What makes Bamber innocent?

[Jane]

Yes, but David has argued that Julie Mugford got the idea for the wetsuit from RB, however,  as we can now see, she was asked about it by police - nothing sinister at all.

But undoubtedly David will twist it out of shape until it becomes so!!!

[Caroline]

But undoubtedly David will twist it out of shape until it becomes so!!!

I think most people have the intelligence to see through such tactics?

[mike tesko]

Circumstantial evidence:

1:

Was there a motive for the relatives to frame Jeremy? - Yes, there was Several.

2:

Was there an opportunity for the relatives to frame Jeremy for the murders with the introduction of the bloodstained, paint contaminated silencers? - Yes. that is right, that's exactly what they did

3:

Was there an alibi Yes, Jeremy had a strong alibi, he was with the police at all times at the scene, when someone was still alive inside the farmhouse. Cops have yet to explain in their own way, how Sheila's body got from the kitchen downstairs after 7.38am, upstairs onto the bed by 8.30am, and how her body ended upon the bedroom floor by 9.14am?- No. That's right, police have not explained the movement of Sheila's body from downstairs to upstairs, from it being on the bed, then ends up on the bedroom floor?

4:

Did Bamber ring Julie before the police Er, Jeremy rang Julie, after he attempted to contact Witham police station, but before he contacted Chelmsford police station - Yes. study the facts, the correct answer is no and yes

5:

Have there been other inheritance killers Nothing to do with Jeremy, the only people who set out to benefit from the inheritance in this case were the relatives, and they succeeded - Yes. No

6:

Was there a way to WHF without being seen Was there a way to anywhere without being seen? It means nothing, and proves nothing. Sheila's accomplice could have arrived at whf unseen, so could one of the relatives, so could Peter Pan- Yes.

7:

Was a bike brought over just before the massacre incorrect, bike was borrowed for Julie Mugford to use- Yes. No

8:

Was there a way into WHF through a window Was there a key to the farmhouse door that the relatives admitted to knowing about which would have allowed one or more of them to enter whf through the door, rather than a window? Yes, such a key existed, and relatives admitted they had knowledge of it - Yes.

9:

Was there a way out and to lock a window from outside Relatives knew about this, but there was no sign of any of the glass or the wooden window frame being bloodstained as a result of anyone having climbed out of any window after the shootings. On the other hand, there was the sighting of the scruffy looking hunched man seen walking away from the farmhouse just before 5am (refer Kim Sengupta article)- Yes.

10:

Was 12pm - 2pm the perfect execution time Ralph was still alive at 3.26am when he made his call to Chelmsford police. Sheila did not die inside the bedroom upstairs until after armed police entered the building - Yes. No

11:

Was there a lethal weapon inside WHF There were several lethal weapons inside the farmhouse. Sheila's fingerprints were found on three such weapons, (a) the anshuzt rifle, (b) the 12 bore shotgun, and (c) the .22 BSA air rifle- Yes.

12:

Are there just two suspects incorrect, on the basis that there was Sheila, her accomplice, and the cop who was responsible for shooting Sheila dead in the bedroom - Yes. No

13:

Does the forensic evidence show it was not Sheila - Yes. The scientific and forensic evidence relied upon is open to question, and the pathologist, Peter Venezis was of the opinion that she could have killed herself. So, No, there is no such forensic evidence which ultimately excludes Sheila from being involved in the killing of the others, or herself

14:

Does the forensic evidence round the suspects to Jeremy Incorrect, there is no forensic or scientific evidence which proves that Jeremy had even fired one of the 25 shots used in the killings. Speculation is not evidence - Yes.

15:

Is a multiple frame attempt unprecedented untrue, there are many examples where a number of people have been involved in framing a person. Cops do it all the time, and the relatives certainly set out from day one to get their hands on the inheritance, and to put Jeremy in the frame - Yes. No

16:

Did Bamber have an opportunity to dispose of evidence Did the relatives, and the cops? Yes, of course they did. They even tampered with the silencer and the bullet cases to try to make it into a one gun crime...- Yes.

17:

Are there any reasons why Neville would call Jeremy was there any reason why Ralph should not call Jeremy. Afterall, at about 3.25am when Ralph called Jeremy he didn't hang about chatting away as people like you try to make out. It was a sharp, short phone call, then Ralph Called police immediately, at 3.26am. I think somebody in Ralphs position would call their son, and speak to them briefly before cutting the call short to enable them to call the police. Not only that, but as Jeremy pointed out once the call got terminated at his fathers end, Jeremy had tried to phone back but had got the engaged tone. He got the engaged tone at that time because Ralph had phoned the police (3.26am) immediately after managing to blurt out a few words alerting Jeremy to the developing situation- No. Yes

18:

Did Bamber have better options, random stranger etc Jeremy didn't need any options, because he played no role at all in the killing of the other four members of his family, and he certainly did not play a hand in his sisters death which took place at 9.14am, that morning in the bedroom upstairs - No.

19:

Would the WHF dogs prevent a massacre or attempt Since, Sheila and her accomplice were already inside whf when the shootings started, I can't see wow one dog inside the farmhouse could have made a difference in preventing the shooting of the original four victims - No.

20:

Did experts believe Sheila capable of such a murderous rage incorrect, since the pathologist, Peter Venezis thought that she could have killed herself, and Professor Knight, was of the same opinion  - No.

21:

Could Sheila have committed the massacre Yes, she was involved in the killing of the other four victims  - No. 

22:

Have there been several failed appeals that means nothing, it only takes there to be one successful one- Yes.

23:

Has anyone retracted or been proved to have lied Lots of them - No.

24:

Was 12 - 2pm the only time scale option for Bamber Yes, he was a sleep at home in his cottage at Head Street, Goldhanger, between these times - Yes.

25:

Did Bamber party and go on two holidays soon after the massacre Did the relatives celebrate when they got Bamber convicted? Did they party and throw gifts at the cops who investigated the case? Yes, they did  - Yes.

[mike tesko]

But undoubtedly David will twist it out of shape until it becomes so!!!

The wet suit played no part in the killings, there is no evidence that it did, or had - its all just speculation...

[Jane]

The wet suit played no part in the killings, there is no evidence that it did, or had - its all just speculation...

Such trivialities will mean nothing to David.

[Caroline]

The wet suit played no part in the killings, there is no evidence that it did, or had - its all just speculation...

I think most people agree with that.

[sami]

off hand what is the thinking behind the fact the wetsuit was not used.i wouldnt say its impossible ,and as jm said it seemed a bit odd for it to be in jb's room,it was very well planned by jb.anyone who's father has phoned them for HELP would never ring the police and ask to be PICKED UP,they would make their own way there as quickly as possible

[Jane]

off hand what is the thinking behind the fact the wetsuit was not used.i wouldnt say its impossible ,and as jm said it seemed a bit odd for it to be in jb's room,it was very well planned by jb.anyone who's father has phoned them for HELP would never ring the police and ask to be PICKED UP,they would make their own way there as quickly as possible

Sami, it has previously been suggested that Jeremy committed the crime disguised/protected by a wet/dry suit and riding a bike to WHF. He may have thought that by asking police to pick him up it would confirm that he'd been at home in Goldhanger and POSSIBLY why he dawdled in order to reach WHF after the police.

[David1819]

I distort things? And yet you're the master of the MISQUOTE! By the way, the reason why Julie noted down 'wetsuit' in her diary notes was because (as I told you!) she was ASKED ABOUT IT!

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4952.0;attach=34829

Caroline you KNOW and UNDERSTAND why Julie is not a credible witness yet you have made efforts to make her out to be a credible witness, That is very much distorting things.

The Mention of a wetsuit in her diary prove the police were asking her questions based on RBs theories. Theories that happen to make up allot of Mugford's testimony 

Your misrepresenting my arguments to make them easier to attack.  guess this one backfired on you.

Your agender is that you want to gain something from this - now, please tell me what mine would be or is such an accusation just more wind and pxss from you?

I have no agenda. But if you want to con people into thinking I have an agenda its not working.

I am not to sure what your agenda is, But your relentless efforts to try and portray JB as guilty despite having no evidence at all must me fuelled by something 

[David1819]

I think most people have the intelligence to see through such tactics?

Its your tactics that people are seeing through. How fortunate for you Jane don't seem to have a mind of her own 

[Jane]

Its your tactics that people are seeing through. How fortunate for you Jane don't seem to have a mind of her own 

OK, how's this for someone "who don't appear to have a mind of her own"? Not only do I think you're wrong, I think you've acted in the most abominably deceitful way since you started your crusade of self aggrandisement. So far, all you've managed to post are misrepresentations of what people have said in their statements, presuming to know better than they what they meant. Oh, and one more thing. Your grammar is appalling.

[sami]

OK, how's this for someone "who don't appear to have a mind of her own"? Not only do I think you're wrong, I think you've acted in the most abominably deceitful way since you started your crusade of self aggrandisement. So far, all you've managed to post are misrepresentations of what people have said in their statements, presuming to know better than they what they meant. Oh, and one more thing. Your grammar is appalling.

youve settled that once and for all jane,

[sami]

Sami, it has previously been suggested that Jeremy committed the crime disguised/protected by a wet/dry suit and riding a bike to WHF. He may have thought that by asking police to pick him up it would confirm that he'd been at home in Goldhanger and POSSIBLY why he dawdled in order to reach WHF after the police.

yes i will have to hold my hands up to the above jane,i was one of them that thought the above.until i realised just how absurd the idea was,riding to the farm in a wetsuit

[Jane]

yes i will have to hold my hands up to the above jane,i was one of them that thought the above.until i realised just how absurd the idea was,riding to the farm in a wetsuit

One only has to think about how tightly fitted is a wet suit to realize just how uncomfortable/impossible(?) it would be to ride a bike whilst wearing one. It MIGHT be said that he didn't want his family to know who was killing them. It may ALSO be said that, as he was going to kill them, why would he care if they saw him. Perfect revenge, perhaps?

[sami]

One only has to think about how tightly fitted is a wet suit to realize just how uncomfortable/impossible(?) it would be to ride a bike whilst wearing one. It MIGHT be said that he didn't want his family to know who was killing them. It may ALSO be said that, as he was going to kill them, why would he care if they saw him. Perfect revenge, perhaps?

yes ive often wondered if jb was wearing a mask.i also side with caroline's idea that he may have stayed the night at whf.sounds logical