced. A fact which Hartley remained very aloof about. You cant have it both ways.

When it suits? If I make a claim, I reference it. Anyone can claim anything if they don't reference it or take something out of context - and it happens - frequently here. Perhaps Hartley just didn't think it was important enough to comment? It is certainly a stretch of the imagination to go from someone saying they wouldn't use a particular phone, to suggesting it was because it was covered in blood.

[Jane]

6 August 2002 Stokenchurch investigation. Room 101 Trenchard House. DS 21 Stanley Jones speaking to DCI Jeannette McDiarmid about the kitchen telephone.

Jones) “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

Every known photograph of the ivory coloured kitchen phone, including those on this website, shows the phone in pristine condition. What could Jones have meant by "the state of it"? Blood all over it?

It sounds as if he was referring to the state of the kitchen. If i was hearing him say it, I'd expect to hear ".......................THAT kitchen, the state of it................" meaning the kitchen was an unhygienic tip.

[Roch]

Roch, all that was used was an example of how we read things, it was no snap judgement but a similar phrasing, it's always better when you read the real Mcoy, you might be right what your saying but it can be read differently and I want to see the transcript for myself.

Yes, I am aware that Caroline was speaking metaphorically.  However, if police were already physically in the kitchen, the analogy Caroline provided doesn't work for me.

[guest7363]

Jones) “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

He seems to enforce the word "THAT kitchen" to me meaning, the kitchen is a mess, if it was just the phone it would have been said "I can't even see anybody using the kitchen phone" the state of it?

[guest2181]

Jones) “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

He seems to enforce the word "THAT kitchen" to me meaning, the kitchen is a mess, if it was just the phone it would have been said "I can't even see anybody using the kitchen phone" the state of it?

Also to say:

"There’s no way I want to use that phone"

Suggests he wants to use a phone. Which is a bit odd. 

[guest7363]

Also to say:

"There’s no way I want to use that phone"

Suggests he wants to use a phone. Which is a bit odd. 

Its like you say, until you see the full context you can read different ways into it?

[lookout]

What was it that Gandhi once said ? " It's easy to stand with the crowd.It takes courage to stand alone "