Author Topic: Russia - worrying?  (Read 365236 times)

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Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2400 on: January 30, 2023, 11:04:PM »
Can you post a link to a Nazi who committed war crimes and was recruited by the USA? I thought they were all scientists and technicians.
   That is a silly question, as you well know. Their recruitment would ensure the disappearance of any crimes by the intel agencies recruiting them. You know that, however;

Only one Paperclip scientist, Georg Rickhey, was formally tried for any crime, and no Paperclip scientist was found guilty of any crime, in the United States or Germany. Rickhey was returned to Germany in 1947 to stand at the Dora Trial, where he was acquitted.

    The example below tells you how hard the intel agencies investigated any possible crimes. Seems the the "Boston Globe" had better access and intel than the intel agencies-unless...

In 1951, weeks after his U.S. arrival, Walter Schreiber was linked by the Boston Globe to human experiments conducted by Kurt Blome at Ravensbrück, and he emigrated to Argentina with the aid of the U.S. military.


Offline Steve_uk

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2401 on: January 30, 2023, 11:13:PM »
   That is a silly question, as you well know. Their recruitment would ensure the disappearance of any crimes by the intel agencies recruiting them. You know that, however;

Only one Paperclip scientist, Georg Rickhey, was formally tried for any crime, and no Paperclip scientist was found guilty of any crime, in the United States or Germany. Rickhey was returned to Germany in 1947 to stand at the Dora Trial, where he was acquitted.

    The example below tells you how hard the intel agencies investigated any possible crimes. Seems the the "Boston Globe" had better access and intel than the intel agencies-unless...

In 1951, weeks after his U.S. arrival, Walter Schreiber was linked by the Boston Globe to human experiments conducted by Kurt Blome at Ravensbrück, and he emigrated to Argentina with the aid of the U.S. military.

We're diverging now quite conveniently from Russia's occupation of Ukraine, aren't we?
« Last Edit: January 30, 2023, 11:16:PM by Steve_uk »

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2402 on: January 30, 2023, 11:15:PM »
Can you post a link to a Nazi who committed war crimes and was recruited by the USA? I thought they were all scientists and technicians.
   Kurt Heinrich Debus-Nazi party member and rocket scientist who worked on the V-weapons of the Third Reich. Given that the V-weapons were specifically designed to bomb and terrorise civilian populations in cities(unarguably a war-crime)-and that Debus was a flight test director and member of SchutzStaffel (SS).
    Debus became the first Director of NASA Launch Operations Centre.
   

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2403 on: January 30, 2023, 11:18:PM »
   Kurt Heinrich Debus-Nazi party member and rocket scientist who worked on the V-weapons of the Third Reich. Given that the V-weapons were specifically designed to bomb and terrorise civilian populations in cities(unarguably a war-crime)-and that Debus was a flight test director and member of SchutzStaffel (SS).
    Debus became the first Director of NASA Launch Operations Centre.
   
But they were scientists not politicians. You may as well argue that the guys who bombed Dresden on 13 February 1945 or the pilots who dropped the atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were war criminals.

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2404 on: January 30, 2023, 11:26:PM »
We're diverging now quite conveniently from Russia's occupation of Ukraine, aren't we?
   You did ask.
    There is no Russian occupation of Ukraine.
    What you mean is- Russia acting on the Responsibility to Protect- under Article 51 of the UN charter.
    Occupation is what US and NATO do to countries. How many foreign bases in countries where they haven't been invited do the US have again?
    What do you think that the Ukrainian army that had massed behind the LOC (line of control) in the weeks prior to 24/02/22 were planning? The massive increase in shelling civilian areas, observed and documented by the OSCE, by the Ukrainians in the week prior to 24/02/22?
    Do you think that the Russians had no right to invoke R2P for the civilians in Donetsk, Luhansk?
    Do you still harbour the lie that Russia's actions were "unprovoked"?
« Last Edit: January 30, 2023, 11:27:PM by gringo »

Offline Steve_uk

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2405 on: January 30, 2023, 11:38:PM »
   You did ask.
    There is no Russian occupation of Ukraine.
    What you mean is- Russia acting on the Responsibility to Protect- under Article 51 of the UN charter.
    Occupation is what US and NATO do to countries. How many foreign bases in countries where they haven't been invited do the US have again?
    What do you think that the Ukrainian army that had massed behind the LOC (line of control) in the weeks prior to 24/02/22 were planning? The massive increase in shelling civilian areas, observed and documented by the OSCE, by the Ukrainians in the week prior to 24/02/22?
    Do you think that the Russians had no right to invoke R2P for the civilians in Donetsk, Luhansk?
    Do you still harbour the lie that Russia's actions were "unprovoked"?
The Minsk agreements were supposed to deal with all that. As for the USA military bases, I can only think of Guantanamo Bay and Diego Garcia where there is negativity. Don't US personnel boost the economy of the countries in which they are located?

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2406 on: January 31, 2023, 12:08:AM »
The Minsk agreements were supposed to deal with all that. As for the USA military bases, I can only think of Guantanamo Bay and Diego Garcia where there is negativity. Don't US personnel boost the economy of the countries in which they are located?
   The Minsk agreements were ignored from the start, as now openly admitted by Merkel and Hollande. You know this. Minsk agreements didn't deal with it because of Western lies and deceit. It is admitted.
    Hence the need for Article 51 and Responsibility to protect.
    You can only think of Guantanamo and Diego Garcia. At-Tanf in Syria-are they invited there? Bases in Deir Ezzor, Syria. Are they invited there? US will not be able to afford their Empire soon. Steve. Dollar reserve status is all that allows their endless money printing and extortion enforced by NATO. They boost their own economy at the expense of everyone else.
    Far from boosting the economy of Syria-they are looting it.
    Approx 750 bases across 80 countries. And you call Russia imperialist.

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2407 on: January 31, 2023, 12:15:AM »
   The Minsk agreements were supposed to deal with all that. - Steve.

   It is ridiculous that you ignore the admitted Western deceit from the very start. You cannot claim that agreements that the West has admitted they ignored from the start could possibly deal with the issues in Donetsk, Luhansk. It is intellectually incoherent.
   Given the admitted Western duplicity over this issue. What do you propose Russia should have done to protect the civilians being attacked by Ukrainian armed forces?
« Last Edit: January 31, 2023, 12:19:AM by gringo »

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2408 on: January 31, 2023, 01:20:AM »
Alexander Rutskoy, a former Soviet general, accused Putin of 'senselessly' killing tens of thousands of Russian soldiers who have been used as cannon fodder in the war.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11691403/Putin-laughing-stock-says-Russias-former-vice-president.html

Offline gringo

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2409 on: January 31, 2023, 02:27:AM »
Alexander Rutskoy, a former Soviet general, accused Putin of 'senselessly' killing tens of thousands of Russian soldiers who have been used as cannon fodder in the war.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11691403/Putin-laughing-stock-says-Russias-former-vice-president.html
  Vice President during Yeltsin's reign accuses Putin of surrounding himself with incompetents. Do you know who Rutskoy is? He was arrested in 1993 after being a main instigator of the constitutional crisis following the impeachment of Yeltsin. I am sure that even you will be able to use the following undisputed facts as clues to who and what, Rutskoy is.

    Rutskoy was Vice President President of RSFSR/Russia from 10 July 1991 before arrest 4 October 1993. As vice president, he openly called for the independence of Transnistria and Crimea from Moldova and Ukraine.-from Wiki.

    On the night of 21–22 September 1993, Rutskoy ascended the podium of the Russian parliament,[16] and assumed the powers of acting President of Russia at 00:25, in accordance with the above article.[17] He took the presidential oath, and said: "I am taking the authority of President. The anti-constitutional decree of President Yeltsin is annulled." Rutskoy's interim presidency, although constitutional, was never acknowledged outside Russia. After the two-week standoff, and the violence erupting on the streets of Moscow, on 4 October 1993, the Russian White House was taken by Yeltsin's military forces. Rutskoy and his supporters were arrested and charged with organization of mass disturbances. The day before, Yeltsin officially dismissed Rutskoy as vice president,

   Rutskoy was imprisoned in the Moscow Lefortovo prison[19] until 26 February 1994,[20] when he and other participants of both the August 1991 and October 1993 crises were granted amnesty by the State Duma.[21]

Soon after his release, Rutskoy founded a populist, nationalist party, Derzhava, which failed in the 1995 legislative election to the State Duma, gathering only about 2.5% of the votes and thus not passing the 5% threshold.


   Rutskoy was released as a POW in Islamabad, Pakistan, in 1988 after intervention by the CIA.

   None of the above is in any way misrepresented or disputed.

   Instead of Rutskoy becoming President and selling out, Crimeans, Transnistrians in 1993, Yeltsin hung on and appointed Putin in 1999.
   The rest, as they say, is history.
   Rutskoy is not the voice of Russia. He is a bitter selfish and extremely fringe figure.

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2410 on: January 31, 2023, 06:05:AM »
Talking in English for YOU! Bakhmut soldier is almost surrounded - but stays focused and is in a good mood!

https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/10pffz8/talking_in_english_for_you_bakhmut_soldier_is/

Offline David1819

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2411 on: January 31, 2023, 12:58:PM »
When you two play chess is it like Anatoly Yevgenyevich Karpov Vs Bobby Fischer?

This is how me and NGB play

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwPbDQPaah4

Offline David1819

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Online ngb1066

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Re: Russia - worrying?
« Reply #2413 on: February 01, 2023, 10:01:PM »