When the enquiry changed from a suicide to murder did the relatives have alibis?

[Alias]

Any normal person would absolutely hate Julie mugford for her involvement in the murder

Why don't they?

What makes you think that they don't? Enlighten me please.

Lets be clear about this, Muggy wasn't involved as Jackie likes to put it but by alleging such she has just admitted that Jeremy did murder his family.

Nice own goal Jacks!   

Yes I saw that.  There's a wood around here somewhere but I can't see it because of all these god damn trees!!!

Jackie was plaing on your own prejudices there. She wasn't admitting that Jeremy had committed the murders. She was saying that if the relatives believed that Jeremy had committed the murders then why did they not act accordingly with Julie Mugford and make sure she was done as well for accessory after the fact. As far as I can see that is all Jackie is saying here.

But she came forward and that's what makes the difference.

So a person will be let off a serious crime if they dob someone else in. Is that how the police work John?

Yes it is unfortunately. There are many innocent people imprisoned because of this practice.

[John]

Jackie was plaing on your own prejudices there. She wasn't admitting that Jeremy had committed the murders.

Yes I know, that's why I responded somewhat flippantly.

She was saying that if the relatives believed that Jeremy had committed the murders then why did they not act accordingly with Julie Mugford and make sure she was done as well for accessory after the fact. As far as I can see that is all Jackie is saying here.

I have no idea, I wasn't there.

But let's just, for the sake of discussion only, say that JM was telling the truth, she had asked JB several times after the murders if it was him, he said no.
So before and after the murders JM was not sure, she perhaps put JB's previous comments down to him being a bit fantastical, story telling.
Then afterwards she started having more doubts, not wanting to believe that the man she loved was capable of such an act she didn't act on her doubts.
As time passed the doubts increased, then others (them pesky, greedy good for nothing relatives) started to consider JB was responsible, the doubts increased further and she went to the police.
(Yes I know there's other bits in there about being jilted etc.)

If something like the above occurred, then perhaps the relatives would be grateful towards JM rather than going hammer and tongs to get her banged up as well. After all she was also the star witness and ultimately her statements were responsible in part for allowing EP to charge JB and then secure conviction against him. Something the relatives were clearly happy about as they were convinced he was responsible.

So why would they hate her?
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This isn't black and white and just because somebody doesn't think or act the way  in which you would expect, it doesn't mean that the assumptions that you make and the conclusions you draw are the only realistic possibility.

Likewise you could apply that to JB and some of his actions, but that's why were all here discussing the case and going round in circles.

I agree with your analysis of Muggy's position, I think she honestly thought he was making it all up as some sort of bravo.

[chochokeira]

Jackie got her knickers in a twist again as usual.  How can I answer your silly questions when I am away?

In any event I asked the question as to who fits the bill as a psychotic cold blooded murderer.  I believe Julie Mugford and 10 good men and women have already answered that one!   

What about the other two? One more and he would have been aquitted under British law. Anyway, how do you know they were men?

Actually no it wouldn't, 9-3 would have still convicted in this case.

"If just one of the ten jurors had wavered, Bamber would have walked away a free man."

Andrew Hunter MP

[grahameb]

In my opinion in any murder trial it should be a unanimous decision by the jury. But unfortunatel it isn't.

[John]

Jackie got her knickers in a twist again as usual.  How can I answer your silly questions when I am away?

In any event I asked the question as to who fits the bill as a psychotic cold blooded murderer.  I believe Julie Mugford and 10 good men and women have already answered that one!   

What about the other two? One more and he would have been aquitted under British law. Anyway, how do you know they were men?

Actually no it wouldn't, 9-3 would have still convicted in this case.

"If just one of the ten jurors had wavered, Bamber would have walked away a free man."

Andrew Hunter MP

Pure semantics yet again....point is, they didn't waver.

Had they though, it would have been a retrial just like Siôn Jenkins' case.

[chochokeira]

Hartley you are backing yourself into a corner again and you will soon have to run away again with your tail between your legs like you did a few weeks ago.

I don't believe Julie mucked was telling the truth about knowing about the murders and that is why the relatives didn't push to have her charged not an own goal at all

If mugford was telling the truth the relatives would have gone to any lengths to have had her charged


John you are a liar

Answer my 2 questions

Jackie  +1
John      0

[John]

Hartley you are backing yourself into a corner again and you will soon have to run away again with your tail between your legs like you did a few weeks ago.

I don't believe Julie mucked was telling the truth about knowing about the murders and that is why the relatives didn't push to have her charged not an own goal at all

If mugford was telling the truth the relatives would have gone to any lengths to have had her charged


John you are a liar

Answer my 2 questions

Jackie  +1
John      0

So childish Keira!   

ps name calling won't promote your lost cause one iota!

[chochokeira]

Some people on here are as thick as the relatives shouldn't someone on here point out to the relatives that it's not a good thing protecting and being friends with someone who had knowledge of the murders

People might think they colluded together in getting Jeremy convicted

Hartley a bit of good news for you to pass on to your friends the relatives and everyone at the queens head there is going to be a leaflet drop in the area saying 'let's Get Jeremy Bamber back home where he belongs'
(I designed them) there is going to be a yellow ribbon around all the trees and posters on every available space.  It's a mammoth task so it gets in all the newspapers you can help if you want.

It will be like Christmas morning when you wake up your village will be well and truly back in the headlines so everyone is up to date on the hidden PII find about relatives finances

More publicity is a good idea Hartley so everyone knows what's going on

I can't see them lasting two minutes Jackie given the strength of hate in the village.

When were you last in Tolleshunt D'Arcy, John...if ever?

[Hartley]

"If just one of the ten jurors had wavered, Bamber would have walked away a free man."

Andrew Hunter MP

He may well have said that, but unfortunately it is not the case.

In a Crown Court case if the jury are unable to reach a unanimous or majority verdict in a case which involves significant public interest then there is an assumption in law that the prosecution will seek a re-trial.

Hunters statement is premature.

[John]

Colchester is the nearest I have been, what about you?

[Hartley]

"If just one of the ten jurors had wavered, Bamber would have walked away a free man."

Andrew Hunter MP

He may well have said that, but unfortunately it is not the case.

In a Crown Court case if the jury are unable to reach a unanimous or majority verdict in a case which involves significant public interest then there is an assumption in law that the prosecution will seek a re-trial.

Hunters statement is premature.

In fact reading up a bit more, if a retrial took place and a majority verdict failed a second time, it is even conceivable that the prosecution would seek a second retrial.

[chochokeira]

Colchester is the nearest I have been, what about you?

I've posted here photographs of D'Arcy and Goldhanger taken over many years, does that give you a clue?

[Jackiepreece]

Chochokeira I don't think we are dealing with a normal person here and I don't think he ever really reads the posts or he wouldn't keep posting his lies and fantasies.

I do question if he is even safe to be around such hate and venom for someone he doesn't even know god knows what he's capable of

Imagine if JB was released he might try to harm him

It's a real worry

[ngb1066]

"If just one of the ten jurors had wavered, Bamber would have walked away a free man."

Andrew Hunter MP

He may well have said that, but unfortunately it is not the case.

In a Crown Court case if the jury are unable to reach a unanimous or majority verdict in a case which involves significant public interest then there is an assumption in law that the prosecution will seek a re-trial.

Hunters statement is premature.

In fact reading up a bit more, if a retrial took place and a majority verdict failed a second time, it is even conceivable that the prosecution would seek a second retrial.

That is extremely unlikely.  The legal convention is that the prosecution agree that it is not in the public interest for there to be a third trial following two trials with a hung jury.

[clifford]

Chochokeira I don't think we are dealing with a normal person here and I don't think he ever really reads the posts or he wouldn't keep posting his lies and fantasies.

I do question if he is even safe to be around such hate and venom for someone he doesn't even know god knows what he's capable of

Imagine if JB was released he might try to harm him

It's a real worry

not a worry Jackie. He is an ex rozer, and does,nt like the shit thrown in his direction.