Why did Julie not contribute to the recent books ?

[Jan]

Good post.   

Re the bit about the hitman.  If you remove the hitman and replace them with Bamber himself - what do you then do about any police communications relating to a possible sighting at the window?  I would imagine they would have to be struck from the records.

I agree - I also think for some reason they were sure a call had been made from the house to Jeremy - now we are told the last number redial was to the police station because Harris used it ?

But what if it was to goldhanger ?

For some reason they either thought a hitman was used or as you say it covered a few things that happened on the night. For example the attack on NB .

I don't think the hitman thing has explained properly - but I get a feeling it was there for a reason.

[Jane]

Good post.   

Re the bit about the hitman.  If you remove the hitman and replace them with Bamber himself - what do you then do about any police communications relating to a possible sighting at the window?  I would imagine they would have to be struck from the records.

Was it the police or Jeremy who saw "the possible sighting at the window"?

[Jan]

Was it the police or Jeremy who saw "the possible sighting at the window"?

Well as the officer involved has changed his story ( as seen on video) who knows. I think originally they saw it together.

[Adam]

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,6748.msg309354.html#msg309354

[Adam]

Wilkes's book and the 'Crimes, hearts and coronets' article says movement was spotted. But does not say who spotted it. 

Bews is on video saying two different things. Saying it was Jeremy and then saying it was a police officer. 

The 'Crimes that shook Britain' video says it was Jeremy who spotted the movement. 

It was a trick of the light, and no other movement was spotted that evening. However be good to have a definitive answer on who spotted it. 

If it was a policeman who thought he saw something, then Jeremy had been convincing in persuading them about Sheila. If it was Jeremy who spotted it, then it was part of his plan to insinuate Sheila. 

[Jan]

1) The police didn't have evidence of wrongdoing Julie engaged in and question her in relation to such in order to get her to flip on Jeremy.  During the course of relating her evidence against Jeremy she chose to include wrongdoing she engaged in which in some way concerned him in order to further detial his bad nature.

Such included:

1) him getting her into using drugs
2) him growing and selling drugs and getting her to sell drugs for him
3) being with him when he robbed the Caravan site
4) engaging in the check fraud because she wanted to prove to him she could be bad too.

They had no idea about any of these crimes until she told them and she could have mentioned Jeremy's wrongdoing without admitting she did or sold drugs and without mentioning the check fraud.  She chose to do so.

2) The documents concerning the decision not to prosecute her note they had no basis to do anything to her for the check fraud, that her actions in the Caravan burglary amount simply to an unsuccessful attempt to reach the key thus they could not do much to her and that the drug offenses were so minor all they could do was issue a police caution.  They said the only testimony was form her and the amounts she admits to were too minor to amount to more than a caution.   They said to notify her that no charges would be pursued and she would be asked to testify against Jeremy.

If she had been worried about being charged she would not have admitted to any wrongdoing when she implicated Jeremy.  She knew not much could be done to her for such minor things so admitted to it.  They never told her if she didn't testify she would be prosecuted. 

Trying to say she made up things to implicate Jeremy in order to avoid prosecution fails totally.

can you clarify the dates of when Jeremy was interviewed about the caravan break in and Julies first call the  police .

[Steve_uk]

can you clarify the dates of when Jeremy was interviewed about the caravan break in and Julies first call the  police .

Liz Rimington telephoned Witham Police on Friday 6th September and Jeremy was brought in for questioning the following Sunday morning at Moreshead Mansions.

[Adam]

can you clarify the dates of when Jeremy was interviewed about the caravan break in and Julies first call the  police .

Bamber was interviewed about it after Julie approached the police.

The break in was months beforehand. Bamber had not gone to the police to confess and Neville and June had not prosecuted.

The police asked him about it, after Julie approached them and told them.

[Jan]

Liz Rimington telephoned Witham Police on Friday 6th September and Jeremy was brought in for questioning the following Sunday morning at Moreshead Mansions.

sorry I thought he was originally questioned earlier about the break in ? then released and then arrested on his way back into the country ?

Julie said she first started telling friends about the hit man on 27th august ( in her statement).

So I was just wondering when did she confess all to the police about the break in /fraud and drugs etc ? 

[Adam]

sorry I thought he was originally questioned earlier about the break in ? then released and then arrested on his way back into the country ?

Julie said she first started telling friends about the hit man on 27th august ( in her statement).

So I was just wondering when did she confess all to the police about the break in /fraud and drugs etc ?

You're a real Angela Lansbury.

Asking questions about times and who said what. If Jeremy can't find enough spelling mistakes to get off on a technicality, I doubt that you can.

But keep busy bodying away.

[Steve_uk]

Jeremy wasn't charged with murder until Sunday 29 September,when he arrived back to Dover from France with Brett Collins. DCI Taff Jones had had first crack at interrogating him on Sunday 8 September but made a hash of it. From memory I think Police tried to get a custodial sentence at Chelmsford Crown Court due to the drugs and break in charges as a subterfuge to holding him for murder but this was rejected by the magistrate,hence Jeremy's ability to travel abroad after he was released following further interrogation on Wednesday 11 September,this time by DS Stan Jones.

[scipio_usmc]

sorry I thought he was originally questioned earlier about the break in ? then released and then arrested on his way back into the country ?

Julie said she first started telling friends about the hit man on 27th august ( in her statement).

So I was just wondering when did she confess all to the police about the break in /fraud and drugs etc ?

She told police he had been plotting to kill them, about the break in etc on September 7-8. Her statement was written up on the 8th and they went the same day picked up Jeremy and began to question him.  His interrogation was over the course of 5 days running from the 8th through the the 12th.

[Adam]

How could you possibly know, that she was not told the charges would be dropped if she testified?  If the interviews took place within the context of her being pressurised, why would the police want to inform her that she would only likely receive a caution for the offences (even if the police themselves knew this was the case).  The police would want to use the offences as leverage.  Even if the police did inform her that she would probably only receive a caution, this woman was a trainee teacher.  How likely would she have been able to pursue a career in teaching, with cheque fraud, burglary and drugs charges on her record?

What if the cops got wind of her petty crime spree and quickly cottoned on to her being a potential weak link in getting to Bamber? (Which is what they had been tasked to do by Simpson).

Pull her in about the petty crime stuff  - and then turn the screw - by making her feel at risk of being an accessory to five murders.  Julie Mugford in that position, is very vulnerable.

Julie completed her WS on the 8th September 1985. So approached the police well before this.

Her and SB went to the bank regarding the minor cheque book fraud on the 4th October 1985.

Julies minor cheque book fraud was in 1984. The police knew nothing about it. She had got away with it. The police could not use it to make her talk and compile a false WS. To suggest the police would do this anyway is very far fetched.

[Jan]

She told police he had been plotting to kill them, about the break in etc on September 7-8. Her statement was written up on the 8th and they went the same day picked up Jeremy and began to question him.  His interrogation was over the course of 5 days running from the 8th through the the 12th.

thank you

And allegedly she started telling her "friends"  about the hitman on august 27th.

So basically she and he were giving statements nearly at the same time -  so if liz was right and she did not want to go to the police then she could have well thought she was going to be implicated as an accessory.

[Adam]

thank you

And allegedly she started telling her "friends"  about the hitman on august 27th.

So basically she and he were giving statements nearly at the same time -  so if liz was right and she did not want to go to the police then she could have well thought she was going to be implicated as an accessory.

I agree she may have felt it would look better if she approached the police first. And created a recent thread.

She could be charged with withholding information.

However unlike Jeremy, she had morals and told five people before approaching the police.