David1819 - forensic breakthrough claim

[Steve_uk]

For the reason that i have analysed her posts and it is obvious ...

Jeremy was 100% family was he not ? or do you in some way disagree with that ?

I do agree to use your words that the murders were the "grossest diablerie " imaginable ...

But at the present time i like 2 Jury members still have some doubt that it was in fact Jeremy that did it ...

In law he was yes, but out of his depth in bucolic employment measured by Nevill's farming genius which he could never hope to emulate, nor understand June's proselytization, which maybe he was right to discard. Eight years spent at Gresham's for no valid purpose in his mind other than to confer on him inheritance rights, which again by law were his, but over which he obsessed, evincing a superiority over his parents with the meagrest of natural talents.

Had Sheila been the killer there would be pity for her plight; as it is Jeremy is not insane but deceitful, as he sits in prison with an inexorable soul, after thirty years still unable to see how he has transgressed.

[sherlock]

I knew full well it would make no impact as so many baseless claims have been made before I don't blame anyone for not thinking much of it until now.

One reason I discussed with NGB was that by him revealing something the board it would somewhat revitalised the forum as all the discussions are stale and repetitive. Everyone now has something new to look forward to and its long overdue.

I know, My Dad knows, NGB knows, Andrew Hunter knows and Jeremy and his legal team probably know by now also.

My first issue was and thought this through carefully. I made this finding almost three weeks ago now. Although at the time I was 90% convinced I made a significant breakthrough and now I have no doubt about it.

At the time my mind was telling me maybe its too good to be true? and by thinking that I then worried that if I did go public and turns out I was wrong the Campaign team would without a doubt use it a propaganda and that I didn't want to happen, that was my initial reason for secrecy.

Then a few days later I was told that going public would harm the legal process because if the Crown got news of it they would have more time to try and prepare for it so the later the better. So that is reason why I have not released anything to date.

At the risk of repeating myself - your approach has been an excellent example to all of us ...

Instead of trying to point score with other members you have in fact been analysing the evidence with a fine tooth comb and an open mind ...

Very well done indeed - i salute you and your approach to this case !

[Steve_uk]

all the discussions are stale and repetitive.

I'm sure we're all waiting with bated breath.

[sherlock]

In law he was yes, but out of his depth in bucolic employment measured by Nevill's farming genius which he could never hope to emulate, nor understand June's proselytization, which maybe he was right to discard. Eight years spent at Gresham's for no valid purpose in his mind other than to confer on him inheritance rights, which again by law were his, but over which he obsessed, evincing a superiority over his parents with the meagrest of natural talents.

Had Sheila been the killer there would be pity for her plight; as it is Jeremy is not insane but deceitful, as he sits in prison with an inexorable soul, because after thirty years he still cannot see how he has transgressed.

Neville and June loved him incredibly and totally ...

He was 100% family ...

To suggest otherwise is mind boggling to the extreme ...

What on earth have his talents and abilities got to do with whether he was family or not ?

All i can say is i am extremely glad that you and i are not related !

If he is guilty then it is evil ...

As it would be if any member of any family committed such a crime ...

But how you can question the fact he was 100% family is way way beyond my understanding ...

Just a hunch but you sound like you come from not far from the farm with such way way out of touch attitudes about what real family is and is not ...

The only time in my life  i have heard of such outrageous attitudes towards family has in fact been from some of the players in this case which is why i assume you come from the same strange place ...

[Steve_uk]

Neville and June loved him incredibly and totally ...

He was 100% family ...

To suggest otherwise is mind boggling to the extreme ...

What on earth have his talents and abilities got to do with whether he was family or not ?

All i can say is i am extremely glad that you and i are not related !

If he is guilty then it is evil ...

As it would be if any member of any family committed such a crime ...

But how you can question the fact he was 100% family is way way beyond my understanding ...

Just a hunch but you sound like you come from not far from the farm with such way way out of touch attitudes about what real family is and is not ...

The only time in my life  i have heard of such outrageous attitudes towards family has in fact been from some of the players in this case which is why i assume you come from the same strange place ...

They did love him in their own way, but the profit motive always came first, which is why Jeremy was packed off to Gresham's in the first place so he would be a cut above people whom he would one day have to employ. After the death of his second sister Diana Nevill  became morose and his emotions were cloistered, which may explain Sheila starting private school in mid-term. Nevill never pulled rank with his children, yet this was only viewed as a sign of weakness and exploited by them both.

As for June, she became estranged from everyone save the local vicar as her religious mania took hold and the family was sundered as Jeremy refused the role to which his parents had assigned him.  Sheila for her part became more desperate as all her efforts proved ineffectual, and by the time the parents did try to rein in some of their children's behaviours the damage was irreparable.

[sherlock]

They did love him in their own way, but the profit motive always came first, which is why Jeremy was packed off to Gresham's in the first place so he would be a cut above people whom he would one day have to employ. After the death of his second sister Diana Nevill  became morose and his emotions were cloistered, which may explain Sheila starting private school in mid-term. Nevill never pulled rank with his children, yet this was only viewed as a sign of weakness and exploited by them both.

As for June, she became estranged with everyone save the local vicar as her religious mania took hold and the family was sundered as Jeremy refused the role to which his parents had assigned him.  Sheila for her part became more desperate as all her efforts proved ineffectual, and by the time the parents did try to rein in some of their children's behaviours the damage was irreparable.

Like so many post War families in Britain i am sure they were to some extent dysfunctional ...

Personally i blame the War and it's after effects for that ...

There were vast amounts of very damaged people in all strands of society after the War - it was a tough environment to grow up in in so many ways because of that ...

But they were 100% family - and Neville and June's deep love for their 2 children is in no doubt whatsoever in my mind ...

All over the world the big majority of people want their children to have the best possible education so as to give them the very best possible start in life ...

I do not accept that Neville (or June) sent them to boarding school for a "profit motive" however ...

Like most Parents they just wanted their very much loved children to have the very best possible start in life - for the children's benefit - not for the Parents benefit ...

Whether sending children to boarding school is actually a good idea on balance is another question - but i know for sure Nevile and June did it believing it to be the best thing for their very deeply loved children ...

Despite any faults they were 100% family ...

[Steve_uk]

Like so many post War families in Britain i am sure they were to some extent dysfunctional ...

Personally i blame the War and it's after effects for that ...

There were vast amounts of very damaged people in all strands of society after the War - it was a tough environment to grow up in in so many ways because of that ...

But they were 100% family - and Neville and June's deep love for their 2 children is in no doubt whatsoever in my mind ...

All over the world the big majority of people want their children to have the best possible education so as to give them the very best possible start in life ...

I do not accept that Neville (or June) sent them to boarding school for a "profit motive" however ...

Like most Parents they just wanted their very much loved children to have the very best possible start in life - for the children's benefit - not for the Parents benefit ...

Whether sending children to boarding school is actually a good idea on balance is another question - but i know for sure Nevile and June did it believing it to be the best thing for their very deeply loved children ...

But June was incapable of expressing this love, apart from on paper to be opened after her death, which was dismissed by Jeremy along with all her other missives and phylacteries dotted around the house. He did this because June had rejected Suzette, which Jeremy may or may not have believed was the stress which caused her miscarriages, and called his next girlfriend a harlot. She excoriated her daughter for indulging in extra-marital sex and chauffeured her to the abortion clinic, whilst in the forefront of Sheila's mind was the "Devil's child" remark which never left her. I don't know how much the war and the austerity of the post-war period shaped the older generation's values, neither do I know how much the children really did try to work, but my suspicion is that with never having been asked whether they would prefer state or private school and with very little praise forthcoming in any sphere they simply gave up trying to please their parents in any meaningful way.

[sherlock]

But June was incapable of expressing this love, apart from on paper to be opened after her death, which was dismissed by Jeremy along with all her other missives and phylacteries dotted around the house. He did this because June had rejected Suzette, which Jeremy may or may not have believed was the stress which caused her miscarriages, and called his next girlfriend a harlot. She excoriated her daughter for indulging in extra-marital sex and chauffeured her to the abortion clinic, whilst in the forefront of Sheila's mind was the "Devil's child" remark which never left her. I don't know how much the war and the austerity of the post-war period shaped the older generation's values, neither do I know how much the children really did try to work, but my suspicion is that with never having been asked whether they would prefer state or private school and with very little praise forthcoming in any sphere they simply gave up trying to please their parents in any meaningful way.

A verbal expression of love is really meaningless ...

Love is expressed by actions ...

Many people do not verbally express love ...

But they show it in 100's of small actions ...

Also many people verbally express love but do not show it in their actions ...

My opinion is that Neville and June like so many of their generation might not have verbally expressed their love ...

But i am sure they expressed it in 1000's of their actions ...

I am sure Sheila and Jeremy therefore felt very much loved as they grew up because of that ...

And i have no doubt they were very deeply loved by their parents indeed ...

[sherlock]

A verbal expression of love is really meaningless ...

Love is expressed by actions ...

Many people do not verbally express love ...

But they show it in 100's of small actions ...

Also many people verbally express love but do not show it in their actions ...

My opinion is that Neville and June like so many of their generation might not have verbally expressed their love ...

But i am sure they expressed it in 1000's of their actions ...

I am sure Sheila and Jeremy therefore felt very much loved as they grew up because of that ...

And i have no doubt they were very deeply loved by their parents indeed ...

My guess is that Sheila's mental problems were drug induced ...

June's mental problems i think stemmed from her conscience because of her War work ...

Possibly Neville's conscience remained troubled because of his Wartime experiences ...

I do not believe Jeremy had any mental problems at all ...

Just a slightly dysfunctional family to contend with ...

And i don't think that  was a great problem for him ...

He was still more than happy to be a part of that family ...

I believe he loved them ...

Did that love turn to hate near the end for some reason ? The Jury is still out on that one ...

[Adam]

Sorry Adam - i did not answer your question fully ...

The murderer would have burnt Nevilles back to force him to phone Jeremy ...

That's the theory ...

And it's actually the most likely explanation for the three burn marks on Neville's back ...

And it would explain why something similar was not done to June or Sheila ...

So Bamber lifted up Neville's pyjama top while he was still alive. And burnt his back three times to torture him. Was that after or before he had shot him four times upstairs  ?

Neville was slumped on a chair with his head over a coal scuttle. His back and pyjama top were easily accessible for Bamber. He was by the aga holding the rifle. It was also a good idea to make sure Neville was dead as he was a strong man. 

[Adam]

I knew full well it would make no impact as so many baseless claims have been made before I don't blame anyone for not thinking much of it until now.

One reason I discussed with NGB was that by him revealing something the board it would somewhat revitalised the forum as all the discussions are stale and repetitive. Everyone now has something new to look forward to and its long overdue.

I know, My Dad knows, NGB knows, Andrew Hunter knows and Jeremy and his legal team probably know by now also.

My first issue was and thought this through carefully. I made this finding almost three weeks ago now. Although at the time I was 90% convinced I made a significant breakthrough and now I have no doubt about it.

At the time my mind was telling me maybe its too good to be true? and by thinking that I then worried that if I did go public and turns out I was wrong the Campaign team would without a doubt use it a propaganda and that I didn't want to happen, that was my initial reason for secrecy.

Then a few days later I was told that going public would harm the legal process because if the Crown got news of it they would have more time to try and prepare for it so the later the better. So that is reason why I have not released anything to date.

How can you going to NGB and asking him to post on the forum that you're alleged discovery is well written 'revitalise the board' ? You've said you're not going to say what you're discovery is. So there is nothing to discuss.

How did you make this 'signigicant breakthrough', on you're own on you're computer ? Or have you got documents which are not online or in books ? How did you get these ? You're last discovery you said CAL stole, although it been already been discussed on this board and by Bob Woffinden.

Going public would not effect a CCRC submission because they would have 'more time to prepare'.The CCRC would be given Bamber's application weeks or months beforehand. Then spend weeks or months discussing it. So plenty of time for them. They will not take into account forum chat or media coverage. The CCRC are impartial.

Mike's always bringing up new things and has said he has a photo of a deceased Sheila on the bed, which has been passed to legal advisors. This will surely be included in a new CCRC submission.

[Neil]

I'm sure we're all waiting with bated breath.

I'm not. 

[JackiePreece]

I knew full well it would make no impact as so many baseless claims have been made before I don't blame anyone for not thinking much of it until now.

One reason I discussed with NGB was that by him revealing something the board it would somewhat revitalised the forum as all the discussions are stale and repetitive. Everyone now has something new to look forward to and its long overdue.

I know, My Dad knows, NGB knows, Andrew Hunter knows and Jeremy and his legal team probably know by now also.

My first issue was and thought this through carefully. I made this finding almost three weeks ago now. Although at the time I was 90% convinced I made a significant breakthrough and now I have no doubt about it.

At the time my mind was telling me maybe its too good to be true? and by thinking that I then worried that if I did go public and turns out I was wrong the Campaign team would without a doubt use it a propaganda and that I didn't want to happen, that was my initial reason for secrecy.

Then a few days later I was told that going public would harm the legal process because if the Crown got news of it they would have more time to try and prepare for it so the later the better. So that is reason why I have not released anything to date.

You handled this exactly right David and knew you could trust Ngb

He will be there for you with the right advice

[JackiePreece]

Classy, as always.

No well done David then for uncovering new evidence

[maggie]

Like so many post War families in Britain i am sure they were to some extent dysfunctional ...

Personally i blame the War and it's after effects for that ...

There were vast amounts of very damaged people in all strands of society after the War - it was a tough environment to grow up in in so many ways because of that ...

But they were 100% family - and Neville and June's deep love for their 2 children is in no doubt whatsoever in my mind ...

All over the world the big majority of people want their children to have the best possible education so as to give them the very best possible start in life ...

I do not accept that Neville (or June) sent them to boarding school for a "profit motive" however ...

Like most Parents they just wanted their very much loved children to have the very best possible start in life - for the children's benefit - not for the Parents benefit ...

Whether sending children to boarding school is actually a good idea on balance is another question - but i know for sure Nevile and June did it believing it to be the best thing for their very deeply loved children ...

Despite any faults they were 100% family ...

I do agree with you that many, many people were emotionally damaged by the war.  Many people in the armed forces and civilians suffered from unrecognised PTSD there can be no doubt about that. 

When we speak about June Bamber's mental health problems they may have developed due to her experiences during the war.  People were expected to just cope with their fear of dying, the deaths of many colleagues or friends and family and to keep going, all that buried grief, stress and anxiety take their toll sometimes not until any years later.