Author Topic: The murder of 14 year-old schoolgirl Jodi Jones near Edinburgh on 30 June 2003  (Read 730356 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
The dog trainer has never been publicly named, nugnug.

Jodi's trainers (DCs) were dark blue with white piping and laces .

Jodi always wore her glasses, yes.

From memory, Luke sent the first message, but I'm far from sure on that, and would have to check. JuJ seemed to think Jodi "must have" texted Luke (since, according to JuJ, she had just ungrounded Jodi), however, for that to be the case, there would have had to be three texts - one from Jodi saying "Hey, I've just been ungrounded, are you coming out tonight" one from Luke saying "Cool, you want to come down here after tea?" and a third from Jodi saying, "Sure, I'll be down later."

But the official line is that there ere only 2 texts, from memory, Luke saying, "Are you coming out tonight, fancy coming down here after tea" and the response from Jodi "Yeah, I'll be down (or see you there) later."

Jodi never had her phone so why would Luke know which phone to text, different if he was texted first then he would just respond to the number he was texted on. I don't see him just text JuJ in case she was nowhere near Jodi at the time.

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
The bra strap was found furthest away from the body but closer to the V break, did Jodi try and get away from the attack and run to the V for safety but was grabbed by her attacker by the bra, it was found with the hooks and plastic fastening all stretched out of place .

Offline sandra L

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 975
Does anyone remember what jodi wore to school that day? I'm not sure if the schools in the area were strict when it came to wearing uniforms but being the last week and a lot of kids away on a trip they might have been relaxed on what you were allowed to wear. Luke certainly wore casual clothes but was wondering if that was normal.

Nobody knows for sure, Gordo. Her mum couldn't remember, but said she went upstairs to get changed. Luke remembered she was wearing her baggy trousers, but couldn't remember what she was wearing on top, and nobody else who was asked had any idea.

The school tried to be strict about uniform, but there were some kids who rebelled against it and, as you say, it was the last week, some of the kids were away, so they'd likely have been more relaxed about it. However, it's not a question I've ever seen having been asked of the teachers/head teacher.

BTW the reference to "baggy trousers" referred to the width of the legs (a different version of "flares" or Boot-cuts," if you get understand what I mean.) It didn't mean they were "too big" in terms of fit.

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
The deftones were formed in 1988 a year before Jodi was born but they had anew album out in 2003 so that might account for a rise in their popularity with younger people, their logo was a horse with their name underneath in red and sometimes orange was this the logo that was on the hoodie?

We wondered why AB hadn't seen it when she witnessed the people she saw but what about the two independent witnesses at 15:05? In fact how did they describe what jodi was wearing at that time?

Offline sandra L

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 975
Does anyone have links to the diagrams curious made about the DNA?

Shoe
http://i.imgur.com/gr9cb.png

Underwear
http://i.imgur.com/K3apn.png

Trousers
http://i.imgur.com/pSctL.png

Body-front
http://i.imgur.com/uVNOy.png

Body-back
http://i.imgur.com/AmPsW.png

Jacket
http://i.imgur.com/9CToK.png

T-shirt
http://i.imgur.com/uzKcB.png

Bra
http://i.imgur.com/Tcnqq.png

A helpful map
http://i.imgur.com/8g52b.jpg

Quote
There were a lot of samples of semen found but there were others like possible sweat, saliva and hairs but is there anything to suggest if ameligenin test were performed to determine wether or not these samples were male or female?

Some were not tested - just listed as "believed to be....(e.g. saliva). Others (e.g. the "white/colourless hairs) were simply listed as "no reportable result" - not very helpful when we don't know what they were testing for, and others still just disappeared from the investigation - we have them logged, but there's no paper trail to say where they went or what was done with them.

Quote
Also we know SK's profile was either taken or they had it as he went over the wall but were the DNA from the other members of the search party taken?
Yes, but it's not clear when - there are statements several days later saying "I was asked to give a sample for DNA purposes" but it doesn't say if that was on the day the statement was taken, or if they forgot to take the statement at the time,, and went back for it later.

Offline sandra L

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 975
Jodi never had her phone so why would Luke know which phone to text, different if he was texted first then he would just respond to the number he was texted on. I don't see him just text JuJ in case she was nowhere near Jodi at the time.

Very good point, Gordo! So where is the other text? It's not as if Jodi texted to say, "I'll meet you at such and such a place" and Luke just texted back to say "OK."

JuJ said she'd just ungrounded Jodi - if that was the case, Jodi couldn't have known if Luke had made alternative plans for the evening, so would have to have said "Can we meet up tonight?" or something similar. Luke would then have texted back with the suggestion that she come to Newbattle, but she would have had to reply to that, so that he knew she was coming down.

Alternatively, Luke's story is that he suggested Jodi come down, and she said she would be down "later" - as you point out, the suggestion that Jodi come to Newbattle had to be in response to an initial text from Jodi, otherwise, how would he have known which phone to text her on?

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
Very good point, Gordo! So where is the other text? It's not as if Jodi texted to say, "I'll meet you at such and such a place" and Luke just texted back to say "OK."

JuJ said she'd just ungrounded Jodi - if that was the case, Jodi couldn't have known if Luke had made alternative plans for the evening, so would have to have said "Can we meet up tonight?" or something similar. Luke would then have texted back with the suggestion that she come to Newbattle, but she would have had to reply to that, so that he knew she was coming down.

Alternatively, Luke's story is that he suggested Jodi come down, and she said she would be down "later" - as you point out, the suggestion that Jodi come to Newbattle had to be in response to an initial text from Jodi, otherwise, how would he have known which phone to text her on?

If luke had also taken it upon himself to just text JuJ out of the blue the chances are that JuJ would have read it and im guessing it would have been the only text she had had from luke so might have remembered or should have been clear as to what it said.

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
Some were not tested - just listed as "believed to be....(e.g. saliva). Others (e.g. the "white/colourless hairs) were simply listed as "no reportable result" - not very helpful when we don't know what they were testing for, and others still just disappeared from the investigation - we have them logged, but there's no paper trail to say where they went or what was done with them.

I just want to be certain Sandra none of these samples found on the clothing were ever tested specifically to determine if they were male or female?

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
Another random question sry ;D

Who all smoked between jodi's family and lukes?

Offline sandra L

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 975
The bra strap was found furthest away from the body but closer to the V break, did Jodi try and get away from the attack and run to the V for safety but was grabbed by her attacker by the bra, it was found with the hooks and plastic fastening all stretched out of place .

But that would have to mean, presumably, that she was not wearing her t shirt and  hoodie at that point - I'd imagine it would be well nigh impossible to tear off a bra strap through two layers of clothing, and then have that bra strap drop independently of the other clothing.

I'd always assumed the two pound coins had fallen out of Jodi's hoodie pocket- now that I think about it, they could have fallen from the pocket of her trousers, but why were they with the bra strap?

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
The initial fight may have occurred at the same point but jodi could have tried to escape by that same route at a different time during the fight, she certainly was not fully clothed at some point during the assault.

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
I wish i hadn't asked for the diagrams now they just confuse everything.

Why is every item contaminated by singular sperm cells!! we can produce up to 200 million in one ejaculaton so why just singular ones dotted around every item of clothing apart from the hoodie?and why not on the body where we know they are on the bra and inside cups of the bra specifically. Ok being left out overnight in the rain may account for it to a point but then fine hairs were there also and not dislodged.

The combination of brown and colourless hairs may suggest someone with highlights? did anyone have hair like that connected to this crime?

Offline sandra L

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 975
Part of the problem with the sperm heads, I believe, is the information that "items were gathered up" before the forensics team got there. What was transferred in that one action, and from what, to what?

The sperm heads on the upper front of the T shirt, for example, could  have been deposited by folding one side onto the other after the items were gathered up, giving the impression of two smaller samples where, there may, originally, have been one larger sample.

Alternatively (and please forgive me, there is no more delicate way of putting this). hands/fingers which had been in contact with semen could account for the transfer of single, or small numbers of sperm heads had those hands/fingers come into contact with the items of clothing.

The bit I really don't understand is the recovery of sperm heads from inside the padding of the bra. Surface level, fair enough, could have been contact transfer, but inside the padding?

The brown hairs were mostly described as "long," (I remember one being 7" long), the colourless/white hairs described as "short" - some as small as 1cm.

One of the forensic hair reports, I have never forgotten. It stated that two long brown hairs had been recovered, cut at both ends. One of them had a root. I may not be forensically qualified, but I even I know that a hair cut "at both ends" can't still be attached to its root!!


Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
I can't help thinking inside padding was due to maybe old washing transferral or something similar, it's also plausible with what you have written that these were transferred via contact with other clothes or fingers but what about the hoodie? It's could of course been processed correctly by someone else. In true form with this case though it throws up problems when you think you have answers as wasn't there a single sperm head found on the vaginal swab also.

Offline gordo30

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 767
The whole clothing angle where we have the police asking SK about the possiblities that jodi shared/took JaJ's clothes was put to SK in the first interview is that right?
We also have Jodi's aunts giving out details that jodi was always using JaJ's clothes sometime before that? or after?
AW doing the washing the very day after the body was discovered.