The meeting with The Sun newspaper:

[maggie]

Caroline that too is an excellent post and I agree with the points you raised.  I did read Jeremy was never interested in his birth parents until maybe after he was sentenced to life in prison.

Susan, the fact he wasn't conciously interested in his birth parents doesn't really follow. It may even be that those who block any interest to their natural mother etc may be more psychologically damaged than those who do not. Just an observation from me, not a proven fact, however it's a highly complex issue.

[lookout]

Hello lookout

I believe you would as you are a very maternal person a wonderful trait to have

Hello Susan,that little girl's plight stayed with me for ages.More than anything. I'd have taken her no problem,bless her,and I still think about her and the dreadful life she had for one so young.

[susan]

Hello Susan,that little girl's plight stayed with me for ages.More than anything. I'd have taken her no problem,bless her,and I still think about her and the dreadful life she had for one so young.

lookout I find it all so sad and I feel that I would not be emotionally strong enough to deal with it only help from a distance

[susan]

Susan, the fact he wasn't conciously interested in his birth parents doesn't really follow. It may even be that those who block any interest to their natural mother etc may be more psychologically damaged than those who do not. Just an observation from me, not a proven fact, however it's a highly complex issue.

Maggie I appreciate it is a very complex issue and I am out of my depth in understanding it.

[maggie]

Speaking of adoption,if I'd been younger,I'd have fought to take that little Rumanian child, " Marie ", who is now in a childrens home in Greece. A beautiful child,with such a sad face. I would have loved her.

All children wherever they are and however they look deserve love. The cities of the world are full of abandoned children, it's a scar on the earth, or more a disgusting wound. We could heal it together if we had the real desire. IMO

[susan]

Perhaps he was always interested in them Susan but didn't want to be rejected again? Sheila meeting her birth mother probably impacted on him too, causing more resentment?

Caroline I had never thought of that but Sheila meeting her birth parents could have caused more resentment we will never know.

[lookout]

All children wherever they are and however they look deserve love. The cities of the world are full of abandoned children, it's a scar on the earth.

Bless them all Maggie.It's heartbreaking. Think of the reward of loving just one of them. Money etc doesn't come into it.

[maggie]

Maggie I appreciate it is a very complex issue and I am out of my depth in understanding it.

Think we all are, even most in the thick of it are constantly learning. Even a situation where an adoptive parent's permanence is threatened can reinforce psychological wounds of an adopted child. It's a lifelong challenge. At least if everyone involved is aware there is a difficulty it's a step in the right direction. Denial is the most damaging IMO.
Sorry am a long way off topic. Nuff said.

[scipio_usmc]

That is far too simplistic Scipio , most who suffer these psychological problems are not aware why they feel empty, dissasociated, confused and insecure, they look for love everywhere and anywhere however nothing fills the space unless they go into therapy and begin to understand and heal.

There line between feeling miserable with your family and yet feeling you must stay with them instead of striking it out on your own and feeling miserable around them and deciding to kill them rather than strike out on your own is not fine.  A very small minority decide to kill their family.  He didn't do it to stop some sort of abuse that was going on, he did it for the money.  He is no different than any other killer who kills a close relative(s) for money.  They are killing for greed.  When you murder because you want to get away from your family and yet don't want to work hard to earn your own place to live, etc then you are killing for money.  You are killing because you don't want to put in the effort to work hard and strike it out on your own.  He was an educated adult who could have found jobs away form his family doing things other than farming but didn't want to work hard earning his own way, he wanted to enjoy his life partying carefree.

[lookout]

If Jeremy ever had thoughts of killing anyone he had ample opportunity on the farmland with all its machinery. " Accidents " do happen in the farming communities where everyone has access to the tractors/harvesters etc.
He'd still have been well off with his father out of the equation.
Then again-----------he had no need to kill at all. It was Sheila who'd waited until everyone was together !!

[Steve_uk]

If Jeremy ever had thoughts of killing anyone he had ample opportunity on the farmland with all its machinery. " Accidents " do happen in the farming communities where everyone has access to the tractors/harvesters etc.
He'd still have been well off with his father out of the equation.
Then again-----------he had no need to kill at all. It was Sheila who'd waited until everyone was together !!

I've often wondered lookout with the picture in my mind of those twin boys grasping onto their father as he took his leave that Sunday evening just what the fear factor was,and whatever was in their minds they were certainly not reassured by their mother's presence at the Farm. However I have always thought that the Defence case rested mainly with a sick Sheila who on the spur of the moment had perpetrated these crimes and not planned them in her mind,this scenario making more sense to me.

[maggie]

There line between feeling miserable with your family and yet feeling you must stay with them instead of striking it out on your own and feeling miserable around them and deciding to kill them rather than strike out on your own is not fine.  A very small minority decide to kill their family.  He didn't do it to stop some sort of abuse that was going on, he did it for the money.  He is no different than any other killer who kills a close relative(s) for money.  They are killing for greed.  When you murder because you want to get away from your family and yet don't want to work hard to earn your own place to live, etc then you are killing for money.  You are killing because you don't want to put in the effort to work hard and strike it out on your own.  He was an educated adult who could have found jobs away form his family doing things other than farming but didn't want to work hard earning his own way, he wanted to enjoy his life partying carefree.

That is all assumption, scipio, you have no more idea than I have why he would murder his family, however I was suggesting that a particular possibility may have caused a disorder in JB.  You have ignored that and told me what I should believe because that is what you believe, as I said far too simplistic imo.

[lookout]

I've often wondered lookout with the picture in my mind of those twin boys grasping onto their father as he took his leave that Sunday evening just what the fear factor was,and whatever was in their minds they were certainly not reassured by their mother's presence at the Farm. However I have always thought that the Defence case rested mainly with a sick Sheila who on the spur of the moment had perpetrated these crimes and not planned them in her mind,this scenario making more sense to me.

Steve,it doesn't bear thinking how those little boys felt. As you say,with their mother in a state of despair,as she must have been, knowing that the man she'd once married was parting company with his girlfriend,leaving Sheila at the mercy of her mother who she loathed and the poor twins having to face a barrage of prayers during their stay.What an atmosphere.
It certainly was  done on the spur of the moment and needed no planning,just an avalanche of thoughts on Sheila's part as to what life/future meant for her,such as it was and she simply cracked.
Nobody in that courtroom would even contemplate the thought that it was Sheila,because of her supposed " fragility ". They didn't know the half I'm afraid.

[scipio_usmc]

That is all assumption, scipio, you have no more idea than I have why he would murder his family, however I was suggesting that a particular possibility may have caused a disorder in JB.  You have ignored that and told me what I should believe because that is what you believe, as I said far too simplistic imo.

Julie stated he told her he was killing them for the inheritance and he told others that he would never share the inheritance.  The only reason to wait and kill his parents while Sheila and the boys were also there was to kill all at the same time so he could be the only heir.  The evidence establishes why he did it I don't need to make any assumptions.

People are making assumptions about how horrible his life was because he had to feel unwanted by being given up for adoption and being sent to boarding school and not loved like a family should.

Instead of getting a job outside of the family like most people do he went back to mommy and dad saying give me a job, give me a car give me a place to live...but he wasn't happy with that lifestyle he didn't want to work he wanted to enjoy his youth partying and living it up.  The lifestyle he wanted is the one he lived after the funerals and he achieved it by murdering the victims.   

[maggie]

Julie stated he told her he was killing them for the inheritance and he told others that he would never share the inheritance.  The only reason to wait and kill his parents while Sheila and the boys were also there was to kill all at the same time so he could be the only heir.  The evidence establishes why he did it I don't need to make any assumptions.

People are making assumptions about how horrible his life was because he had to feel unwanted by being given up for adoption and being sent to boarding school and not loved like a family should.

Instead of getting a job outside of the family like most people do he went back to mommy and dad saying give me a job, give me a car give me a place to live...but he wasn't happy with that lifestyle he didn't want to work he wanted to enjoy his youth partying and living it up.  The lifestyle he wanted is the one he lived after the funerals and he achieved it by murdering the victims.

I am not making assumptions about his life being horrible, please give me some credence, I was writing about very real damage which can occur to any adopted child, which can become a real disorder if not attended to, it is a serious point but not your point therefore you dismiss it.   I have no idea if JB or Sheila suffered badly from this.