June Bamber, did not attend bible class evening before she was killed...

[Patti]

Yes of course Patti,and I doubt the veracity of the statement because the twins would have told Colin. It's such a terrible situation when the mother becomes unfit to look after her children and this case through no fault of her own. I don't think there was any real damage done because Sheila was guilty of omission rather than wilful neglect,which Colin rectified those last months anyway. It may have been the excuse Jeremy needed in his own mind to do away with his sister and nephews as well as his parents,who in my opinion were the real target.

It is Steve, I totally agree with you.

When you read Colin's book it makes you feel for her, because she wanted children so much and was fearful that she might not be able to carry them, should she become pregnant again bless, then she had twins.   Unfortunately things stated to go terribly wrong for her from then on.  I often think if she would be better, or would have coped better in her later years. 

[lookout]

 You can still suffer depression while pregnant as well as afterwards.Though it can still appear 6 months or so after a pregnancy,so chances are that Sheila suffered at the age of 17 and got steadily worse with each pregnancy.

[gringo]

Alias, I have read through Freddie's WS twice and although he admits to feeling scared I cannot find anywhere where he says he was in fear of his life.

April, I have also read Freddie's statement and whilst it does not actually use the words "in fear of his life"; any honest reading of Freddie's statement makes quite clear that this was the case.
  "extremely frightened not only for her but for myself"
  "kept talking about the Devil and God"
  "Sheila became even more violent and abusive"
  "I became extremely concerned for my own safety"
  "Tara's husband called to collect his daughter ...... I had arranged this as I felt something nasty might happen. I was extremely scared for everyone's safety. At that time I felt Sheila may use violence towards someone"
   "Sheila was behaving like a person possessed rambling about the Devil and God"
   "I spoke to Sheila about the night.... and she could not remember anything about it. I feel she believed I made it up.
   I would add she could not recognise anyone who came to the flat and that she believed everyone was trying to hurt or kill her."

      All of the above are directly quoted from the statement of Freddie that you read twice.
     Now when you read this statement "twice", did you skim read it looking for the exact words fear and life
 or did you read it thoroughly?  I find it difficult to believe that anyone could read that statement and not feel that Freddie did not convey fear for his life but all that you discerned from the above was that Freddie, "admitted to feeling scared".
       

[Patti]

You can still suffer depression while pregnant as well as afterwards.Though it can still appear 6 months or so after a pregnancy,so chances are that Sheila suffered at the age of 17 and got steadily worse with each pregnancy.

You can Lookout. Poor lass never had it good did she. I always think of the hot tempered letter from Jeremy blaming CC for her inability to cope. He told him straight in a way, he said something like you knew she would not be able to cope.  He more or less blamed Colin. 

[Alias]

April, I have also read Freddie's statement and whilst it does not actually use the words "in fear of his life"; any honest reading of Freddie's statement makes quite clear that this was the case.
  "extremely frightened not only for her but for myself"
  "kept talking about the Devil and God"
  "Sheila became even more violent and abusive"
  "I became extremely concerned for my own safety"
  "Tara's husband called to collect his daughter ...... I had arranged this as I felt something nasty might happen. I was extremely scared for everyone's safety. At that time I felt Sheila may use violence towards someone"
   "Sheila was behaving like a person possessed rambling about the Devil and God"
   "I spoke to Sheila about the night.... and she could not remember anything about it. I feel she believed I made it up.
   I would add she could not recognise anyone who came to the flat and that she believed everyone was trying to hurt or kill her."

      All of the above are directly quoted from the statement of Freddie that you read twice.
     Now when you read this statement "twice", did you skim read it looking for the exact words fear and life
 or did you read it thoroughly?  I find it difficult to believe that anyone could read that statement and not feel that Freddie did not convey fear for his life but all that you discerned from the above was that Freddie, "admitted to feeling scared".
     

Hi gringo! No matter how you twist or turn this, fact remains, the episode was very serious. Thanks for transcribing!

[lookout]

You can Lookout. Poor lass never had it good did she. I always think of the hot tempered letter from Jeremy blaming CC for her inability to cope. He told him straight in a way, he said something like you knew she would not be able to cope.  He more or less blamed Colin. 

That's right Patti. Contrary to belief, Jeremy was very protective of his sister.

[gringo]

Hi gringo! No matter how you twist or turn this, fact remains, the episode was very serious. Thanks for transcribing!

You're welcome, Alias, I think it is a fair summation to say that Freddie was in fear for his life; to claim otherwise is wilful blindness.

[Jane]

You're welcome, Alias, I think it is a fair summation to say that Freddie was in fear for his life; to claim otherwise is wilful blindness.

Say it any way you like, Gringo. Post his statement, pick out words, SKIM READ, but NOWHERE in it will you find the words that Freddie was in fear of his life DESPITE that you've lumped all of those sentences together to make it appear that he did. He MAY have been scared for his life, but my point was, in response to Alias saying he SAID he feared for his life, that he DIDN'T say those words. Pedantic -probably- but no more so than others regularly are.

[Mr. Gee]

Say it any way you like, Gringo. Post his statement, pick out words, SKIM READ, but NOWHERE in it will you find the words that Freddie was in fear of his life DESPITE that you've lumped all of those sentences together to make it appear that he did. He MAY have been scared for his life, but my point was, in response to Alias saying he SAID he feared for his life, that he DIDN'T say those words. Pedantic -probably- but no more so than others regularly are.

He may not have been, but you too must admit as you read that quote that he was pretty terrified at the time. I don't think it matters a bit whether it was his life he was in fear of. The fact of the matter is that taken in context he was "in fear". It shocked him to the core it seems?

[Jane]

He may not have been, but you too must admit as you read that quote that he was pretty terrified at the time. I don't think it matters a bit whether it was his life he was in fear of. The fact of the matter is that taken in context he was "in fear". It shocked him to the core it seems?

Grahame, who of us wouldn't have been shocked to the core? ESPECIALLY so had we been the one who may have provided her with the funds to buy something which may have given rise to her behaviour. Freddie was in an invidious position. After all, what, EXACTLY was he, in her life. Friend, confident, money lender, drug dealer, lover? Bottom line is, it SEEMS he may have found himself responsible for her. As a MARRIED man, I doubt this was what he wanted...........so YES, he probably WAS in fear of his life, but he DIDN'T say those words.

[Mr. Gee]

Grahame, who of us wouldn't have been shocked to the core? ESPECIALLY so had we been the one who may have provided her with the funds to buy something which may have given rise to her behaviour. Freddie was in an invidious position. After all, what, EXACTLY was he, in her life. Friend, confident, money lender, drug dealer, lover? Bottom line is, it SEEMS he may have found himself responsible for her. As a MARRIED man, I doubt this was what he wanted...........so YES, he probably WAS in fear of his life, but he DIDN'T say those words.

Probably not? Just like Ralph wasn't afraid of his life when he allegedly called Jeremy that night.

[lookout]

 Local news this morning said that about 3/4 of the women in Styal prison suffered from mental problems. We can only guess what some of their crimes were.
When I was working,a woman came to maternity,handcuffed to the prison officer,and the poor woman was in labour. She had her child,but the baby didn't go back with her.
This stuck in my mind for ages after,and on seeing this news this morning,it brought it back to me. I couldn't help but think how cruel and dispassionate to see the woman in pain and still restrained by the officer.
I admit to not knowing the circumstances at the time.
This was my second experience of someone being in pain and handcuffed.The first some years ago whilst I was training when a man was admitted and he was handcuffed to " cot-sides " on his bed and all you could hear was him rattling the cuffs against the steel sides.That used to frighten me to death.

[Adam]

Show me the source document where it was said it was impossible for her to shoot herself twice?

Here is the document explaining why it was not raised in the first place

It is in 'The Inheritance Killers' Youtube video. Which I have posted several times. I will find this 'secondary' source for you.

Poor work by the documentary research department for getting it wrong. Or did they ?

[Adam]

http://youtu.be/_LNqtwFjFBM

4.45.

[lookout]

 Claire Powell,in her book,described Freddie as having been " extremely concerned for his own safety ". To which the only calming influence when Sheila was ranting,was her father.

Can you imagine Sheilas' temperament changing for the worst when her father decided enough was enough and began supporting June ?   I certainly can !