The switched off answering machine. Why ?

[Patti]

I was being ironic Scip  - there was clearly no call for the many reasons we have discussed many times.

But there might have been a call 

[Caroline]

But there might have been a call 

But back in the real world ....... 

[Adam]

That depends on how soundly someone is sleeping not just the ability to hear a phone from another room/level.  Some people don't even wake up from thunder/explosions.

In the meantime how long it takes to wake up, decide to answer and actually get to the phone will ipact whether the caller gives up before you can reach it.

In so far as whether there had been a call to hear...

If you are truly panicked do you grab a shotgun/knife/some other weapon and try to confront her or do you instead waste several minutes on the phone knowing even if the person answers it will take at least 10 minutes for such person to dress and come over to try to help?

If you are too scare to disarm someone yourself and too scared to grab a gun to confront such person with you would call 999 not Jeremy.

The call makes no sense on so many levels and is contradicted by the shooting commencing in the bedroom while June and Nevill were in there. This is one of the things Jeremy supporters have a hard time overcoming.  They are willing to ignore such but that doesn't make it go away that just is a way for them to rationalize what they choose to accept.  Establishing innocence requires demonstrating to others that this call happened. It also requires demonstrating Sheila actually killed everyone including herself with the gun because if she didn't then it is not credible that Nevill would call claiming she had the gun.

So the first step of proving the call is possible even is establishing Sheila did kill everyone including herself.

If Neville was scared of the mighty Sheila holding a rifle for shooting rabbits, he wouldn't automatically phone someone.

Being scared may result in someone becoming aggressive, defensive or running away. Either of these actions may result in you being less scared. Being confronted by violence may make you violent.

Ringing someone up will not make you less scared.

[scipio_usmc]

I was being ironic Scip  - there was clearly no call for the many reasons we have discussed many times.

I understood you to be saying no way did the call happen. I was just fleshing that out further.

The whole issue of Sheila not being able to have killed herself and not having done anything to anyone else is intricately interwoven with the phone call claim.  One has to establish she did have the gun and use it for it to be even remotely possible for Nevill to have called saying she had the gun.  That is why on appeal so much attention has been paid to the issue of the evidence proving she didn't do anything.  But all that attention has not resulted in pay dirt. The defense can't find anything useful to counter the evidence used at trial.

 

[Jan]

If Neville was scared of the mighty Sheila holding a rifle for shooting rabbits, he wouldn't automatically phone someone.

Being scared may result in someone becoming aggressive, defensive or running away. Either of these actions may result in you being less scared. Being confronted by violence may make you violent.

Ringing someone up will not make you less scared.

what on earth are you going on about - this post is not even making sense

[Adam]

what on earth are you going on about - this post is not even making sense

You know full well what I was saying.

If you are scared, or rather terrified, why ring up someone three miles away at 3.10am/3.36am ?

In Neville's case, he was unexpectedly caught up in the eye of a hurricane.  He would either fight back, get help from June, run away or defend yourself.

It is unlikely he would phone anyone, but if he was, he had better phoning options than Jeremy.

[lookout]

You don't know the reason for Neville having rang. It was one way of telling Jeremy that his sister was on the warpath,with poor Neville thinking that if the worst came to the worst,at least Jeremy got the message. Neville not thinking that Jeremy would end up taking the wrap.
So in effect,that phone-call was meant more as a warning than " come along ",as it was probably out of hand anyway when Neville did ring.

[Caroline]

You don't know the reason for Neville having rang. It was one way of telling Jeremy that his sister was on the warpath,with poor Neville thinking that if the worst came to the worst,at least Jeremy got the message. Neville not thinking that Jeremy would end up taking the wrap.
So in effect,that phone-call was meant more as a warning than " come along ",as it was probably out of hand anyway when Neville did ring.

Huh?  , in such an instance, he'd have called 999 - the man wasn't an idiot. If the worst came to the worst, then the police would know what happened from the horses mouth and not second hand from the son who had much to gain and knowing what happened put him right in the frame. Nevill was a magistrate - he'd have known that! 

[Adam]

You don't know the reason for Neville having rang. It was one way of telling Jeremy that his sister was on the warpath,with poor Neville thinking that if the worst came to the worst,at least Jeremy got the message. Neville not thinking that Jeremy would end up taking the wrap.
So in effect,that phone-call was meant more as a warning than " come along ",as it was probably out of hand anyway when Neville did ring.

Why did Neville say 'please come over' then ?

[Caroline]

Why did Neville say 'please come over' then ?

Politeness? 

[lookout]

Huh?  , in such an instance, he'd have called 999 - the man wasn't an idiot. If the worst came to the worst, then the police would know what happened from the horses mouth and not second hand from the son who had much to gain and knowing what happened put him right in the frame. Nevill was a magistrate - he'd have known that! 

So it appears that you knew the family well,then ?

[Caroline]

So it appears that you knew the family well,then ?

Not as well and you try to claim - I'm applying common sense - not 6th sense!! 

[lookout]

Not as well and you try to claim - I'm applying common sense - not 6th sense!! 

There's a difference------------I'm surmising,but you're adamant.

[SaraT]

There's a difference------------I'm surmising,but you're adamant.

I thought that was Jeremy

[Caroline]

There's a difference------------I'm surmising,but you're adamant.

Now you even know what I think 

But I am certainly not this guy!