Dr Craig

[Kaldin]

Dr Craig was the police doctor who came to the farm to look at the bodies and certify their deaths. According to the Appeal document, Dr Craig arrived at 8.10, although I've read elsewhere that he arrived at 8.41 and another report says he arrived after 8.25.

The appeal document says this at para 38:

At 8.10 a.m., Dr Craig attended the scene to formally certify the deaths. In cross-examination at the trial he said the deaths could have occurred at any time during the previous night.

So he said that the deaths could have occurred at any time during the night. He didn't say that Sheila died later than the others or anything.

I understand that part of the new appeal will be this business about Sheila's blood being quite fresh and still "flowing". Would Dr Craig not have noticed that at the time?

[bb2010]

As I mentioned in the other post, we don't have comparative pictures. And in that thread someone told me that other pictures wouldn't help because we wouldn't know when they were taken or what order they were in. So only having one photo & not knowing what time that was taken, or what order that was in, I will exclude having an opinion on pictures of Sheila.

I will side with the doctor when he or she said that the deaths could have occurred at any time the previous night.

[Kaldin]

As I mentioned in the other post, we don't have comparative pictures. And in that thread someone told me that other pictures wouldn't help because we wouldn't know when they were taken or what order they were in. So only having on photo & not knowing what time that was taken, or what order that was in, I will exclude having an opinion on pictures of Sheila.

I will side with the doctor when he or she said that the deaths could have occurred at any time the previous night.

I understand that, but Dr Craig didn't need pictures, he could see the bodies for himself.

I have no idea what a body would look like after 5 hours or so, but I wouldn't expect blood to be flowing. I can't tell from the photo if the blood was flowing, but others seem to think it was.

Did he comment on rigor mortis at all? As I understand it, that starts a few hours after death.

[Alex]

It would be interesting to know exactly what Dr Craig observed.  But as I understand it, he was not asked to take body temperatures - i.e. he was not asked to ascertain the time of death for anyone.  Perhaps that was normal in a case where the presumed killer was believed to have committed suicide.  I can't tell from the photo whether the blood had recently been flowing either - it does appear to be somewhat wet, and very red - but the blood from her mouth and eyes appears darker.

[Kaldin]

It would be interesting to know exactly what Dr Craig observed.  But as I understand it, he was not asked to take body temperatures - i.e. he was not asked to ascertain the time of death for anyone.  Perhaps that was normal in a case where the presumed killer was believed to have committed suicide.  I can't tell from the photo whether the blood had recently been flowing either - it does appear to be somewhat wet, and very red - but the blood from her mouth and eyes appears darker.

I like your posts - you think of the same things that I do. I'm also not sure if the blood was flowing although it does kind of look that way, but I'm not an expert. One of the police officers said it was "trickling" but he could have meant that it had trickled. Dr Craig would surely have known though when he looked at the body.

[mike tesko]

Dr Craig was the police doctor who came to the farm to look at the bodies and certify their deaths. According to the Appeal document, Dr Craig arrived at 8.10, although I've read elsewhere that he arrived at 8.41 and another report says he arrived after 8.25.

The appeal document says this at para 38:
 

So he said that the deaths could have occurred at any time during the night. He didn't say that Sheila died later than the others or anything.

I understand that part of the new appeal will be this business about Sheila's blood being quite fresh and still "flowing". Would Dr Craig not have noticed that at the time?

I think I have stumbled upon some extraordinary here, since according to the evidence Dr Craig was escorted around the farmhouse by Inspector Miller, but Miller did not arrive at the scene according to the police logs he did not arrive at the scene until 9.16am...

[mike tesko]

I think I have stumbled upon some extraordinary here, since according to the evidence Dr Craig was escorted around the farmhouse by Inspector Miller, but Miller did not arrive at the scene according to the police logs he did not arrive at the scene until 9.16am...

This is exciting, since I happen to know that Sheila was not shot and killed by a round fired from the anshuzt rifle from the first floor window until 9.13am. So, if Craig was shown around the farmhouse by Miller, as mentioned in their witness statements, it must have happened later than 8.44am, it must have happened after 9.16am, with the arrival at the scene of Inspector Miller...

[mike tesko]

My god, this evidence has been there all along, Dr Craig and PI Miller, moved the time Craig verified Sheila's death from after 9.16am, to a time beforehand of 8.44am...

Now, that is a significant discovery!!!

Why would the police surgeon Dr Craig, and Inspector Miller tamper with the time Craig verified Sheila Caffells death?

I have a feeling there is now going to be another blessed police investigation into this matter...

I knew that Ewen Smith was onto something big when he went to see Dr Craig before he became a CCRC Commissioner. Ewen told me in confidence during one of my visits to his Birmingham Office, that when he saw Sheila's body originally she only had one bullet wound in her neck. All becomes clear now, because Craig must have visited Sheila's body twice, once when she only had one bullet wound to her neck (at 8.44am), and on a second occasion after 9.16am when he was accompanied by Miller by which time there were two bullet wounds on her neck...

The time her death was verified, was altered from after 9.16am, to 8.44am, because the shooting incident cops have been trying to cover up with use of the loaded rifle from the window, based on the findings of the pathologist (that the second shot under the chin killed her) meant that cops killed her, she did not kill herself, and Jeremy Bamber had not shot and killed her...

[Steve_uk]

This is exciting, since I happen to know that Sheila was not shot and killed by a round fired from the anshuzt rifle from the first floor window until 9.13am. So, if Craig was shown around the farmhouse by Miller, as mentioned in their witness statements, it must have happened later than 8.44am, it must have happened after 9.16am, with the arrival at the scene of Inspector Miller...

According to PC Saxby Craig appeared at their car window shortly after 8am. Is it not possible Craig went inside the house before Miller arrived, pronounced the five as dead, came out and was then later shown round the Farm by Miller?

[Adam]

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,6739.msg308871.html#msg308871

There is already a thread on Sheila's neck wound.

[lookout]

So ?

[lookout]

This thread was started in 2011 before you appeared so who's usurping who ?

Because you didn't start the thread is no reason to dismiss it,which is what you clearly do when you
 (1 ) didn't start the thread yourself,or
 (2 ) when you have no answer to anyone else's thread.

[Adam]

This thread was started in 2011 before you appeared so who's usurping who ?

Because you didn't start the thread is no reason to dismiss it,which is what you clearly do when you
 (1 ) didn't start the thread yourself,or
 (2 ) when you have no answer to anyone else's thread.

Lookout, lovely to hear from you.

There has been a very interesting post from a fellow supporter, stating how Sheila committed the massacre. I have posted my thoughts on this.

I look forward to yours and everyone else's opinions.

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7966.0.html

[mike tesko]

Dr Craig was the police doctor who came to the farm to look at the bodies and certify their deaths. According to the Appeal document, Dr Craig arrived at 8.10, although I've read elsewhere that he arrived at 8.41 and another report says he arrived after 8.25.

The appeal document says this at para 38:
 

So he said that the deaths could have occurred at any time during the night. He didn't say that Sheila died later than the others or anything.

I understand that part of the new appeal will be this business about Sheila's blood being quite fresh and still "flowing". Would Dr Craig not have noticed that at the time?

Not if by that stage (8.44am) Sheila had only been shot once which was the case

[Stephanie]

Not if by that stage (8.44am) Sheila had only been shot once which was the case

Hi Mike,

Hope you are keeping well.

How is it that you can come up with so many theories in relation to Jeremy's case but that in 32 years years, he's come up with very little, if anything?

Surely you would think if he is genuinely concerned about clearing his name he would have been the one to have done all what you have, and some? But he hasn't. Why not?

Why is it that he appears to have everyone else do the work for him and he appears to do nothing; other than bake cakes, help other prisoners read and write to his supporters?

Why is it that he lets everyone else do everything for him?

When you met Jeremy in prison, what was he like? I mean, what was he really like? What sort of things was he interested in? What did he talk about?

How would you describe Jeremy? Warts and all. What are his good points and what are his bad points?

How long did you know him for and how often did you speak to him in prison? Why do you think he turned on you like he did?