Author Topic: 13 bullet cases in m/bedroom, yet no follower plate mark found on them...  (Read 51537 times)

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Offline scipio_usmc

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This was no graze, it is a bullet exit would...

The wound in the photo is a gouge wound from the rifle butt not a bullet wound. I posted the autopsy section on the graze wound.  It clearly states the bullet grazed above the elbow not on the forearm and moreover details how a small portion then entered his side with the remainder of the fragment grazing his chest.

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Offline scipio_usmc

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Firstly, I have posted evidence that shots 8 and 7 were delivered from above Ralph Bamber by reference to the angle inclination shown in the diagrams. Let me put it as simple as I can - Ralph is on the middle landing of the main stairs, and or somewhere on the upper flight of the main stair above the middle landing aforementioned. The shooter could have easily shot at Ralph causing the two wounds (8 and 7) from the vantage point of the upper landing, since with Ralph on his way up, or down on that part of the main stairs, it didn't matter whether or not which way around his body was facing because the shooter would easily have had the opportunity to inflict both shots, irrespective of whether or not Ralph had his left side to the wall, or his right side...

I have been discussing the trajectory of these shots for more than a year.  I noted that the trajectory proves that either Nevill was either not standing fully upright when shot or the killer was standing on something to be at a higher vantage point.  After more than a year of stating such you have finally decided to discuss this issue but do so only by including it in your various lies instead of actually trying to be rational and honest about it.

I posted the position of where the killer was in relation to Nevill when each of the first 4 shots was fired based on the position of the hour hand of an analog.  The shots came from left and behind- between 8 O'clock and 9'oclock positions.  Somone standing in the small hall that runs at the top of the stairs between the master bedroom and room Sheila was sleeping in would not be able to target the left side of someone walking down the stairs at all.  The left side would be facing the wall.  Shooting at someone coming up the stairs would not result in bullets coming from the front or front/left side- the shot would not be from the back/left side as was the case with bullets 7 and 8.  Your claims are physically impossible.

So your made up the claim that the bullet that grazed Nevill and the 2 associated casings were originally in the hall but were moved to the bedroom by police not only has zero evidentiary support- it is impossible for someone on the stairs to have suffered wounds 7 and 8.

 


I have explained the distribution of cases, and how four were added to the main bedroom, after PI Bob Miller vacated items which originally had exhibit references DRH/1, DRH/2, DRH/3 and DRH/4, if you can't get your head around that then there is quite simply no hope of you ever coming to terms with what actually took place. But just to recap, 8 cartridge cases originally in the main bedroom, add to these 4 additional cases displaced from the kitchen, producing 12 cartridge cases in the main bedroom. I know you you disagree, but so what, I know that what I am saying is right. The 13th cartridge case was not inside the main bedroom, it was outside on the top landing. I believe it possible that this particular cartridge case may have got moved along the top landing by traffic coming and going before DC Hammersley (soc) supposedly collected it up after 10 am...

I believe the cartridge cases recovered from the top landing and the main stair are associated with Ralphs 8 and 7 wounds...

If I am right, and I believe that I am, Ralph Bamber was shot a total of 6 times whilst present in the kitchen - two bullets to the mouth region whilst he was using, or had used the telephone. we know that blood from his wounded left arm had contaminated the fingers of his left hand which contaminated the edge of the kitchen worktop. by that stage when his bloodied left hand fingers gripped the kitchen worktop, it left his uninjured right arm / hand to operate the telephone, and it begs the question why would he be holding the telephone handset in his right hand intending to make a telephone call, if he already had a mouthful of bullets - this indicates that by the time he used the phone to make distress calls (however brief) firstly to Jeremy, and then to the police at 3.26am, that he had not yet been shot in the lip, or his jaw...

Police made a fundamental mistake moving the location of four bullet cases from the region of the main kitchen downstairs, to the main bedroom upstairs, because it left 3 cartridge cases in the kitchen, when there should only have been 2. In other words, they were faced with a paradox, and whichever way they decided to handle it, they were always going to be in trouble one way or another, they could doctor the logistics as much as they wanted to, but they could never make the logistics fit perfectly. If you remove 4 cases from the kitchen to promote the idea that Ralph had been shot 4 times non fatally upstairs in the main bedroom, it should have left two cartridge cases downstairs in the kitchen (4 cases from the 4 fatal head shots, and 2 cases from the bullets to the mouth shots), but when PI Bob Miller handled the swap over of these 4 cartridge cases, he made the fundamental mistake of leaving an additional cartridge case in the kitchen, he confused himself by forgetting, or indeed, remembering that Sheila had in fact been shot once downstairs in the kitchen...

Now, before you get on your high horse, by suggesting that Sheila was not shot downstairs in the kitchen, let me reassure you that she was. The story that PC Collins made a mistake by misidentifying Ralphs body for that of a female through the main kitchen window prior to entry into the premises by the raid team (including PC Collins himself), can easily be proven to be nothing but a red herring, since in his COLP interview, Collins himself describes the approach to the rear farmhouse door on WHITE SIDE of the farmhouse via a curved wall, and that he went beyond the door and looked into the kitchen window beyond. Now, he is correct when he says that the window he looked through beyond the door being a kitchen window. But the window in question was not the main kitchen window, it was the back kitchen window - the window before the door was / is the main kitchen window. Therefore, Collins saw a female through the back kitchen window, and of course, Ralph Bambers body was found inside the main kitchen. So, in a nutshell, Collins could not possibly have misidentified Ralphs body in one room, for the body of a female in the other room, or vice versa...

All of this nonsense is just that made up nonsense that need not even be addressed because you have no evidence to support any of this ridiculous nonsense.
Politeness is organized indifference- Paul Valéry

Offline mike tesko

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I posted the position of where the killer was in relation to Nevill when each of the first 4 shots was fired based on the position of the hour hand of an analog.  The shots came from left and behind- between 8 O'clock and 9'oclock positions.  Somone standing in the small hall that runs at the top of the stairs between the master bedroom and room Sheila was sleeping in would not be able to target the left side of someone walking down the stairs at all.  The left side would be facing the wall.  Shooting at someone coming up the stairs would not result in bullets coming from the front or front/left side- the shot would not be from the back/left side as was the case with bullets 7 and 8.  Your claims are physically impossible.

So your made up the claim that the bullet that grazed Nevill and the 2 associated casings were originally in the hall but were moved to the bedroom by police not only has zero evidentiary support- it is impossible for someone on the stairs to have suffered wounds 7 and 8.

 All of this nonsense is just that made up nonsense that need not even be addressed because you have no evidence to support any of this ridiculous nonsense.

You have resorted to your usual personal attack mode, because you can't provide any proper answers to the points I am making...

The fact is that Ralph was shot twice either coming up, or going down the top part of the main stairs - there was ample room for Sheila to shoot him from the position I have described, and for the two cartridge casings to end up where they were found...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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The wound in the photo is a gouge wound from the rifle butt not a bullet wound. I posted the autopsy section on the graze wound.  It clearly states the bullet grazed above the elbow not on the forearm and moreover details how a small portion then entered his side with the remainder of the fragment grazing his chest.
Stop behaving like an idiot, its the exit wound on his left arm, as indicated in the post mortem diagram...
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Alias

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Stop behaving like an idiot, its the exit wound on his left arm, as indicated in the post mortem diagram...

I am with you on this one, Mike.

Offline scipio_usmc

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Stop behaving like an idiot, its the exit wound on his left arm, as indicated in the post mortem diagram...

You are projecting again, the diagram shows no exit wound on his forearm and more importantly the autopsy report doesn't mention any exit wound or other bullet wounds to his forearm.  I am being accurate not an idiot and you are just being your usual lying self.  If I were to just call you a liar in general that would be a personal attack. Calling me an idiot, scumbag, fukker and all the other various names you have called me in the past are personal attacks.  When I demonstrate you are lying it is issue specific and substantive posting.



« Last Edit: April 26, 2015, 06:45:PM by scipio_usmc »
Politeness is organized indifference- Paul Valéry

Offline scipio_usmc

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I am with you on this one, Mike.

Your true colors have continuously shined through as of late.  You have abandoned the pretense of being an objective fence sitter and have gone fully to full Jeremy conspiracy camp mode.  This is a rather odd bandwagon to jump on considering the autopsy report and wound diagrams make clear there were no bullet wounds to Nevill's forearms and thus demonstrate Mike's claims to be complete bunk.

Politeness is organized indifference- Paul Valéry

Offline Patti

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You are projecting again, the diagram shows no exit wound on his forearm and more importantly the autopsy report doesn't mention any exit wound or other bullet wounds to his forearm.  I am being accurate not an idiot and you are just being your usual lying self.  If I were to just call you a liar in general that would be a personal attack. Calling me an idiot, scumbag, fukker and all the other various names you have called me in the past are personal attacks.  When I demonstrate you are lying it is issue specific and substantive posting.





Sorry Scip the exit wound on figure 8 is correct it matches with the whole bullets that were found in the main bedroom.  All match up.  I think the problem is that there was some confusion between the shoulder shot and the arm shot.....For if you are saying that the arm shot was a graze then Nevill only had 7 shots...and we know he had 8.... :-\

Offline Alias

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Sorry Scip the exit wound on figure 8 is correct it matches with the whole bullets that were found in the main bedroom.  All match up.  I think the problem is that there was some confusion between the shoulder shot and the arm shot.....For if you are saying that the arm shot was a graze then Nevill only had 7 shots...and we know he had 8.... :-\

Skippy is clearly wrong. Still he is so arrogant that he is name-calling and talking down to people who dare to contradict him. This is intolerable.

Offline Patti

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Skippy is clearly wrong. Still he is so arrogant that he is name-calling and talking down to people who dare to contradict him. This is intolerable.


Alias read the report...It does indicate that the bullet from the shoulder somehow tracked down the arm, then exited and that fragments from that bullet ended up in the chest cavity....if this was so then Nevill only had 7 shots which is what I argued with Hartley a long time ago....

I'll have a look at what I did....I'll be back...lol  ;D ;D ;D ;D

Offline Patti

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Skippy is clearly wrong. Still he is so arrogant that he is name-calling and talking down to people who dare to contradict him. This is intolerable.

4 inches above the left elbow that is his shoulder isn't it????? Yikes this is confusing. hahahaha  ;D ;D ;D ;D

Offline Alias

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4 inches above the left elbow that is his shoulder isn't it????? Yikes this is confusing. hahahaha  ;D ;D ;D ;D

You can see where it is in the photo Mike posted - it is not at the shoulder.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2015, 07:43:PM by Alias »

Offline Patti

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KITCHEN
DRH/41 case...under kitchen table
DRH/ 19 case...on kitchen table
DRH/20 case....under the mat, infront of sink
DRH/23 bullet.....in a plastic tray on worktop near sink unit.

LANDING

DRH/14...landing floor adjacent to the wall.

MAIN BEDROOM


DRH/13 metal strip of doorway
DRH/6 top of quit right hand side of the bed
DRH/7 under wardrobe
DRH/7 under wardrobe (note Hammersley quotes two cases found under same serial number DRH7
DRH/8 left hand side of bed 4inches from the pillow
DRH/9 Bullet found 4 inches form DRH/8 near pillow left hand side of bed
DRH/10  on the quilt right hand side of the bed on floor.
DRH/11 right hand side of bed on the floor near the wardrobe
DRH/12 on the floor right hand side of the bed
DRH/43 under the wardrobe right hand side of bed
DRH/1 right side of Sheila's body
DRH/2 Left hand side of Sheila's body
DRH/3 on the floor inside the door of the main bedroom to the left of June's body.
DRH/4 next to DRH/3
DRH/5 Bullet.

TWINS ROOM

8 cases and 1 bullet.

DRH/37 under wooden bedside cabinet
DRH/36 Bullet
DRH/38 Under right hand side of the bed at the head of the bed
DRH 39 right hand corner under right hand side of the bed
DRH/39 (note Hammersley quotes two case shells)
DRH 40 under the middle of the right hand bed
DRH/16 floor between both beds
DRH/17 On wooden cabinet between both beds
DRH18 right hand side of bed

Offline mike tesko

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Alias read the report...It does indicate that the bullet from the shoulder somehow tracked down the arm, then exited and that fragments from that bullet ended up in the chest cavity....if this was so then Nevill only had 7 shots which is what I argued with Hartley a long time ago....

I'll have a look at what I did....I'll be back...lol  ;D ;D ;D ;D

If Ralph only had 7 shots (instead of 8), it creates a logistical problem, because there are 25 cartridge cases...
« Last Edit: April 26, 2015, 07:50:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Patti

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You can see where it is in the photo Mike posted - it is not at the shoulder.

This is the wound Scip and Mike are on about? And below that is diagram of that wound that say exit on it. That is not 4 inches up from the elbow that is just below the elbow isn't it?  Or am I seeing things.