The 3am telephone call. What was said ?

[Jane]

Pc West  said in court "I was informed I actually spoke to the Information Room at a time prior to the one that I have recorded, so I can only assume that I have wrote — I actually recorded the wrong time, as it were." followed by "Well, there is a dispute over the times. I don't know whose time is right and whose time is wrong." He clearly stated he doesn't know that his time was incorrect (even though he'd had over a year to think it over).

Please explain your assessment, "The guy said he could have made a mistake, which is good enough for me." How would such a remark come across in a jury room?

As being a damn sight more human than an arrogant -RUDE- Hooray Henry looking down his nose and telling counsel words to the effect of "That is for you to prove."

[scipio_usmc]

The dark side? Seriously? Are you that much of a follower?

No I was wrong but then I was never comfortable arguing in favour of the phone call. However, I have no problem admitting I was wrong. I don't have ANY doubt that the phone call from Nevill was made up as an alibi. Jeremy made a big thing about leaving WHF, making sure Len Folkes knew he was leaving and driving away like a maniac so his car was heard. He was arrogant to believe that he wouldn't be a suspect and just didn't think it through.

There was an episode of Columbo on TV yesterday, the guys alibi plan was very similar - he tried using a phone call to hoodwink everyone into thinking he was elsewhere when the victim died. I think Columbo said it best when he said "You thought you'd concocted the perfect alibi - ironic that it's 'that' that's going to hang you". (Columbo - Exercise in Fatality).

I actually remember that episode because I like Robert Conrad.  He was embezzling money so killed his partner. He staged it too look like an accident and later staged a phone call from the dead man to make it appear he was still alive and had not died until after making the phone call. Conveniently Robert Conrad was with witnesses when the phone call came so he had an alibi. When it was proved that this call was faked it sunk him because it proved he knew his partner was already dead and that the fake call was done to present a false alibi.

It actually is very comparable. 

[Reader]

As being a damn sight more human . . .

Had Pc West seemed less human, it would have been less clear. He had put 03:26 (which would probably have been wrong anyway, as that was the time that Bonnett logged for the consequent call) in his statement of 9th August 1985, but felt sufficiently sure he had not made a mistake on the C1 form to put 3:36 a.m. instead in his statement of 13th August 1985.

[Jane]

Had Pc West seemed less human, it would have been less clear. He had put 03:26 (which would probably have been wrong anyway, as that was the time that Bonnett logged for the consequent call) in his statement of 9th August 1985, but felt sufficiently sure he had not made a mistake on the C1 form to put 3:36 a.m. instead in his statement of 13th August 1985.

Still, it seems he was more convincing than was Jeremy, doesn't it?

[lookout]

Still, it seems he was more convincing than was Jeremy, doesn't it?

He was a cop,that's why.

[Jane]

He was a cop,that's why.

OR he sounded like a human being and not a pompous prig.

[lookout]

OR he sounded like a human being and not a pompous prig.

Amost human perhaps 

[Jane]

Amost human perhaps 

So the jury must have felt.

[Reader]

Pc West's log effectively supported Jeremy, but Jeremy and his defence team didn't realize the full significance of it at his trial. We can now see that whereas Pc West wrote down "age 27" for Sheila that Jeremy had told him was Sheila's age, Bonnett (who was called by Pc West) wrote "aged 26 yrs". This was consistent with Bonnett having had another source - Nevill Bamber.

[Jane]

Pc West's log effectively supported Jeremy, but Jeremy and his defence team didn't realize the full significance of it at his trial. We can now see that whereas Pc West wrote down "age 27" for Sheila that Jeremy had told him was Sheila's age, Bonnett (who was called by Pc West) wrote "aged 26 yrs". This was consistent with Bonnett having had another source - Nevill Bamber.

Poppycock!!! And even if it wasn't it made zero difference. The main thrust of the conversation was hardly someone's age. It was that in an alleged call Jeremy was told his sister -of ANY age- had gone mad and had hold of a gun.

[Reader]

What was wrong? What conversation are you referring to and why?

[lookout]

Pc West's log effectively supported Jeremy, but Jeremy and his defence team didn't realize the full significance of it at his trial. We can now see that whereas Pc West wrote down "age 27" for Sheila that Jeremy had told him was Sheila's age, Bonnett (who was called by Pc West) wrote "aged 26 yrs". This was consistent with Bonnett having had another source - Nevill Bamber.

As each one told the other that they'd received calls from 1 ) the son, and 2) the father.

[scipio_usmc]

Pc West's log effectively supported Jeremy, but Jeremy and his defence team didn't realize the full significance of it at his trial. We can now see that whereas Pc West wrote down "age 27" for Sheila that Jeremy had told him was Sheila's age, Bonnett (who was called by Pc West) wrote "aged 26 yrs". This was consistent with Bonnett having had another source - Nevill Bamber.

His log doesn't support Jeremy at all.  You keep posting extremely xxxxxx things.  Ther eis nothing at all in West's log that suggests he had a source other than Jeremy.  Nor does Bonnett's log suggest West told Bonnett he had a source other than Jeremy.

West wrote down that Jeremy told him Sheila's age was 26.  Bonnett wrote down that West told him that Jeremy said his sister's age was 27.   Both sources attribute the information to Jeremy.  Neither suggests the information came from someone else.  To a reasonably intelligent person all this proves is that either:

A) West accidentally told Bonnett a different age than he wrote down

or

B) Bonnett accidentally wrote down a different age than West told him because he misheard or some other reason.

That's all it proves to someone who is honest and reasonably intelligent.

 

[lookout]

 This was a murder investigation and they hadn't even began investigating before " mistakes " were made. It follows how the rest of the investigation went !

[Jane]

As each one told the other that they'd received calls from 1 ) the son, and 2) the father.

Lookout, Neville, in his alleged call, wouldn't refer to Sheila to Jeremy as "my daughter" but "your sister". Jeremy told West, presumably word for word what his father allegedly said to him. When West relayed the call to Bonnett, he was quoting Jeremy had said, NOT Neville's words during his alleged call to Jeremy. It's easy to see how the "sister" that Jeremy spoke of translated as the "daughter" Neville allegedly spoke of.