Author Topic: What makes Bamber innocent?  (Read 348305 times)

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Offline lookout

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #60 on: April 24, 2016, 09:49:AM »
There is no doubt in my mind who murdered that family.

Sheila could NOT have delivered the second shot after she'd died from the first one.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 10:00:AM by lookout »

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #61 on: April 24, 2016, 09:50:AM »
For some reason, and we are not told why, or who decided to summon three ambulances at around 6 am to the scene, but surely this must have been in response to multiple shots being heard via the open telephone line situated in the kitchen...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #62 on: April 24, 2016, 09:51:AM »
For some reason, and we are not told why, or who decided to summon three ambulances at around 6 am to the scene, but surely this must have been in response to multiple shots being heard via the open telephone line situated in the kitchen...

Three shots, three ambulances...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #63 on: April 24, 2016, 09:52:AM »
Three shots, three ambulances...

Cops recovered three spent cartridge cases from the vicinity of the telephone handset off its cradle laid on the cupboard worktop. Is that just a coincidence?
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #64 on: April 24, 2016, 09:55:AM »
At one stage, when the operator was checking the line at the farmhouse, she reported that she could hear 'slight movement' and also the sound of a dog barking - this movement could have been dad, or Sheila moving around in the kitchen. It can't have been the dog 'Crispy' because the dog was upstairs in the main bedroom cowering under the bed. No, that movement was almost certainly confirmation that there was someone still alive inside the farmhouse at that particular time...
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 10:00:AM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #65 on: April 24, 2016, 10:00:AM »
At one stage, when the operator was checking the line at the farmhouse, she reported that she could hear 'slight movement' and also the sound of a dog barking - this movement could have been dad, or Sheila moving around in the kitchen. It can't have been the dog 'Crispy' because the dog was upstairs in the main bedroom cowering under the bed. No, that movement was almost certainly confirmation that there was someone still alive inside the farmhouse at that particular time...

Dead bodies don't 'move around' all by themselves...
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 10:01:AM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #66 on: April 24, 2016, 10:09:AM »
The reason cops did not try to enter the farmhouse before 7.30am, was because they were convinced that Sheila was alive somewhere inside the farmhouse in possession of the gun dad had told J about, and what dad himself had told cops about, linked to the sighting of the figure by Myall, Bews and J, and the operators report that she could hear 'slight movement' close to the telephone. One of the problems cops had was that they did not know whereabouts inside the farmhouse, the phone with its handset off the cradle was situated. Cops did not know until later that the phone in the kitchen was the phone via which the operator could hear 'slight movement'. It was only then that cops realised that the 'slight movement' which the operator had reported hearing could well have been a wounded and dying dad, or Sheila herself prowling around over her dads dying, or dead body...
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 10:11:AM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #67 on: April 24, 2016, 10:15:AM »
The reason cops did not try to enter the farmhouse before 7.30am, was because they were convinced that Sheila was alive somewhere inside the farmhouse in possession of the gun dad had told J about, and what dad himself had told cops about, linked to the sighting of the figure by Myall, Bews and J, and the operators report that she could hear 'slight movement' close to the telephone. One of the problems cops had was that they did not know whereabouts inside the farmhouse, the phone with its handset off the cradle was situated. Cops did not know until later that the phone in the kitchen was the phone via which the operator could hear 'slight movement'. It was only then that cops realised that the 'slight movement' which the operator had reported hearing could well have been a wounded and dying dad, or Sheila herself prowling around over her dads dying, or dead body...

Three things 'leap out of the file' which confirm to me why 'cops believed there were still people alive inside the farmhouse', right up until the point when 'the raid team went in'...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #68 on: April 24, 2016, 10:20:AM »
Three things 'leap out of the file' which confirm to me why 'cops believed there were still people alive inside the farmhouse', right up until the point when 'the raid team went in'...

(1) - report by the operator, that she could hear 'slight movement' close to the handset of the phone, wherever that was inside the farmhouse

(2) - three shots fired in close proximity to aforementioned phone, three spent cartridges cases found on top of kitchen table, and three ambulances summoned to attend the scene, arriving duly at 7am

(3) - the 'sudden appearance of the anshuzt rifle' at the upstairs bedroom window at 7.15am, where no such weapon had previously been visible, as referenced by WPC Julia Jeapes in her ' undisclosed' witness statement (not disclosed until after 2002)
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 10:23:AM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #69 on: April 24, 2016, 11:44:AM »
(1) - report by the operator, that she could hear 'slight movement' close to the handset of the phone, wherever that was inside the farmhouse

(2) - three shots fired in close proximity to aforementioned phone, three spent cartridges cases found on top of kitchen table, and three ambulances summoned to attend the scene, arriving duly at 7am

(3) - the 'sudden appearance of the anshuzt rifle' at the upstairs bedroom window at 7.15am, where no such weapon had previously been visible, as referenced by WPC Julia Jeapes in her ' undisclosed' witness statement (not disclosed until after 2002)

Add to this short list, the contents of the police message log entries,  7.37am, 7.38am,  7.42am and 8.10am, and also incorporate the message sent by a civilian employee at 7.45am, a female with the Christian name of 'Linda' to DS Davidson at home, requesting him to come on duty into the office because police were dealing with an incident at whf involving two bodies, a murder, and a suicide, and it suddenly becomes clear why cops and prosecution don't want to disclose anything that might open up a can of worms at the same time as helping to clear J's good name in the same process...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #70 on: April 24, 2016, 12:08:PM »
Another astounding fact was that DCI 'Taff' Jones, was not told that anyone had been found shot and killed until he arrived at the scene at around 9.05am. He thought he was attending a siege situation, with Sheila holding other members of her family as hostages - and remember this was about an hour after five dead bodies had supposedly been found, depending upon which of the two police scenarios you choose to accept, for example, two bodies downstairs by 7.38am, and a further three bodies upstairs by 8.10am, as opposed to the other version the officers were instructed to write their notes up with in mind, only one body downstairs, the other four bodies upstairs. How did the two bodies downstairs, three bodies upstairs, scenario, become a one body downstairs, four bodies upstairs one?

The answer to that is because there was a twist smack bang in the middle of the operation when it went 'pearshaped...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #71 on: April 24, 2016, 12:32:PM »
What becomes apparent is that cops were confronted with two bodies upon entry, but obviously one of these two bodies was mistakenly presumed to be dead when she wasn't. You can choose to believe whatever you like, but I must insist that what I am saying is true. We know by reference to the logs that one of these bodies was male, and that the other body was a female. It is therefore a relatively simple deduction to be able to say that at some stage immediately after the raid team entered the kitchen that they were first and foremost confronted by Ralph Bambers body, so that puts paid to the male body. Which leaves a female body. Now, there were only two female victims, June Bamber and Sheila Caffell. The female body referred to had to have been either, or one of these two. Notice that because the body of the male is reported / recorded in the message logs firstly, that there can be no room for the argument that PC Collins mistakenly thought the body which turned out to be Ralph, was the body of a female. No such mistake can be accounted for by referring to the contents of these police message logs, because discovery of the male body is clearly reported before there is any mention of the body of a female. The body of a dead female is mentioned 'after' the discovery of the body of a dead male. So, as I say no room for any mistake there made by PC Collins. Another point worth considering whilst dealing with the nonsense introduced primarily by PC Collins, is that he reports seeing what He thinks is the body of a dead female, from his vantage point of standing outside the kitchen window which is a key observation. He then claims that once he entered the kitchen he realised his mistake, because he says he realised that the body he thought was a dead female, was in fact a dead male. This explanation is at odds with the facts recorded in the police message logs, since PC Collins explanation relies on an observation from outside the kitchen window looking inward, and another observation once he enters the kitchen, whereas, the log contents refer to what was found once the cops got into the kitchen. PC Collins version of events do not match the version of events logged in the radio message logs. In the logs, there is mention of finding the body of one dead male, followed by the find of the body of one dead female, twice, as if the second reference to one dead male, one dead female, is a check to confirm that what has been reported in the log was true, and it was true. If there had been 'this mistake' as proffered by PC Collins, the error would have been 'corrected in the log', with the discovery of 'four bodies upstairs', but the relevant log entry timed at 8.10am, is emphatic - ' a further three bodies found upstairs, five dead in total'...
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 12:37:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #72 on: April 24, 2016, 12:41:PM »
We know that 'the details recorded in these police radio message logs' were 'relayed to the control room' by the 'occupants of CA07'. We know this because it states as much in the logs. Now, this in itself is very interesting, for a number of different as yet unexplored reasons, to which I shall now endeavour to address...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #73 on: April 24, 2016, 01:10:PM »
We know that 'the details recorded in these police radio message logs' were 'relayed to the control room' by the 'occupants of CA07'. We know this because it states as much in the logs. Now, this in itself is very interesting, for a number of different as yet unexplored reasons, to which I shall now endeavour to address...
Let's get the names of all the actors in this part of the script, so that everybody knows who's who, and who was where, and who did what?

Occupants of CA07, who were originally deployed to 'this' incident acting on information passed at 3.26am by the dad (Ralph Bamber ) to cops, were (1) the driver, PS Oliver Saxby, (2) PS Bews, and (3) PC Myall...

Linked to PS Oliver Saxby at the time these key police radio messages were being passed by CA07 was, none other than J.

Now, on the very many occasions I have had to interview, question, interrogate J about specific features of this case, he has never once said to me that he was inside the patrol car in the company of PS Oliver Saxby, when any of these 'key messages' were being passed by his call sign (CA07). This means that it was not Saxby who passed any of these messages. J does not know this because I have never told him, but it was PS Bews who was responsible for relaying the messages which he was listening into on a private frequency used by members of the raid team and their Commander, and simply relaying these messages using another radio on a different frequency to relay what he was overhearing, to the control room. Bews knows the truth about the two bodies which confronted the firearm officers as they first entered the kitchen. There was no mistaken identification of dads body, for the body of Sheila or June. Bews heard it correctly, two bodies, not one, and what's more, back in the control room staff confirmed that there had been two bodies, through listening in on the telephone eavesdrop. Bews, Myall and Saxby were all under that same call sign (CA07). For over 30 years, Bews and Myall have both been privy to 'the fact' that the raid team were 'confronted by Sheila' at the point of first entry into the kitchen. She was not the first body cops were confronted by, the first body was that of a dead male, one dead male, Ralph Bamber , or dad. Sheila was the second body which confronted the cops, she was the referenced 'the body of one dead female' after they shot her...

The conversations between Bews, Myall and Saxby, were muted for much of the remainder of that day until the debriefing, when PS Saxby brought to the attention of Senior officers the 'fact' that Jeremy had complained to him, that he thought the cops who had entered the farmhouse, had shot dead, not just Sheila, but everyone else, as well...
« Last Edit: April 24, 2016, 01:11:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Re: What makes Bamber innocent?
« Reply #74 on: April 24, 2016, 01:24:PM »
Bews is an integral part of the cover up regarding not only the 'sighting of the person at the upstairs bedroom window', but he was actively involved and responsible for relaying the message from the scene to the control room, regarding the 'presence of Sheila, downstairs in the kitchen' between 7.37am, and 8.10am...

Fact...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...