Murders at White House Farm by Carol Ann Lee.

[Adam]

Well if he'd got another mag from somewhere, he could have loaded them up before hand hence instead of having to run downstairs? or have the loose rounds in his pocket?

Completely hypothetical of course.

How do you believe Sheila committed the massacre ?

Please include one/two phone calls from Nevill, two rifle reloads and a kitchen fight.

[Adam]

Not with 22 he won't, only head shots count a body shot will just bleed you to death over minutes, for an instant kill you'd go for a pump action shotgun.

I know. Bamber went for head shots. Shooting June in the throat and head and Nevill in the jaw upstairs, before Nevill moved.

He was expecting clear head shots. Everyone was asleep. It was 2am.

[Scales]

How do you believe Sheila committed the massacre ?

Please include one/two phone calls from Nevill, two rifle reloads and a kitchen fight.

Okay, IMO, Shelia had a psychotic breakdown killed her children first without the silencer, then that commotion woke her parents, she met Neville coming out of his bedroom she shot him in the body, he then rushed downstairs (possibly to use the phone) meantime shelia went into the parents room shot her mother dead, then went down stairs where a violent scuffle began, ultimately killing her father, then she went upstairs and shot herself, its hardly out of the question?. Perhaps NB was already down stairs who knows I don't.

But the silencer imo was not on the rifle at any time

[Caroline]

But she has not told anyone according to the book what he told her.

Given her opinions of Jeremy, it wasn't about Sheila.

[maggie]

Okay, IMO, Shelia had a psychotic breakdown killed her children first without the silencer, then that commotion woke her parents, she met Neville coming out of his bedroom she shot him in the body, he then rushed downstairs (possibly to use the phone) meantime shelia went into the parents room shot her mother dead, then went down stairs where a violent scuffle began, ultimately killing her father, then she went upstairs and shot herself, its hardly out of the question?. Perhaps NB was already down stairs who knows I don't.

But the silencer imo was not on the rifle at any time

Hi Scales, I cannot believe that NB would have left Sheila upstairs after she had shot him while he ran to the phone leaving June and the boys in proven real danger. 

It would have made more sense for him to grab a gun than the phone. What would be the point of him phoning Jeremy after Sheila had already shot him once? 

Why would he want to put Jeremy in danger as well?

I would have thought if things were as desperate as you say he would have phoned 999 if he phoned anyone.

[Caroline]

Okay, IMO, Shelia had a psychotic breakdown killed her children first without the silencer, then that commotion woke her parents, she met Neville coming out of his bedroom she shot him in the body, he then rushed downstairs (possibly to use the phone) meantime shelia went into the parents room shot her mother dead, then went down stairs where a violent scuffle began, ultimately killing her father, then she went upstairs and shot herself, its hardly out of the question?. Perhaps NB was already down stairs who knows I don't.

But the silencer imo was not on the rifle at any time

Sheila was taking medication for her PS and described by her psychiatrist as 'over seated'.

[Jane]

Okay, IMO, Shelia had a psychotic breakdown killed her children first without the silencer, then that commotion woke her parents, she met Neville coming out of his bedroom she shot him in the body, he then rushed downstairs (possibly to use the phone) meantime shelia went into the parents room shot her mother dead, then went down stairs where a violent scuffle began, ultimately killing her father, then she went upstairs and shot herself, its hardly out of the question?. Perhaps NB was already down stairs who knows I don't.

But the silencer imo was not on the rifle at any time

Please explain how she managed to shoot herself twice when the first bullet smashed two vertebrae. Moving her head/adjusting her arms/fixing the rifle in place/stretching to pull the trigger for the second shot -and probably with her mouth cavity filling with blood- with a wound which although wasn't instantly fatal, was certainly mortal? Hmm!

[Adam]

Okay, IMO, Shelia had a psychotic breakdown killed her children first without the silencer, then that commotion woke her parents, she met Neville coming out of his bedroom she shot him in the body, he then rushed downstairs (possibly to use the phone) meantime shelia went into the parents room shot her mother dead, then went down stairs where a violent scuffle began, ultimately killing her father, then she went upstairs and shot herself, its hardly out of the question?. Perhaps NB was already down stairs who knows I don't.

But the silencer imo was not on the rifle at any time

Thanks.

So Sheila woke out of the blue at 3am  Had a breakdown without any provecation and shot her sleeping sons.

Nevill woke and was shot in the body. He didn't tackle Sheila. But went downstairs to.....phone Bamber which would take several minutes.

While Nevill was on the phone waiting for Bamber to answer, Sheila shot and killed June with the remaining 4 bullets. Although June was shot 8 times.

You say June was woken from Sheila shooting her sons, although she was shot in bed with her head on the pillow. Suggesting she wasn't.

Sheila then went downstairs and brutally beat Nevill and knocked him out, although he had only been shot in the body. Sheila did not have a mark on her from this fight. 

The evidence is that Nevill was shot 4 times upstairs before going downstairs. And was unable to speak after these shots as two were face shots. 

As you have not mentioned the police, I assume you don't believe Nevill phoned the police 16 minutes after phoning Bamber ?

[Scales]

Given her opinions of Jeremy, it wasn't about Sheila.

Which makes it all the more unusual.

[Jane]

Which makes it all the more unusual.

What is all the more unusual?

[susan]

Hi Scales, I cannot believe that NB would have left Sheila upstairs after she had shot him while he ran to the phone leaving June and the boys in proven real danger. 

It would have made more sense for him to grab a gun than the phone. What would be the point of him phoning Jeremy after Sheila had already shot him once? 

Why would he want to put Jeremy in danger as well?

I would have thought if things were as desperate as you say he would have phoned 999 if he phoned anyone.

Hi Maggie I agree if he phoned anyone it would have been 999

[Scales]

Thanks.

So Sheila woke out of the blue at 3am  Had a breakdown without any provecation and shot her sleeping sons.

Nevill woke and was shot in the body. He didn't tackle Sheila. But went downstairs to.....phone Bamber which would take several minutes.

You say June was now awake although she was shot in bed with her head on the pillow.

Sheila then went downstairs and brutally beat Nevill and knocked him out, although he had been just been shot in the body. Sheila did not have a mark on her from this fight. 

The evidence is that Nevill was shot 4 times upstairs before going downstairs. And was unable to speak after these shots. 

As you have not mentioned the police, I assume you don't believe Nevill phoned the police 16 minutes after phoning Bamber ?

I was reading a case toady of a 28 year old woman with mental health issues that burned down her fathers house while he was in it.

You say NB did not tackle shelia upstairs why did he not tackle Jeremy then?

I don't recall bamber having any injuries either afterwards.

NB injuries could just as well have been dashed out afterwards, also that unexplained burn mark on his back, that was quite possibly some sort of ritual post mortem torture.

I also think that if the family was asleep they would have been awake VERY quickly once the shooting began.

Lastly that bible, I mean that speaks volumns, her Psychiatric doctor even said that had he read that at the time in would have changed his mind as to her mind, I mean Bamber would have to have been truly brilliant assassin to think of these things and avoid all these potential pitfalls.

As I say I don't know if he is guilty and I don't feel good besmirching the dead but having read the book its hard to know where the truth really lays.

[lookout]

According to one of the firearms team,once inside WHF,he told BT to close down the open line which had been used for a 999 call-----so said BT.
It's written on one of the wireless logs which can be seen in the archives.

[Adam]

I was reading a case toady of a 28 year old woman with mental health issues that burned down her fathers house while he was in it.

You say NB did not tackle shelia upstairs why did he not tackle Jeremy then?

I don't recall bamber having any injuries either afterwards.

NB injuries could just as well have been dashed out afterwards, also that unexplained burn mark on his back, that was quite possibly some sort of ritual post mortem torture.

I also think that if the family was asleep they would have been awake VERY quickly once the shooting began.

Lastly that bible, I mean that speaks volumns, her Psychiatric doctor even said that had he read that at the time in would have changed his mind as to her mind, I mean Bamber would have to have been truly brilliant assassin to think of these things and avoid all these potential pitfalls.

As I say I don't know if he is guilty and I don't feel good besmirching the dead but having read the book its hard to know where the truth really lays.

Nevill didn't tackle Bamber because a man was shooting bullets in his face.

Bamber didn't have a mark on him because he was padded up. And fighting Nevill who had been shot 4 times. Bamber wasn't tested for a long time.

Why would Sheila give Nevill black eyes, a broken nose and bruises on the arms, head and neck afterwards ?

There is a thread on Nevill's burn marks. Bamber was checking for signs of life.

Why would the family wake if Bamber used a silencer ? The rifle would be impossible to hear behind closed doors.

There is also a thread on the bible. It was part of Bamber staging the scene.

You need to find another scenario as you're one did not match the crime scene. But thanks for trying. A lot of supporters never have. My scenario of how Bamber did it is available upon request.

[Jane]

I was reading a case toady of a 28 year old woman with mental health issues that burned down her fathers house while he was in it.

You say NB did not tackle shelia upstairs why did he not tackle Jeremy then?

I don't recall bamber having any injuries either afterwards.

NB injuries could just as well have been dashed out afterwards, also that unexplained burn mark on his back, that was quite possibly some sort of ritual post mortem torture.

I also think that if the family was asleep they would have been awake VERY quickly once the shooting began.

Lastly that bible, I mean that speaks volumns, her Psychiatric doctor even said that had he read that at the time in would have changed his mind as to her mind, I mean Bamber would have to have been truly brilliant assassin to think of these things and avoid all these potential pitfalls.

As I say I don't know if he is guilty and I don't feel good besmirching the dead but having read the book its hard to know where the truth really lays.

Why would they have looked for injuries on Jeremy? He's told them Sheila was the culprit. He was standing outside with the police.

Whilst every case involving the mentally ill may have similarities, the psychological uniqueness of each makes them ENTIRELY different.

It's highly likely that the burn marks had nothing to do with the crime since no one has given an adequate reason for how they could have occurred.

It's possible to make much of what's in the bible relate to whatever one wants to relate it to, which was probably how June used it.