The murder of 14 year-old schoolgirl Jodi Jones near Edinburgh on 30 June 2003

[sandra L]

Hello!

I lost my password and couldn't post for a bit - thanks to admins, I'm back!

There are a few questions which have arisen since I was last able to post - will get onto them tomorrow!

[sandra L]

who did the moped belong to jof or gd.

Apparently, the bike belonged to JoF but was kept at GD's. From what I was able to gather, a few of their crowd were into "scrambling" or dirt bikes - I know, for example that JoJ had a "motor bike" (no further description) but, according to his mother, he didn't have one on June 30th.

[sandra L]

could it possible be the jof wering the helmet and not gd and the staements got mixed up somehow.

Not really, nugnug, because it was GD himself who said he was wearing a baseball cap (JoF didn't mention wearing anything on his head.)

But the description of the two youths (one wearing a baseball cap, the other with short dark hair) was included in the police appeal for them to come forward. So when they eventually came forward having "recognised themselves" from the police appeal (or rather, Dickie's mother having "recognised" them), they did not match the description given by the witnesses - if they did, the description would have to have been "one wearing a baseball cap, the other with reddish brown curly hair.)

The witnesses were well close enough to have seen the difference between hair colours and styles - they were messing around on the bike "like lunatics" in the yard of Basically Tools and were "chased" off.

Bearing in mind these two were perfectly happy to lie their heads off when they spoke to the police on June 5th and 6th, did Dickie claim to be wearing the baseball cap simply to further muddy the waters, and if so, why would he do so?

[nugnug]

where were they going with this moped if i rember rightlyi think jaf was mentioned were they going to his hous.

[sandra L]

They were just "mucking about" with it - after JoF picked up GD from the jobcentre, they messed about in the woods for a bit on it, then headed back to GD's. JoF claimed he was working on the bike when GD was at the jobcentre because it wasn't running properly - I don't think there was a plan to go to JoF's house with it. (According to other statements, by then, JoF was living with AW, not his mother).

[nugnug]

They were just "mucking about" with it - after JoF picked up GD from the jobcentre, they messed about in the woods for a bit on it, then headed back to GD's. JoF claimed he was working on the bike when GD was at the jobcentre because it wasn't running properly - I don't think there was a plan to go to JoF's house with it. (According to other statements, by then, JoF was living with AW, not his mother).

so if the bike was stored at gds for jof to be working on it he would of had to have been at gds before he picked gd up from the jobcentre but thats asuming it was jof on the moped wich we now think it wasnt this is all geting rather confusing.

[sandra L]

Like everything in this case!

According to JuJ, JoF was in her house with JoJ until after 3.23pm. GD claimed to have left his house around 3.15pm, his mother taking him to Dalkeith for his Jobcentre appointment.

Somewhere in all of this, Jof apparently called GD from his (JoF's) mother's house and was in GD's house before 3pm, in order to be working on the bike. (If he didn't arrive until after 3.15pm, GD couldn't have seen and spoken to him there.)

There is one irrefutable, undeniable fact in all of this - JoF could not have been in two (or maybe three) places at once. So where was he? JuJ's house or GD's house?

If he wasn't in JuJ's house, the reason for the cancellation call to the doctor (that JoF and JoJ were going to be in JoJ's room smoking cannabis) cannot be correct, leaving the question, what was the real reason for the cancellation call?

If he was in JuJ's house, the only way for him to have been the other youth on the moped is for him to have left JuJ's house on receipt of a call from GD from the Jobcentre at 4.20, gone round to GD's house and picked up the bike, then set off for Dalkeith.  That would have meant the timing of their sighting at the Tool Hire place ruled out their story of "mucking about in the woods on the bike for a bit" - by the time JoF got to GD's house, got the bike, got to Dalkeith and picked up GD, there would be very little time left for "mucking about" before they emerged in the Tool Hire grounds.

Or, alternatively, he went to GD's house, even though GD was not there, worked on the bike in GD's garden and was coincidentally, right there when GD called at 4.20pm. Nobody ever suggested that was what he did and the only person who would have been able to verify it would have been GD's dad (since his mum was already out and the other friend who was in the house that afternoon left with her and GD).

What I've never been able to get my head around is why the police didn't go back to all of them and say, this can't be right - between 2.30pm and 3pm, JoF was, according to all of your statements, in two places at once. Nope, accepted all of the statements as "fact" even though, as I've just shown, someone had to be mistaken ... or lying.

[nugnug]

is jof an only child or did he have a brothe or sister.

[nugnug]

Like everything in this case!

According to JuJ, JoF was in her house with JoJ until after 3.23pm. GD claimed to have left his house around 3.15pm, his mother taking him to Dalkeith for his Jobcentre appointment.

Somewhere in all of this, Jof apparently called GD from his (JoF's) mother's house and was in GD's house before 3pm, in order to be working on the bike. (If he didn't arrive until after 3.15pm, GD couldn't have seen and spoken to him there.)

There is one irrefutable, undeniable fact in all of this - JoF could not have been in two (or maybe three) places at once. So where was he? JuJ's house or GD's house?

If he wasn't in JuJ's house, the reason for the cancellation call to the doctor (that JoF and JoJ were going to be in JoJ's room smoking cannabis) cannot be correct, leaving the question, what was the real reason for the cancellation call?

If he was in JuJ's house, the only way for him to have been the other youth on the moped is for him to have left JuJ's house on receipt of a call from GD from the Jobcentre at 4.20, gone round to GD's house and picked up the bike, then set off for Dalkeith.  That would have meant the timing of their sighting at the Tool Hire place ruled out their story of "mucking about in the woods on the bike for a bit" - by the time JoF got to GD's house, got the bike, got to Dalkeith and picked up GD, there would be very little time left for "mucking about" before they emerged in the Tool Hire grounds.

Or, alternatively, he went to GD's house, even though GD was not there, worked on the bike in GD's garden and was coincidentally, right there when GD called at 4.20pm. Nobody ever suggested that was what he did and the only person who would have been able to verify it would have been GD's dad (since his mum was already out and the other friend who was in the house that afternoon left with her and GD).

What I've never been able to get my head around is why the police didn't go back to all of them and say, this can't be right - between 2.30pm and 3pm, JoF was, according to all of your statements, in two places at once. Nope, accepted all of the statements as "fact" even though, as I've just shown, someone had to be mistaken ... or lying.

theres something else wrong who the bloody hell that as excuse for cancelling an appointment.

[sandra L]

Sorry, should have clarified - the "official excuse" (the one given to the doctor's receptionist) was that the family were away for the day and wouldn't be home in time (made from the family landline... oh dear).

The reason given to the police was the smoking cannabis in the bedroom one.

[sandra L]

is jof an only child or did he have a brothe or sister.

YW, Jodi's cousin, was JoF's half sister - I don't know about any other siblings.

[nugnug]

asuming he wasnt on the moped did he place himself there to save his own skin or somone elses.

[sandra L]

I don't understand any of it! He doesn't fit the description of the youth with "short dark hair" but a couple of days later, he gets his hair cut really, really short. Next, according to him, he says AW told him not to go to the police because he was on the path "too early." If AW didn't tell him that, he was taking a hell of a risk - it would only have taken the police asking AW and the other relative if they said this, them denying all knowledge, and boom! The police are now thinking, "Why did he lie to us about that?" Then he lied about the time he was on the path, blaming a clock "at the wrong time."

Another reasonable interpretation is that he didn't "know" what time he was at GD's, he didn't "know" what time the bike was on the path (all that could be proven was that he took a call from GD at 4.20pm) and he didn't "know" he should go to police because he wasn't there at all.

But why would anyone place themselves at the scene of a brutal murder ... unless, of course, everybody knew there was only ever going to be one "suspect" and one conviction?

[gordo30]

When we were talking about the hoodie one thing been bothering me, with th eblood on inside of hood and under arm same side I believe the only explanation was that Jodi was lying on her side arm extended and bleeding from an injury. The problem I have is that it was likely that Jodi was unconscious at this point as it would have taken time for blood to flow to the areas it was found.
The thing is I always thought the clothes were taken of during the initial fight but it would seem that wasn't the case then, so at what point are they removed and the defender wounds inflicted? Was she possibly stripped when she was unconscious but then would she be able to put up the fight she did having just gained consciousness ?

[nugnug]

the only I can think is he was even closer to the murder scene and thought the bike story would be better than the real one or he was covering for the person who really was on the moped.