Below is the machine translation of an interview Sergei Lavrov on Rossiya24 earlier. Long but well worth reading for anyone interested. It is always worth seeking out Lavrov interviews and press conferences, full of information and insight in Russian perspectives and thinking. He is head and shoulders above western "diplomats" who shame us all with their grandstanding and berating and making demands of other countries.
I have highlighted a few parts that I feel are particularly noteworthy but as always with Lavrov, the whole thing is worth reading and then reading again to fully digest.
Question: I would like to ask you about the "strange" statements made by the EU regarding the course of Russia's military operation in Ukraine. The head of EU diplomacy, George Borrell, said that this war (speaking of the Russian special operation) should be won on the battlefield. Somehow this does not fit with the status of the EU, first of all, as a political and economic Organization. German President Francis Steinmeier says that he is now "sprinkling ashes on his head," which he once stated about the possibility of a normal dialogue with Russia. Now he probably doesn't see that possibility. How do you talk to these people? How to negotiate with them?
Sergey Lavrov:
- This is a serious reversal in the policy that the EU and the Us-led West as a whole (there is no doubt about this) began to pursue after the start of our special military operation. It reflects the anger, the frenzy (pardon the non-diplomatic expression) which is determined not only by Ukraine, but by the fact that this country began to make a springboard for the final suppression of Russia and its subordination to the global system built by the West, despite the end of the Cold War, despite the disappearance of both the Warsaw Pact and the Soviet Union, the West has always moved close to our borders despite all the promises made not to expand NATO
[/color][/b]. contrary to claims that we are no longer adversaries and much more. Our special military operation is designed to put an end to the reckless expansion and course towards the complete domination of the United States and the rest of NATO countries in the international arena. It is being built with a gross violation of international law according to certain "rules", which they are only now talking about. They are developed from time to time.
In Kosovo, it is possible to recognize independence without a referendum, but in Crimea, as a result of a referendum observed by hundreds of objective representatives and the public of foreign countries, it is impossible.
In Iraq (10,000 km from the United States), they "saw" a threat to their American security. They bombed him, found no threat, and didn't even apologize. Neo-Nazis and ultra-radicals are being "grown" on our borders, dozens of biological laboratories are being created through the Pentagon, and experiments aimed at creating biological weapons are being conducted. The discovered documents leave no doubt about this. We are not allowed to respond to a threat on our borders, not across the ocean. That's what it's all about.President Vladimir Putin spoke in detail about the reasons for the decision on a special military operation– the eight-year sabotage of the implementation of the Minsk Agreements, accompanied by daily bombing of Donbass, the pumping of Western weapons into the country of Ukraine, the instructors who trained the most extremist-minded units, which were then sent to the Armed Forces of Ukraine and formed the backbone of the groups that are now resisting our operation to demilitarization and denazification of Ukraine. Western propaganda immediately translated all this into a description of Russia as an absolute evil, and they, accordingly, are the embodiment of absolute good. The current Ukrainian regime is supposedly the light of democracy, justice, freedom, a craving for everything European, for the values that Europe has allegedly always professed. The subsequent reaction shows that they are well aware that it is not only and not so much about Ukraine. The point is that not everyone is ready to obey their dominance. Russia, with its history and traditions, is one of those countries that will never occupy a subordinate position. We can only be members of the international community on equal terms, on conditions of indivisible security, which were agreed upon, but they were ignored by our Western colleagues. But what George Borrell said even against this unprecedented and aggressive background is a significant game changer. The EU has never acted as a military organization. Yes, they are now discussing their "strategic compass". For the first time in history, Germany has allocated an additional 100 billion euros to "pump up" its military "muscles", which is a qualitative change. This "strategic compass" involves a significant increase in military spending and the construction of a kind of collective structure for defense against potential aggressors. But the result of all this independence is zero, because everything that is done is completely controlled by the United States. There is no independent role for the EU, including in the efforts that are being made within the EU. They are perfectly controlled by the Balts, the Danes, the Poles, who will not allow the EU to somehow separate from NATO. On the contrary, they will push him into NATO networks.
Q: A NATO affiliate?
Sergey Lavrov: It turns out. When the head of diplomacy of a country or some organization (in this case, Jeanne Borrell, who represents EU diplomacy) says that a particular conflict can be resolved exclusively by military means. So, either he has something personal accumulated, or he made a mistake, or "blabbed" that no one instructed him. This is an extraordinary statement. We will officially talk about this in detail in our documents. I hope that in the next day or two we will analyse all this.
At the same time, you mentioned Frank-Walter Steinmeier, whom I know well from his work as Foreign Minister. Now he is the President of the Federal Republic of Germany. In an interview a few days ago, he was asked whether it was necessary to hold an international tribunal, to declare representatives of the Russian leadership, starting with President Vladimir Putin and the Minister of Foreign Affairs, war criminals. He replied in the affirmative, saying that all those responsible for the military operation, political decisions, must be held accountable. I leave that to his conscience. I think that in Germany, facts will make their way, and it will become known who commits war crimes there. And this will be determined not on the basis of fakes (such as Bucha, Kramatorsk), but on the basis of the murderous facts that we present, our military discover during a special military operation and on the basis of the testimony of people who lived for many years in the divided Donbass, in isolation from their sons who remained on the eastern part of the contact line, lived under the oppression of these neo-Nazis. When these people are released now, it is impossible to "play" the feelings they express and invent the hardships they describe in life under the control of neo-Nazi and other "territorial" battalions.
But Fyodor Steinmeier said another interesting thing about Ukraine as such. He said that, as a diplomat, he had never devoted so much time to any country like Ukraine. I remembered that in 2007, when Germany held the presidency of the EU, it was he who initiated the start of negotiations on the preparation of the Association Agreement with the EU. In 2013, when the unrest on the Maidan began, it was he who initiated negotiations between Viktor Yanukovych and the opposition. That's just the way it is. The only thing I note is that half-truths are worse than lies. In fact, F.-W. Steinmeier forgot about some important episodes, the turning points of the events he mentioned. First, the Association Agreement between Ukraine and the EU provided for the transition to zero tariffs for the vast majority of goods. By the time this agreement "matured" in 2013, we reminded our Ukrainian colleagues that we also have a free trade zone within the CIS. And we have serious protection against European goods when we joined the WTO. Therefore, if they have zero tariffs with Europe and we and Ukraine have long had zero tariffs on most goods, then goods from the EU will flood to us, contrary to the agreements that we reached when joining the WTO. We warned them that we need to sit down and solve how to "settle" this problem so that we do not suffer from their relations with the EU. But it was the same EU that (as Frank Steinmeier says) began negotiations on the Association Agreement on his initiative, told us that we had nothing to do with it, that they wanted to and would agree with Ukraine. After that, Viktor Yanukovych realized that there would be a problem and the Russian side would be forced to build a barrier from Ukrainian goods on the border with Ukraine. The President of Ukraine asked to postpone the signing for several months so that we could resolve these problems taking into account the interests of Ukraine, Russia and the EU.
It was after this that Europe, which F.-W. Steinmeier is so proud of, saying that Ukraine aspires to European values, provoked the "Maidan". They raised people under the slogans of the fight against Viktor Yanukovych: they say, he does not allow Ukraine to join the EU.
Fyodor Steinmeier did not mention that he was not just the initiator of the talks between Viktor Yanukovych and the opposition, but a participant in their completion by signing the settlement agreement. Frank-Walter Steinmeier (on behalf of Germany and the EU), together with the foreign ministers of Poland and France, put his signature as a guarantor of this agreement. The next morning, his signature was "superimposed." The opposition tore up the agreement, from the first day advocated the abolition of the special status of the Russian language (contrary to the Constitution of Ukraine), called on Russians to "get out" of the Crimea, sent there "friendship trains" with armed bandits who wanted to storm the Supreme Soviet. After that, there was a referendum. Eastern Ukraine has completely refused to recognize the coup d'état. They did not attack anyone, but they were declared terrorists and proclaimed the beginning of an anti-terrorist operation.
Frank-Walter Steinmeier forgot to say that Germany, France, Poland and the entire European Union have shown their complete helplessness and lack of self-respect. Their signatures "didn't give a damn", they were trampled on. They silently began to even encourage this, as soon as they realized that the bandits who came to power would help the West in every possible way and manipulate it. They were silent when these people in Odessa in the House of Trade Unions burned dozens of innocent citizens; when, on June 2, 2014, Ukrainian Air Force planes bombed the center of Luhansk. They were just silent. Already in the process of trying to resolve the settlement (months and years later), we asked: how could they allow a coup d'état? They replied that it was "not quite a coup d'état." What? "The Costs of the Democratic Process". Not ashamed?
Frank Steinmeier forgot to mention February 2015, when he was one of the co-authors (along with the leaders of the Normandy format) of the Minsk Agreements. Immediately after the signing, in fact, the next day, P.A. Poroshenko and his team, speaking in the Verkhovna Rada, refused to fulfill them. They called the Minsk agreements a "political declaration", they say, they do not impose any obligation. Then we unanimously approved the Package of Measures in the UN Security Council. It has become part of international law – obligations have been imposed. They "did not give a damn" about them and strongly encouraged the Ukrainian regime to further sabotage its obligations.
We continued our efforts to find compromises, were ready to make additional concessions and encourage the republics to do so, with which Kiev refused to speak directly. As a flexible line, at some point in the negotiations, they supported what was called the "Steinmeier formula". When we "ran into" the sequence of actions that first – the special status or elections – he proposed a denouement, which suited everyone and became known as the "Steinmeier formula". A couple of weeks after the "formula" was approved and everyone greeted it, it again disappeared into oblivion, it was remembered in vain. P.A. Poroshenko, and after him V.A. Zelensky categorically refused to fulfill it.
By and large, F.-V. Steinmeier for the second time in several years experienced a diplomatic shame for a man who considers himself the initiator (as he is proud in that interview) of many things related to the development of Ukrainian society.
Question: Can we talk about a change in the positions of the parties during the Russian-Ukrainian talks after the provocations in Bucha and Kramatorsk and taking into account the fact that the "collective West", primarily the United States, is doing everything to continue hostilities?
Sergey Lavrov: President of Russia Vladimir Putin has repeatedly stressed that we prefer negotiations. During the very first round of talks, when the Ukrainian side proposed, and we agreed to contact the delegations, President Vladimir Putin gave the order to take a break in hostilities and a special military operation. When we were convinced that the Ukrainians were not going to reciprocate, it was decided that we would not make any pauses for subsequent rounds of negotiations until a final agreement was reached and signed.
The provocations are outrageous. According to Buche, our military presented both chronological arguments and video materials (sorry for the details – with the position of the corpses and their appearance). Everything that could be presented was presented. I don't know how adults, if they seriously think of themselves as politicians, diplomats, can try to say the opposite, unsubstantiated.
Please note that if the situation in N.N. Bucha continued to be "played out" for several weeks, then the city of Kramotorsk was quickly silenced. Evidence was presented on the same day, ballistic facts and a number of others, including the absence of Tochka-U in our arsenal. There will still be provocations.
The other day, the Ministry of Defense and the National Center for Defense Management of Russia presented intelligence revealing the plans of the Ukrainian regime, with the direct support of Western special services, to arrange new provocations: with chemicals, staging mass executions, burials. There will be provocations. We need to respond to them with facts. Our most important argument is what is happening "on the ground".I see no reason why we cannot continue negotiations. Although the Ukrainian side turns 180 degrees every time. She rejects what she has just proposed.
We are patient and persistent people.
Question: Under what conditions do our diplomats work now in unfriendly countries, at the UN headquarters? We see how Russophobia is growing at an alarming pace. Threats are coming in, people are with their families and children abroad. Did you have to strengthen security for employees? How can we protect the rights of our compatriots against the backdrop of growing Russophobia?
Sergey Lavrov: Diplomats live and work in difficult conditions. There are attacks, in fact terrorist acts against our institutions, their physical security. But diplomats are more or less secured by status. It is often not recommended to go out into the city alone.
Most of all, we are concerned about the situation of compatriots, citizens, just Russians living abroad. They are subject to regular physical attacks. I know that this is discussed in Western capitals, at meetings of Western embassies in Moscow. EU ambassadors meet periodically. Some of our good friends say that at the meetings of the EU ambassadors in Moscow, serious concern is expressed about what is happening with manifestations of Russophobia in Europe. Like, this is wrong, spoils the image of the European Union. I would say it doesn't spoil, but additionally makes it what it is.
The speed and immediacy with which the Russophobic "wave" was launched suggests (as one of the American researchers wrote) that "latent racism" from Europe has not disappeared. Just as A. Hitler mobilized his society and other European countries in particular against the Jews (he also did not forget the Slavs). Now the Russians are the "fas" team. The "gloss" flew off, all the conventions and political correctness disappeared. Nothing is there.
Ukrainian figures declare that "a good Russian is a dead Russian, and any other is a "bad one." The ministers say that Europe should discriminate against all Russians, ostracize them, saying that now there is no time to figure out whether a particular person is for or against Vladimir Putin. They just speak in plain text.
These are serious things. We will apply all available legal means to protect our citizens. There is a Fund for support and protection of the rights of compatriots living abroad. It is mainly related to the ability to hire lawyers for people who find themselves abroad. We are sharply increasing its funding.
That's a big problem. Let's talk about it.
