Aftermath, Where is the forensic evidence that Jeremy Bamber killed his family?

[lebaleb]

Your prerogative, of course. Depression is like a trough. Depending on where people are in it will define the depths of their depression. It can fall anywhere on a scale of 1 to 10. Those who rate a 10 won't be capable of raising enough energy to kill. Those around 6-8 are in a dangerous place. Those below that are less likely to be contemplating such actions but it's not set in stone and all depressives need support. I'm sorry about your sister in law.

With psychotics the depression gives way to a manic phase where the person has masses of energy. They can't sleep and will pace for hours ranting about some delusion that they may feel compelled, or forced by voices, to act upon.

[Jane]

With psychotics the depression gives way to a manic phase where the person has masses of energy. They can't sleep and will pace for hours ranting about some delusion that they may feel compelled, or forced by voices, to act upon.

Agreed. However, there's nothing to suggest -other than a belief in Jeremy's innocence- that Sheila suffered a psychotic episode. Saying she MAY have isn't proof that she did when there's nothing else to back it up.

[David1819]

Agreed. However, there's nothing to suggest -other than a belief in Jeremy's innocence- that Sheila suffered a psychotic episode. Saying she MAY have isn't proof that she did when there's nothing else to back it up.

The lack of Rigor Mortis and the absence of Lividity in Shelia make it impossible for JB to have killed her. He was in police custody at the time of her death.

[Jane]

The lack of Rigor Mortis and the absence of Lividity in Shelia make it impossible for JB to have killed her. He was in police custody at the time of her death.

You've said so, MANY times.

[Caroline]

The lack of Rigor Mortis and the absence of Lividity in Shelia make it impossible for JB to have killed her. He was in police custody at the time of her death.

She was n a state of lividity, that's why her face is discoloured and mottled. 

[lebaleb]

Agreed. However, there's nothing to suggest -other than a belief in Jeremy's innocence- that Sheila suffered a psychotic episode. Saying she MAY have isn't proof that she did when there's nothing else to back it up.

In CC's statement he says that Dr Furgusen told him Sheila would always have the illness at more frequent intervals. On the drive to WHF she didn't say a word. June told PB that she was worried about Sheila's behavior, taking no interest in the twins. She wasn't acting normally, she just answered yes or no and then left the phone without saying goodnight. She just sat vacantly at the kitchen table. In my experience I would say there was a high likelihood that Sheila would have a psychotic episode, all the warning signs were there. You can't say there is nothing to back it up.

[Caroline]

In CC's statement he says that Dr Furgusen told him Sheila would always have the illness at more frequent intervals. On the drive to WHF she didn't say a word. June told PB that she was worried about Sheila's behavior, taking no interest in the twins. She wasn't acting normally, she just answered yes or no and then left the phone without saying goodnight. She just sat vacantly at the kitchen table. In my experience I would say there was a high likelihood that Sheila would have a psychotic episode, all the warning signs were there. You can't say there is nothing to back it up.

She was acting withdrawn not in the throws of psychosis. She was taking anti psychotic medication, it was found in her system.

[lookout]

She was n a state of lividity, that's why her face is discoloured and mottled.

It's the poor quality of the pic.that gives that impression.

Saying that,if discolouration was evident,it would still only indicate that her death was no more than a couple of hours before she was found,as LM begins within 2 hours,and the more active prior to death the quicker the onset.

[Caroline]

It's the poor quality of the pic.that gives that impression.

Saying that,if discolouration was evident,it would still only indicate that her death was no more than a couple of hours before she was found,as LM begins within 2 hours,and the more active prior to death the quicker the onset.

It is NOT the poor quality of the picture at all. The pictures of Sheila is of a MUCH higher quality than the one of June which has a high red content. The discolouration on her face and mottled effect is consistent with lividity, however, the picture of June is less clear because of the blood all over her legs, the quality of the picture and the high red content. It doesn't prove that June was in a more pronounced state of lividity than Sheila but that won't stop a certain quarter making the suggestion.

[lookout]

It is NOT the poor quality of the picture at all. The pictures of Sheila is of a MUCH higher quality than the one of June which has a high red content. The discolouration on her face and mottled effect is consistent with lividity, however, the picture of June is less clear because of the blood all over her legs, the quality of the picture and the high red content. It doesn't prove that June was in a more pronounced state of lividity than Sheila but that won't stop a certain quarter making the suggestion.

As I'd said,lividity begins appx 2 hours after death,so work backwards with the time.

[lookout]

Discolouration would have been severely pronounced had it been 4 hours and beyond.

[lookout]

Even June hadn't looked particularly discoloured as though she'd been dead for hours. I'd imagine that if the three adults had been heavily discoloured,the doctor would then have estimated the times of death as it would then have been quite clear to him of the " stages ".

[Steve_uk]

Speaking of pictures why wasn't Andrew Hunter allowed to use the "full picture"?  http://www.essexchronicle.co.uk/spots-blood-proof-jeremy-bamber-s-innocence/story-19941411-detail/story.html

[Caroline]

As I'd said,lividity begins appx 2 hours after death,so work backwards with the time.

Why? I'm not going to pretend I know enough about working out the time of death from a picture. No one here is anywhere near qualified to make such bold statements. The fact is there is evidence of lividity on Sheila but from the picture of June, it is difficult to work out how much (if any), the marks on her legs are down to lividiy.

[Caroline]

Speaking of pictures why wasn't Andrew Hunter allowed to use the "full picture"?  http://www.essexchronicle.co.uk/spots-blood-proof-jeremy-bamber-s-innocence/story-19941411-detail/story.html

Why indeed and where did it originate?