Police log contents, and position of bodies in photographs don't add up, CRIKEY.

[mike tesko]

But you're saying the same thing about Jeremy? Jeremy himself argued that he called police BEFORE 03:36 - can't have it both ways Mike.

The first time he called police at Witham around 3.27 / 3.28am was not answered. Never the less, it was the first of his 2 calls to police that particular morning. His call to Julie Mugford took place around 3.30am, so Jeremy called Julie after he had called the police, since 3.30 comes after 3.27 / 3.28am. Then at 3.36am Jeremy called Chelmsford police station. So, when compared to the time of Jeremy's 2nd call (3.36am), his call to Julie was made beforehand, since 3.30am, falls before 3.36am...

Nothing could be any clearer...

Jeremy has told the truth whichever of his two answers you might choose to try and make an example of...

[Caroline]

The first time he called police at Witham around 3.27 / 3.28am was not answered. Never the less, it was the first of his 2 calls to police that particular morning. His call to Julie Mugford took place around 3.30am, so Jeremy called Julie after he had called the police, since 3.30 comes after 3.27 / 3.28am. Then at 3.36am Jeremy called Chelmsford police station. So, when compared to the time of Jeremy's 2nd call (3.36am), his call to Julie was made beforehand, since 3.30am, falls before 3.36am...

Nothing could be any clearer...

Jeremy has told the truth whichever of his two answers you might choose to try and make an example of...

Ha, ha!  - I admire your tenacity - I sometimes think this is like a game of Chess or poker!

Jeremy argued against West's timings of his call, not that the earlier times he indicated were in respect to the unanswered calls. Ye tinker! 

[mike tesko]

Ha, ha!  - I admire your tenacity - I sometimes think this is like a game of Chess or poker!

Jeremy argued against West's timings of his call, not that the earlier times he indicated were in respect to the unanswered calls. Ye tinker! 

As I have said previously, the truth of the matter is that Jeremy did not have a clue about the timings of calls he received, or which he made. This was the state of play back in 1989 when I first met him at HMP Full Sutton. He only knew the sequence in which these calls were either received or made. That is the truth of the matter. However, other people had put times to some if not all these events, sometimes the timings came singularly, sometimes two conflicting times for the same event, and at least three contradictory times for one or two of his sequential events.  There is no doubt that since I first met jeremy in 1989, that he has tried to reconcile the mentioned timings made by other parties of his sequential events. But I feel it is a futile exercise, and he is best advised to stick with what he knows to be true - the truth being that he did not sit making notes at the time calls were received or made. But, he does clearly still remember the sequence with which he received or made calls, before leaving his cottage at Head Street, Goldhanger, to go to the incident at the scene...

[Adam]

If a phone call woke me up at around 3am. And I managed to motivate myself to go and answer it, the time of the call would forever be in my brain.

The reason ? It's never happened before and would never happen again.

[mike tesko]

Set against Jeremy's sequenced untimed events, is the backdrop of police procedural time keeping official records. There's an old saying, that goes something like this, "IF YOU WANT TO KNOW THE TIME, ASK A POLICEMAN", but that somehow doesn't appear to equate in this investigation. Nevertheless, police kept records of timed events, which can be used to compare Jeremy's sequential untimed events, with a view to placing these sequential events around and against known timed events which have been documented. I have spent over 20 years tinkering with trying to match or equate Jeremy Bambers untimed sequential events, against or in comparison of known police timed events. The net result is that I am more than satisfied with timings which I have given to Jeremy's sequential untimed events...

[mike tesko]

If a phone call woke me up at around 3am. And I managed to motivate myself to go and answer it, the time of the call would forever be in my brain.

The reason ? It's never happened before and would never happen again.

I myself have been awoken in the middle of the night on many occasions because of family trouble or problems, and on many of these occasions I had no idea what time of night I was woken up, got dressed and left in my car to go and sort things out, or to give support. On other occasions I have looked at the clock and made a mental note of the time, but people are as different as chalk or cheese...

[Caroline]

As I have said previously, the truth of the matter is that Jeremy did not have a clue about the timings of calls he received, or which he made. This was the state of play back in 1989 when I first met him at HMP Full Sutton. He only knew the sequence in which these calls were either received or made. That is the truth of the matter. However, other people had put times to some if not all these events, sometimes the timings came singularly, sometimes two conflicting times for the same event, and at least three contradictory times for one or two of his sequential events.  There is no doubt that since I first met jeremy in 1989, that he has tried to reconcile the mentioned timings made by other parties of his sequential events. But I feel it is a futile exercise, and he is best advised to stick with what he knows to be true - the truth being that he did not sit making notes at the time calls were received or made. But, he does clearly still remember the sequence with which he received or made calls, before leaving his cottage at Head Street, Goldhanger, to go to the incident at the scene...

Jeremy mentioned the call times in his first statement, no one was pressurising him at that point. He was bound to tell you he didn't know the times because he wanted you to believe he was innocent. He seems to remember well enough now!!

[mike tesko]

Set against Jeremy's sequenced untimed events, is the backdrop of police procedural time keeping official records. There's an old saying, that goes something like this, "IF YOU WANT TO KNOW THE TIME, ASK A POLICEMAN", but that somehow doesn't appear to equate in this investigation. Nevertheless, police kept records of timed events, which can be used to compare Jeremy's sequential untimed events, with a view to placing these sequential events around and against known timed events which have been documented. I have spent over 20 years tinkering with trying to match or equate Jeremy Bambers untimed sequential events, against or in comparison of known police timed events. The net result is that I am more than satisfied with timings which I have given to Jeremy's sequential untimed events...

I have visited the scene and local points of interest. I have travelled the route from Jeremy's cottage in Goldhanger, to the farmhouse in Pages Lane, I have posted film on YOU TUBE of that journey. I have spoken with telephone engineers, other experts, taken part or helped to organise reconstructions, kept hand written notes of everything I have ever done to try and get to the truth in this matter...

[Reader]

I'm sticking to the FACTS and the FACT of this matter is that Jeremy stated his father call around 03:10! he also disputed calling police at 03:36 but now he's trying to suggest Nevill called - he's arguing the opposite. It will never wash and will get laughed out of the CCRC if it forms part of the submissions.

Jeremy's initial assertion was simply that his father had called him - he didn't say when, and Pc West didn't ask when. When Jeremy got to WHF, he talked to the police. He told them his father had called about 30 minutes before, which would have placed the time of that call shortly after 3:20. At no stage did he say that he had checked the time shown on any clock or watch. There's no apparent reason for him to have thought his father called at 3:10 unless (a) he didn't know the correct time for that call and (b) the police were insistent that his calls to Julie and to Pc West occurred about 10 minutes earlier than was actually the case. Without the benefit of hindsight, Jeremy couldn't work this out as he didn't realize that his father also called the police. It simply didn't occur to Jeremy that it was odd that the police should accept times given by him but never ask him how he knew those times. The police never asked him whether he had checked the time on his clock or watch. Pc West, on the other hand, logged times as part of his job, but you choose to believe that he made a mistake or that his clock was incorrect.

[Caroline]

Jeremy's initial assertion was simply that his father had called him - he didn't say when, and Pc West didn't ask when. When Jeremy got to WHF, he talked to the police. He told them his father had called about 30 minutes before, which would have placed the time of that call shortly after 3:20. At no stage did he say that he had checked the time shown on any clock or watch. There's no apparent reason for him to have thought his father called at 3:10 unless (a) he didn't know the correct time for that call and (b) the police were insistent that his calls to Julie and to Pc West occurred about 10 minutes earlier than was actually the case. Without the benefit of hindsight, Jeremy couldn't work this out as he didn't realize that his father also called the police. It simply didn't occur to Jeremy that it was odd that the police should accept times given by him but never ask him how he knew those times. The police never asked him whether he had checked the time on his clock or watch. Pc West, on the other hand, logged times as part of his job, but you choose to believe that he made a mistake or that his clock was incorrect.

His FIRST STATEMENT made the following day clearly states that he father called about 03:10. How do you know what Jeremy thought or didn't think? Your post is complete summation on  your part and yet another attempt to make things fit.

[mike tesko]

Jeremy mentioned the call times in his first statement, no one was pressurising him at that point. He was bound to tell you he didn't know the times because he wanted you to believe he was innocent. He seems to remember well enough now!!

Jeremy made me aware that parts of his two witness statements which were hand written, and which he'd signed had been edited out of the typed versions of his witness statements. One such thing he said had been omitted were the circumstances of the sighting of the person moving around in the main bedroom. Jeremy realised that that part of his edited statement amounted to an alibi, which for one thing or another the police who produced the typed versions of his statements felt the need to omit it...

Same thing applied to mention of timings of phone calls, Jeremy felt he had been the victim of police malpractice, in that they had for one reason or another felt it necessary to omit things, and or add things. I urged him to apply to Essex police requesting a copy of the original hand written statements but he never received them to my knowlege...

[Jane]

Jeremy's initial assertion was simply that his father had called him - he didn't say when, and Pc West didn't ask when. When Jeremy got to WHF, he talked to the police. He told them his father had called about 30 minutes before, which would have placed the time of that call shortly after 3:20. At no stage did he say that he had checked the time shown on any clock or watch. There's no apparent reason for him to have thought his father called at 3:10 unless (a) he didn't know the correct time for that call and (b) the police were insistent that his calls to Julie and to Pc West occurred about 10 minutes earlier than was actually the case. Without the benefit of hindsight, Jeremy couldn't work this out as he didn't realize that his father also called the police. It simply didn't occur to Jeremy that it was odd that the police should accept times given by him but never ask him how he knew those times. The police never asked him whether he had checked the time on his clock or watch. Pc West, on the other hand, logged times as part of his job, but you choose to believe that he made a mistake or that his clock was incorrect.

Why on earth would he have felt the need to tell them that he'd checked the time of his father's alleged call with a clock or watch? The moment, at that sort of silly o' clock, checking the time would have been automatic.

[Caroline]

Jeremy made me aware that parts of his two witness statements which were hand written, and which he'd signed had been edited out of the typed versions of his witness statements. One such thing he said had been committed were the circumstances of the sighting of the person moving around in the main bedroom. Jeremy realised that that part of his edited statement amounted to an alibi, which for one thing or another the police who produced the typed versions of his statements felt the need to omit it...

Same thing applied to mention of timings of phone calls, Jeremy felt he had been the victim of police malpractice, in that they had for one reason or another felt it necessary to omit things, and or add things. I urged him to apply to Essex police requesting a copy of the original hand written statements but he never received them to my knowlege...

That's a Poker Face statement if ever there was one  :D! But Jeremy would say that wouldn't he? He had ample opportunity to mention that in court and yet said nothing! If someone had altered my statement, I'd be shouting it from the roof tops!

I would suggest that Jeremy didn't apply to EP for copies because he knew they hadn't been edited.

[Adam]

I myself have been awoken in the middle of the night on many occasions because of family trouble or problems, and on many of these occasions I had no idea what time of night I was woken up, got dressed and left in my car to go and sort things out, or to give support. On other occasions I have looked at the clock and made a mental note of the time, but people are as different as chalk or cheese...

I doubt that Jeremy was woken much by ringing phones. Sheila didn't live at WHF. So it was just June and Neville

The only other recorded event of her getting out of hand was in London.

However Jeremy obviously didn't think it was a wrong number and ignore the ringing phone.

He would have automatically checked the time after the ringing phone woke him.

[Jan]

I doubt that Jeremy was woken much by ringing phones. Sheila didn't live at WHF. So it was just June and Neville

He would have automatically checked the time after the ringing phone woke him.

cobblers - pure and utter assumption by you - nothing more - nothing less.

try again .