The 3am telephone call. What was said ?

[mike tesko]

FACT - if the control room clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes plus,  reading 03.36hrs, but with a true / correct time of 03.31hrs, the timing of Jeremys call to Mugford at around 03.30hrs, was still before that call to PC West, but after Jeremys earlier failed call (unanswered) he made to Witham police station, beforehand...

[mike tesko]

FACT - if the control room clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes plus,  reading 03.36hrs, but with a true / correct time of 03.31hrs, the timing of Jeremys call to Mugford at around 03.30hrs, was still before that call to PC West, but after Jeremys earlier failed call (unanswered) he made to Witham police station, beforehand...

HOLTBY - SMITHS evidence of the control room clock (03.36hrs) being inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus or minus, sufficiently establishes that the contents of Bonnets 03.26hrs log, cannot have been a reference to Jeremys call to PC West, relayed to Bonnet at, or prior to 03.26hrs, because the earliest time PC West could have contacted Bonnet, was after 03.31hrs, not beforehand...

[scipio_usmc]

No-one has suggested at any stage, that the information room clock was inaccurate, so we have to accept that the timing of Ralph Bambers Bonnet log (03.26hrs) either commenced, or concluded at precisely that (03.26hrs) time...

There is no such thing as a Ralph Bamber log just a log of Jeremy's call to West and log of West's to to Bonnett.  The notion Nevill called police is entirely fictional.

[mike tesko]

Contrary to what the guilty mob would have us believe, both versions of the PC West (control room clock) log, timed at 03.36hrs, and the Bonnet (information room clock) log, timed at 03.26hrs, were not physically disclosed,  only debate about PC West having misread the control room clock which read 03.36hrs, but it was 03.26hrs. This is all very well and good, but imagine for one moment, that the contents of both logs had been subject of evidence in chief, and cross examination, with all the distinct differences involved, from one to the other, like daughter, sister, etc, and then PC HOLTBY - SMITH testifies, with his claim that at best the control room clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus, or minus - it casts a huge shadow over the testimony of PC West, and Bonnet...

[scipio_usmc]

Contrary to what the guilty mob would have us believe, both versions of the PC West (control room clock) log, timed at 03.36hrs, and the Bonnet (information room clock) log, timed at 03.26hrs, were not physically disclosed,  only debate about PC West having misread the control room clock which read 03.36hrs, but it was 03.26hrs. This is all very well and good, but imagine for one moment, that the contents of both logs had been subject of evidence in chief, and cross examination, with all the distinct differences involved, from one to the other, like daughter, sister, etc, and then PC HOLTBY - SMITH testifies, with his claim that at best the control room clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus, or minus - it casts a huge shadow over the testimony of PC West, and Bonnet...

Both logs were in the master index of court exhibits meaning the defense and prosecution saw both.  Bonnett's log was submitted into evidence while West read form his log while on the witness stand.  Your lies are a waste of time. 

[mike tesko]

There is no such thing as a Ralph Bamber log just a log of Jeremy's call to West and log of West's to to Bonnett.  The notion Nevill called police is entirely fictional.

No, it is not. The 03.26hrs log contents could not possibly have been a reference in any terms to Jeremys call to PC West at 03.36hrs (03.31hrs), by a reliance upon the withheld statement of PC HOLTBY - SMITH, who states that the control room click was inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus, or minus. PC West could not have called Malcolm BONNET at 03.26hrs to speak to him about Jeremys call, because Jeremys call had not yet been made to or received by PC West until at the very earliest 03.31hrs, by a reliance upon PC HOLTBY - SMITH's evidence...

[mike tesko]

Both logs were in the master index of court exhibits meaning the defense and prosecution saw both.  Bonnett's log was submitted into evidence while West read form his log while on the witness stand.  Your lies are a waste of time.

Your account cannot be true, otherwise there wiuld have been cross examination by Mr Rivlin, QC, regardung tge different terms recorded in each of the two different logs. That issue aside, the evidence that PC HOLTBY - SMITH could have off loaded into the equation regarding the accuracy or otherwise of the control room clock by 5 minutes, plus, or minus, would hace been sufficient enough to expose the ploy being adopted by both West and Bonnet, to merge the two totally separate logs becoming merged as the same one, as nothing but a dishonest scam designed to hood wink the jury into dismissing evidence favourable to the defence case...

[scipio_usmc]

No, it is not. The 03.26hrs log contents could not possibly have been a reference in any terms to Jeremys call to PC West at 03.36hrs (03.31hrs), by a reliance upon the withheld statement of PC HOLTBY - SMITH, who states that the control room click was inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus, or minus. PC West could not have called Malcolm BONNET at 03.26hrs to speak to him about Jeremys call, because Jeremys call had not yet been made to or received by PC West until at the very earliest 03.31hrs, by a reliance upon PC HOLTBY - SMITH's evidence...

Jeremy phoned West between 3:20-3:23
West phoned Bonnett 3:26
West made an error in writing 3:36 as the time of Jeremy's call to him.  He either a) meant to write 3:26 but accidentally wrote 3:36; b) forgot to write the time till after he got off the phone with Jeremy and wrote the time the call ended - 3:36 ; or c) forgot to write down the time until well later then tried to guess the time Jeremy called and guessed it was 3:36.

Bonnett's log is from West's call to him.

[mike tesko]

Jeremy phoned West between 3:20-3:23
West phoned Bonnett 3:26
West made an error in writing 3:36 as the time of Jeremy's call to him.  He either a) meant to write 3:26 but accidentally wrote 3:36; b) forgot to write the time till after he got off the phone with Jeremy and wrote the time the call ended - 3:36 ; or c) forgot to write down the time until well later then tried to guess the time Jeremy called and guessed it was 3:36.

Bonnett's log is from West's call to him.

you were not a witness who testified in this particular matter, nor someone who could have possibly testified. You cannot alter the facts spoken about, or that were eventually relied upon. West and Bonnet were key witnesses, so was PC HOLTBY - SMITH, although the police and the prosecution deliberately withheld the contents of his statement, so that the defence were never in a favourable position to challenge what West and Bonnet were claiming at trial. HOLTBY - SMITH's testimony was not available to them at the time of the trial in 1986, but is available now.  This  new evidence if presented properly is capable of helping to establish that Ralph Bamber had indeed contacted the police, independently of Jeremy Bamber, himself, despite the prosecution arguing during the trial that Ralph Bamber would have contacted the police himself, it appears that was exactly what he had done, and did...

[scipio_usmc]

you were not a witness who testified in this particular matter, nor someone who could have possibly testified. You cannot alter the facts spoken about, or that were eventually relied upon. West and Bonnet were key witnesses, so was PC HOLTBY - SMITH, although the police and the prosecution deliberately withheld the contents of his statement, so that the defence were never in a favourable position to challenge what West and Bonnet were claiming at trial. HOLTBY - SMITH's testimony was not available to them at the time of the trial in 1986, but is available now.  This  new evidence if presented properly is capable of helping to establish that Ralph Bamber had indeed contacted the police, independently of Jeremy Bamber, himself, despite the prosecution arguing during the trial that Ralph Bamber would have contacted the police himself, it appears that was exactly what he had done, and did...

You are trying to alter West and Bonnett's words not me. West said he spoke to Jeremy then place dhim on hold and phoned Bonnett.  Bonnett said West phoned him to report Jeremy's call.  Jeremy confirms he was placed on hold so West could call Bonnett.

If Nevill called Bonnett then he would have dispatched police and told them of Nevill's call and they would have gone there to meet Nevill.  Bonnett would have told West who would have told Jeremy that police were already dispatched because Nevill phoned the police already and he would neither have asked Jeremy to go meet police nor have phoned the telephone company to have them check Nevill's line.  He would have let Bonnett and the police Bonnett sent handle it.  The only reason West stayed involved was because he fielded the initial call.

   

[mike tesko]

You are trying to alter West and Bonnett's words not me. Their words are lies, because of the way the clocks were set in (a) the control room , and (b) the information room, and the independent evidence that PC HOLTBY -SMITH can now provide regarding the fact that the control room clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus, or minus, what was proposed during the testimony of West and Bonnet, could not possibly be true, establishing beyond doubt that the contents of the Bonnet log must be a record of what Ralph Bamber spoke to the police about, some 5 minutes or so before the earliest opportunity Jeremy had to contact PC West at 03.31hrs, as a result of the control room clock being inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus. The control room clock which showed the time as 03.36hrs, was inaccurate by 5 minutes, so the true time was 03.31hrs, not 03.26hrs. Since there was not and is no suggestion that the information room clock was not always accurate, Bonnets timing of the Ralph Bamber call, took place exactly 5 minutes prior to the earliest possible time that Jeremy could have made his call to PC West at 03.31hrs. If PC West spoke to Bonnet at all prior to 03.31hrs, then the topic of conversation could not possibly have had anything at all with what Jeremy could have told West later, because Jeremy did not speak to PC West until at the very earliest until 03.31hrs, so West could not have relayed what Jeremy would have told him about at 03.31hrs, to Bonnet at 03.26hrs, because at that stage Jeremy had not yet made the call to PC West. The upshot of all this, is that Bonnets 03.26hrs log must be a true record of what Ralph Bamber told the police about at 03.26hrs, nobody else could be in the frame for making that 03.26hrs call, other than Ralph Bamber, himself. If Ralph made that call as he almost certainly did, then what better ground could Jeremy Bamber hope for, to prove once and for all, that he did not kill anybody... West said he spoke to Jeremy then place dhim on hold and phoned Bonnett. He may have done so, after Jeremys call to him at 03.31hrs at the earliest, but West did certainly not contact Malcolm Bonnet about anything Jeremy could have told him, at 03.26hrs, because West did not know that Jeremy would be calling him later, or be able to guess what Jeremy might want to talk to him about...  Bonnett said West phoned him to report Jeremy's call. That could be true, but he could not have done that prior to 03.31hrs... Jeremy confirms he was placed on hold so West could call Bonnett. as I say that could be true, but he duid not put Jeremy on hold anytime prior to 03.31hrs...

If Nevill called Bonnett then he would have dispatched police he did...and told them of Nevill's call he probably did, unless Bonnet despatched them in response to the attack alarm being activated at the scene at 03.29am...and they would have gone there to meet Nevill. not necessarily, since en route to the scene, the officers could have been updated about the later call received from Jeremy Bamber at 03.31hrs, which concerned the same matter, as reported by Ralph Bamber as per the 03.26hrs log contents, and in response to the attack alarm activated at 03.29hrs...  Bonnett would have told West who would have told Jeremy that police were already dispatched PC West did inform Jeremy to go directly to the farmhouse where he would be met by police officers who had already been despatched to the farmhouse... because Nevill phoned the police already yes...and he would neither have asked Jeremy to go meet police But, West did ask Jeremy to go directly to the police, nor have phoned the telephone company to have them check Nevill's line. But West did, because Ralph was no longer communicating directly with the police, but this may have been as a result of the attack alarm overriding the line once it got activated...  He would have let Bonnett who would? and the police Bonnett sent handle it. Police who arrived at the scene did handle it, in one form or another... The only reason West stayed involved was because he fielded the initial call. If that be true, and he fielded the original call to enable him as it were, to contact Bonnet in the information room, then Ralph contacted PC West, before Jeremy did, and West spoke to Bonnet about Ralphs call (03.26hrs), the activation of the attack alarm (03.29hrs), and Jeremys call (03.31hrs)...

 

[scipio_usmc]

Their words are lies,

So you now admit you are the one ignoring their words not me.

because of the way the clocks were set in (a) the control room , and (b) the information room, and the independent evidence that PC HOLTBY -SMITH can now provide regarding the fact that the control room clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus, or minus, what was proposed during the testimony of West and Bonnet, could not possibly be true, establishing beyond doubt that the contents of the Bonnet log must be a record of what Ralph Bamber spoke to the police about, some 6 minutes or so before the earliest opportunity Jeremy had to contact PC West at 03.31hrs, as a result of the control room clock being inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus. The control room clock which showed the time as 03.36hrs, was inaccurate by 5 minutes, so the true time was 03.31hrs, not 03.26hrs. Since there was and is no suggestion that the information room clock was always accurate, Bonnets timing of the Ralph Bamber call, took place exactly 5 minutes prior to the earliest possible time that Jeremy could have made his call to PC West at 03.31hrs. If PC West spoke to Bonbett at all prior to 03.31hrs, then the topic of conversation could not possibly have had anything at all with what Jeremy could have told West later, because Jeremy did not speak to PC West until at the very earliest until 03.31hrs, so West could not have relayed what Jeremy would have told him about at 03.31hrs, to Bonbett at 03.26hrs, because at that stage Jeremy had not yet made the call to PC West. The upshot of all this, is that Bonnets 03.26hrs log must be a true record of what Ralph Bamber told the police about at 03.26hrs, nobody else could be in the frame for making that 03.26hrs call, other than, Ralph Bamber, himself. If Ralph made that call as he almost certainly did, then what better ground could Jeremy Bamber hope for, to prove once and for all, that he did not kill anybody...

You have constructed accusations of Bonnett and west lying out of thin air around nothing. 

None of the babble you keep posting refutes that one of the following scenarios happened.

West made an error in writing 3:36 as the time of Jeremy's call to him.  He either a) meant to write 3:26 but accidentally wrote 3:36; b) forgot to write the time till after he got off the phone with Jeremy and wrote the time the call ended - 3:36 ; or c) forgot to write down the time until well later then tried to guess the time Jeremy called and guessed it was 3:36.

[mike tesko]

So you now admit you are the one ignoring their words not me. What your saying they said, simply cannot be true because the control room clock was not inaccurate by 10 minutes, plus, or minus, it was only inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus or minus, as per HOLTBY - SMITHS fresh evidence...


You have constructed accusations of Bonnett and west lying out of thin air around nothing. No, by reference to the known, established facts involving the true time kept by the information room clock, and the fact that the control room clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus or minus, resulting in what West and Bonnet have said being exposed as a deliberate lie, introduced to try and portray the call made by Ralph Bamber to police at 03.26hrs, as the same call made to police by Jeremy Bamber at 03.31hrs, when it could not possibly be true for all the reasons given previously...

None of the babble TRUE FACTS...you keep posting refutes that one of the following scenarios happened.

West made an error in writing 3:36 as the time of Jeremy's call to him. He did not, he recorded the time that the control room clock was reading (03.36hrs), albeit that clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes plus, or minus. The actual time of Jeremys call was 03.31hrs, so in that respect, yes he technically recorded the wrong time (03,36hrs ), because the coreect time was 5 minutes sooner... He either a) meant to write 3:26 03.31 hrs.. but accidentally wrote 3:36 he wrote it because that was the time being shown by the control room clock at that time..; b) forgot to write the time till after he got off the phone with Jeremy and wrote the time the call ended - 3:36 no, he did not, you cannot say he recorded the time (03.36hrs) at the end of Jeremys call to him, police almost always record events in logs and statements by reference to the time such an event happened or was occurring, why would the circumstances of this case be any different to any other police matter? ; or c) forgot to write down the time until well later then tried to guess the time Jeremy called and guessed it was 3:36. No...

[mike tesko]

They expect us to believe that PC West mistook this time on the control room clock (03.36hrs) , for this time on the control room clock (03.26hrs):-

[mike tesko]

The control room clock was inaccurate by 5 minutes, plus or minus, so the correct time was actually 03.31hrs - when Jeremy Bamber made his call to PC West...