Author Topic: Police V family  (Read 25731 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Jane

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 33773
Re: Police V family
« Reply #75 on: May 06, 2017, 11:12:AM »
“All I can remember now was David and Anthony talking to them and I do remember the police saying, “Now do you believe Sheila could have done it?” “Anthony or David or both agreed (in front of Jones) there and then that perhaps Sheila could have been capable of carrying out the shootings.”

14th Aug '91.  COLP.

The relatives were told information by police regarding how / why Sheila was the killer.  They couldn't accept this information beause of the financial implications involved.

From day one there was both phyisical and circumstantial evidence that Sheila was the killer.  It probably could have been accessed for every single review of the case that there has ever been - if police bothered to look for it hard enough.  Many of the police officers who were interviewed in these reviews also knew of its' existence. 

You have to try and understand how the authorities are in a difficult position here.  This does not look good for the British justice system.  It really is 'political'.

I have tried to explain how I think the relatives will blame police as a last ditch attempt at self preservation.  A final throw of the dice.  It wouldn't suprise me if they all attempted to blame DCI Jones.  How ironic would that be?  Beyond the grave, DCI Jones who wouldn't back down and didn't agree with Jeremy being framed - takes the blame for the wrongful conviction - because the relatives can get away with saying evidence wasn't disclosed to them and conveniently, they cant remember which evidence about Sheila was disclosed to them at the outset.

Please forgive the observation, Roch, but prior to it being revealed that much of what you say has come from the CT, it had occurred to me that you were starting to speak with the fervency of a newly converted cult member. It bought to mind something I did about cults when I was at college, namely that the newly converted to -well, anything one can name, really,- are always more strident and emphatic in their beliefs than those bought up with them.

Offline Adam

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 44310
Re: Police V family
« Reply #76 on: May 06, 2017, 11:12:AM »
A poor relationship with his mum doesn't mean they hated each other , he didn't understand her religious mania there's a difference, where's the witness statements to say they hated each other? That's not true

And Mary mugford couldn't exactly go in the witness box and undermine her daughter could she? Why was she even called as a witness all hearsay again, you can't go into a court and spout he said she said evidence otherwise it would only take the word of one person to go down for murder, much like what happened here, do you think if Julie hadn't of said what she did he'd of been convicted?, taking her testimony and that of her mother out of the equation completely?? No

Bamber's court testimony: Where he agrees with MM.

                                           ----------

He said he was experienced with guns. And had no difficulty using the murder weapon.

Sheila had limited experience with guns. 

There were fostering conversations on the night. Sheila was silent and not paying attention.

He denied cycling to WHF to commit the massacre.

He had been unfair in using Julie for emotional support and bringing her to WHF on the massacre morning.

His relationship with June was poor. They would antagonise each other. There was a lack of understanding.

When his phone was answered 'it was dad'. Jeremy started crying.

He said the call to Chelmsford police station lasted 5 minutes.

He said he rang Julie at 3am for 'a friendly ear'.

He drove so slowly to WHF as he did not want to arrive  before the police.

He said he knew how to get in and out of the bathroom window at WHF.

He said he saw Sheila punch the twins. Once.

He robbed the caravan site to show security problems. But admitted he should not have spent the money. He did so out of greed.

He agreed with Mary Mugfords testimony about his poor relationship with June.

He said James Richards and everyone lied about him. Because of the way the media had portrayed him.

He liked the good things in life. And had read the wills which tied him to the farm to inherit.

He should not have left the gun lying around and it would have taken seconds to put away. He had been 'lackadaisical' saying 'I didn't know what was going to happen, did I ?'.

Accused of lying he said 'that is what you have to establish'.

As more pressure was put on, his answers became shorter - don't know, can't pin myself, I can't answer.

It did not enter his head to dial 999.

The relationship with Julie had been in decline since Xmas 84. He had been unfaithful before, which Julie knew about. He ended the relationship in a restaraunt.

He had spent freely after the massacre and drank champagne on the funeral evening.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2017, 11:15:AM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline lookout

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 48670
Re: Police V family
« Reply #77 on: May 06, 2017, 11:14:AM »
 I spent freely and drank champagne after my husband died.Is it a hanging offence ??

Offline Jane

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 33773
Re: Police V family
« Reply #78 on: May 06, 2017, 11:15:AM »



Will that be Coarse,Cause or Course ???

Apologies. COURSE. Strange how, whilst you're quick -smug?- enough to point out others' errors, you're rather more reticent to recognize your own. ^-^

Offline Jane

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 33773
Re: Police V family
« Reply #79 on: May 06, 2017, 11:16:AM »
I spent freely and drank champagne after my husband died.Is it a hanging offence ??

Why MUST you bring YOU into it at every opportunity. It's as if you think you and Jeremy have something in common.

Offline lookout

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 48670
Re: Police V family
« Reply #80 on: May 06, 2017, 11:17:AM »
Didn't DB say that he'd " spent it ?" Or words to that effect ?

Offline JackiePreece

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4743
Re: Police V family
« Reply #81 on: May 06, 2017, 11:18:AM »
I wasn't talking about members of the public. People don't generally want to incarcerate an innocent man - even police officers and certainly not on the say so of greedy relatives.  Sure I can accept that he was fitted up because everyone thought he was guilty but NOT when they had evidence to the contrary.

You keep saying that David and Anthony were persuaded by Jones that Sheila could have been responsible but haven't posted anything to back that up. It was also early days and I am sure even the relatives weren't sure what was what. When they found out more details, they realised it couldn't have been Sheila.

On you third point, so what? They thought he was guilty Taff didn't - I wouldn't be happy to let a 5 times murderer get away with it either. Had their back door investigation come to nothing - no harm done. But why should they investigate behind Taff's back if there was evidence of Sheila being guilty. Surely they would know they were wasting their time?

Early retirement? I wouldn't say that was a motive.

People can get cocky but unless they're a complete psychopath, they generally don't take away someone's freedom i the full knowledge that they innocent.

It wouldn't matter how much the relatives knew of Sheila's illness if they had been shown evidence of her guilt.
[/b][/color]

Absolutely ridiculous post
There have been numerous cases of police putting innocent people in prison
It is absolutely clear in this case how much the relatives would gain financially if Jeremy was held responsible for the murders
« Last Edit: May 06, 2017, 11:52:AM by JackiePreece »
"No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle" Winston Churchill

Offline susan

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 16196
Re: Police V family
« Reply #82 on: May 06, 2017, 11:24:AM »
I spent freely and drank champagne after my husband died.Is it a hanging offence ??

Hi lookout
I understand the point you are making we all act differently in times of sadness.

Offline lookout

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 48670
Re: Police V family
« Reply #83 on: May 06, 2017, 11:25:AM »
Why MUST you bring YOU into it at every opportunity. It's as if you think you and Jeremy have something in common.





It's NOT a case of bringing just ME into it. What's been said by Adam is what MOST members of the public do NOT just Jeremy. ::) ::) I have NOTHING in common with Jeremy whatsoever,how ridiculous.
As if spending and drinking champagne has anything to do with the case  ::) It's irrelevant---again !!

Offline Lucy522

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 805
Re: Police V family
« Reply #84 on: May 06, 2017, 11:26:AM »
He lived on a farm and had shooting experience no surprise there and no need to lie

Sheila grew up on the farm and was privy to being around weapons her whole life

You said the fostering conversation was a lie

I don't think Jeremy did ride the bike there there is no evidence to prove this

Why was it unfair? If my family had been murdered I'd want my husband/partner there for emotional support

A lack of understanding generally doesn't lead to mass murder of one's family

The call probably did they were taking notes and organising a car

He rang Julie because perhaps he was unsure of what course of action to take and was panicking

He didn't want to arrive before the police as he didn't know what he was walking into and was probably scared

He knew how to get in and out of a window at a house he grew up in , irrelevant! I know how to get in and out of my parents house

I wouldn't be surprised if Sheila punched one of the twins, colin said it wasn't unusual for her to not even talk to them

He robbed the caravan site because he was greedy, I'll let you have that one, greed and murder are 2 very different things

A poor relationship and wanting to murder someone is not the same

He did like good things in life he was an arrogant immature spoilt 24 year old man, again that doesn't make him a murderer

Yes he left the gun out, even more careless no one put it away with 2 small children in the house after he left

The whole point of a trial is to establish the truth

He didn't call 999 as was unsure as to what was happening and they were a private family and didn't like outsiders involved

If Julie's self worth was so low she stayed with him after knowing all that, that's her problem not his

He spent money like he did on his house etc

And drank alcohol at a wake? God forbid!!! He must be guilty!

Offline JackiePreece

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4743
Re: Police V family
« Reply #85 on: May 06, 2017, 11:27:AM »
Jane June and Jeremy didn't not speak at all, if that were the case I'm sure it would of been brought up they ignored each other,

There's something in one of his statements and a book about the bike and how he got it because June didn't get on with it, and if June hated Julie so much why was she allowed into their home at Christmas time?

Lucy, if that were true Barbara Wilson would have known and said
"No hour of life is wasted that is spent in the saddle" Winston Churchill

Offline Lucy522

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 805
Re: Police V family
« Reply #86 on: May 06, 2017, 11:29:AM »
Lucy, if that were true Barbara Wilson would have known and said
Exactly

Offline Adam

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 44310
Re: Police V family
« Reply #87 on: May 06, 2017, 11:31:AM »
He lived on a farm and had shooting experience no surprise there and no need to lie

Sheila grew up on the farm and was privy to being around weapons her whole life

You said the fostering conversation was a lie

I don't think Jeremy did ride the bike there there is no evidence to prove this

Why was it unfair? If my family had been murdered I'd want my husband/partner there for emotional support

A lack of understanding generally doesn't lead to mass murder of one's family

The call probably did they were taking notes and organising a car

He rang Julie because perhaps he was unsure of what course of action to take and was panicking

He didn't want to arrive before the police as he didn't know what he was walking into and was probably scared

He knew how to get in and out of a window at a house he grew up in , irrelevant! I know how to get in and out of my parents house

I wouldn't be surprised if Sheila punched one of the twins, colin said it wasn't unusual for her to not even talk to them

He robbed the caravan site because he was greedy, I'll let you have that one, greed and murder are 2 very different things

A poor relationship and wanting to murder someone is not the same

He did like good things in life he was an arrogant immature spoilt 24 year old man, again that doesn't make him a murderer

Yes he left the gun out, even more careless no one put it away with 2 small children in the house after he left

The whole point of a trial is to establish the truth

He didn't call 999 as was unsure as to what was happening and they were a private family and didn't like outsiders involved

If Julie's self worth was so low she stayed with him after knowing all that, that's her problem not his

He spent money like he did on his house etc

And drank alcohol at a wake? God forbid!!! He must be guilty!

You're going to make excuses for everything which shows Bamber is guilty. Although you can't explain how Sheila committed the massacre.

Bamber's court testimony was posted by me as he agrees with MM. After you accused her of lying.
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Jane

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 33773
Re: Police V family
« Reply #88 on: May 06, 2017, 11:32:AM »




It's NOT a case of bringing just ME into it. What's been said by Adam is what MOST members of the public do NOT just Jeremy. ::) ::) I have NOTHING in common with Jeremy whatsoever,how ridiculous.
As if spending and drinking champagne has anything to do with the case  ::) It's irrelevant---again !!

But I didn't actually say that spending money and drinking champagne DID have anything to do with the case, although I not that it's another instance in which his and your actions coincide. I simply said that, when a point is raised -usually about Jeremy- you seek to justify it by saying you've done similar. NONE of this is about what you -or ANY of us, for that matter- would have done. It's all -and ONLY- about Jeremy.

Offline lookout

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 48670
Re: Police V family
« Reply #89 on: May 06, 2017, 11:32:AM »
He lived on a farm and had shooting experience no surprise there and no need to lie

Sheila grew up on the farm and was privy to being around weapons her whole life

You said the fostering conversation was a lie

I don't think Jeremy did ride the bike there there is no evidence to prove this

Why was it unfair? If my family had been murdered I'd want my husband/partner there for emotional support

A lack of understanding generally doesn't lead to mass murder of one's family

The call probably did they were taking notes and organising a car

He rang Julie because perhaps he was unsure of what course of action to take and was panicking

He didn't want to arrive before the police as he didn't know what he was walking into and was probably scared

He knew how to get in and out of a window at a house he grew up in , irrelevant! I know how to get in and out of my parents house

I wouldn't be surprised if Sheila punched one of the twins, colin said it wasn't unusual for her to not even talk to them

He robbed the caravan site because he was greedy, I'll let you have that one, greed and murder are 2 very different things

A poor relationship and wanting to murder someone is not the same

He did like good things in life he was an arrogant immature spoilt 24 year old man, again that doesn't make him a murderer

Yes he left the gun out, even more careless no one put it away with 2 small children in the house after he left

The whole point of a trial is to establish the truth

He didn't call 999 as was unsure as to what was happening and they were a private family and didn't like outsiders involved

If Julie's self worth was so low she stayed with him after knowing all that, that's her problem not his

He spent money like he did on his house etc

And drank alcohol at a wake? God forbid!!! He must be guilty!






Champagne to boot too,tut tut  ::)-------in his Boss suit,with hair dyed,flour on his face ( for effect,you see ) and not forgetting his dilated pupils.