The last ultimate test of gun, to prove sound moderator was not used in shooting

[mike tesko]

There is no evidence the impressions are Sheila's.  There is no proof that is Sheila's foot either or that it is blood on the foot. In any event she would have to have walked over the blood stained rug to get to the other side for Jeremy to kill her.

What would be significant would be if she had cuts on her feet from the broken crockery in the kitchen or left footprints in Nevill's blood from the kitchen but that didn't happen.

EXCUSE ME, can you say anything constructive other than, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE", of course there is some fucking evidence, shut the fuck up...

[mike tesko]

We now know, that two bodies were found when police entered the kitchen, we know that one of the bodies was a male, which had previously been described as the body of a female by an officer looking in through the kitchen window, he saying that the female body was behind the door (prior to entry being achieved). We know now, that that body behind the door was a male body, the body of Ralph Bamber, a mistake over the sex of this body sorted upon entry being gained into the kitchen, so that is that sorted out...

Please don't anybody say, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE OF THAT / THIS", for fuck sake, because, in a nutshell, there is clear evidence that this is what did occur, this did happen, and the mix up was sorted once police entered the kitchen and found Ralph Bambers body behind the kitchen door, not the body of a female, but the body of one male (7.37am)...

"AND", the body of one dead female, found upon entry to kitchen"...

Two bodies in the kitchen then, by 7.37am, not one body, misidentified as a female when it was a male body...

SORTED...

[mike tesko]

We now know, that two bodies were found when police entered the kitchen, we know that one of the bodies was a male, which had previously been described as the body of a female by an officer looking in through the kitchen window, he saying that the female body was behind the door (prior to entry being achieved). We know now, that that body behind the door was a male body, the body of Ralph Bamber, mistake over the sex of this body sorted upon entry being gained into the kitchen, so that is that sorted out...

Please don't anybody say, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE OF THAT / THIS", for fuck sake, because, in a nutshell, there is clear evidence that this is what did occur, this did happen, and the mix up was sorted once police entered the kitchen and found Ralph Bambers body behind the kitchen door, not the body of a female, but the body of one male (7.37am)...

"AND", the body of one dead female, found upon entry to kitchen"...

Two bodies in the kitchen then, by 7.37am, not one body, misidentified as a female when it was a male body...

SORTED...

If true, then only three further bodies from the five occupants known to be inside the farmhouse could have been found elsewhere in the farm house...

Lo and behold, "a further three bodies found upstairs, making a total of five dead in total" (8.10am)...

[mike tesko]

Before we go any further, I would just like to say, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE, THAT THERE IS NO EVIDENCE"...

Fuck off...

[scipio_usmc]

EXCUSE ME, can you say anything constructive other than, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE", of course there is some fucking evidence, shut the fuck up...

I didn't write something constructive, I described evidence that would actually be useful in suggesting guilt but which was absent.  To someone trying to figure out the truth such is constructive.  To you it is not constructive because your agenda is to blame Sheila so you consider only things that implicate her constructive.

[mike tesko]

Before we go any further, I would just like to say, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE, THAT THERE IS NO EVIDENCE"...

Fuck off...

Those of us on this side of the fence will decide what is evidence, and those on the other side, decide what they claim is evidence, it is not up to me or us to say there is no evidence to support what the other side is claiming, in the same way it is not for them to decide what is evidence that we seek to rely upon to support our case...

[mike tesko]

I didn't write something constructive, I described evidence that would actually be useful in suggesting guilt but which was absent.  To someone trying to figure out the truth such is constructive.  To you it is not constructive because your agenda is to blame Sheila so you consider only things that implicate her constructive.

Stop putting fucking words into my mouth, I am not blaming fucking Sheila for killing herself, I am not blaming Jeremy for killing her, I am not blaming some as yet unidentified killer for killing her, don't attribute things to me which I am not saying, don't keep misrepresenting what I am saying, don't keep twisting the things I have said when referring to matters others have talked about, keep to the established facts, I do not want to keep hearing you say, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE", because that is simply not true, of course there is some evidence, there's plenty of evidence, only you don't have access to it, but for my part I have got access to more than I need to be able to say there is evidence to support the claims I have made on behalf of others, and myself...

"THERE IS AN ABUNDANCE OF EVIDENCE", supporting much of what everybody has to say, no matter which side of the fence you might sit on...

We can debate sensibly, or otherwise, "FUCK OFF", and ignore me and what I am reporting, you will not bully me into silence regarding this case, not even Jeremy himself could do that...

[mike tesko]

Stop putting fucking words into my mouth, I am not blaming fucking Sheila for killing herself, I am not blaming Jeremy for killing her, I am not blaming some as yet unidentified killer for killing her, don't attribute things to me which I am not saying, don't keep misrepresenting what I am saying, don't keep twisting the things I have said when referring to matters others have talked about, keep to the established facts, I do not want to keep hearing you say, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE", because that is simply not true, of course there is some evidence, there's plenty of evidence, only you don't have access to it, but for my part I have got access to more than I need to be able to say there is evidence to support the claims I have made on behalf of others, and myself...

"THERE IS AN ABUNDANCE OF EVIDENCE", supporting much of what everybody has to say, no matter which side of the fence you might sit on...

We can debate sensibly, or otherwise, "FUCK OFF", and ignore me and what I am reporting, you will not bully me into silence regarding this case, not even Jeremy himself could do that...

It is my personal belief that police shot and killed Sheila after they got into the farmhouse, if you disagree with this / that then fine, you believe what you want to believe, I do not believe that the silencer found at the scene by relatives on 10th August 1985, was used in the shootings at all, I do not believe that any blood which could be attributed to Sheila was found inside that silencer. It could not have been found inside that silencer because that silencer (the one found by relatives on 10th August 1985), was not even at the lab' when the key flake of blood was found inside the other silencer sent to the lab' and retained by them from 30th August 1985...

How the fuck could the same silencer found by relatives be at the lab' from 30th August 1985, onwards, yet Ann Eaton still be in possession of the silencer found at the scene by her brother David Boutflour, on 10th August, still be in possession of this until 11th September 1985?

The silencer found by relatives was not used in the shootings, anyone who says otherwise does not know what they are talking about, it is just speculation on their part...

[grahameb]

EXCUSE ME, can you say anything constructive other than, "THERE IS NO EVIDENCE", of course there is some fucking evidence, shut the fuck up...

It appears that there were no footprints of an alleged assailant either Mike? They had ultra violet lights themn to test for blood and apparently they found none on Jeremy, in his house, or on his shoes? If they did they didn't mention it in court. I wonder why they didn't mention that they found nothing incriminating in Jeremy's house? They did examine it the next day apparently.

[scipio_usmc]

It is my personal belief that police shot and killed Sheila after they got into the farmhouse, if you disagree with this / that then fine, you believe what you want to believe,

You suggest more than just that police killed her though.  You suggest they did so hours after the first shot was delivered and moreover after Dr Craig confirmed her death.  That runs against the medical available evidence.  It is hard to believe any of it but particularly when the medical evidence says what you claim is not possible. 

I do not believe that the silencer found at the scene by relatives on 10th August 1985, was used in the shootings at all, I do not believe that any blood which could be attributed to Sheila was found inside that silencer. It could not have been found inside that silencer because that silencer (the one found by relatives on 10th August 1985), was not even at the lab' when the key flake of blood was found inside the other silencer sent to the lab' and retained by them from 30th August 1985...

How the fuck could the same silencer found by relatives be at the lab' from 30th August 1985, onwards, yet Ann Eaton still be in possession of the silencer found at the scene by her brother David Boutflour, on 10th August, still be in possession of this until 11th September 1985?

There is no evidence of the moderator being in Ann's possession after 8/12/85 when it was transferred by her to the police.

 

The silencer found by relatives was not used in the shootings, anyone who says otherwise does not know what they are talking about, it is just speculation on their part...

There is reliable evidence that indicates Sheila's blood was found inside the moderator as well as paint on the outside from the kitchen which suggests it was used on all the victims including Sheila.  It is not just speculation.

You are the one speculating that the blood and paint evidence were planted without having any evidence to prove your claims to be true.  Likewise your speculation about 2 suppressors is not supported by the available evidence.

If you want to believe something you have the right to but when you provide a basis that is not accurate then it becomes an issue to debate. 

[No-Bits]

There is no evidence of the moderator being in Ann's possession after 8/12/85 when it was transferred by her to the police.

Obviously this is the 12th of August rather than 8th of December. Before anybody gets carried away. 

[scipio_usmc]

Obviously this is the 12th of August rather than 8th of December. Before anybody gets carried away. 

Oddly enough no one has mistaken how I date things though I use the American system of month first.

I actually expected an issue with it due to situations in the past but the others here seem to be as perceptive as you in this regard.

I could have used the European system, which actually if often used in military parlance ie 1 September 1939 Germany commenced operating Canned Goods, but decided to see how it went using American terms much like I typically use the American term suppressor to moderator.  On the red forum someone had a fit about that issue but not here so far.  Our battles have pretty much been about the case. 

 

[mike tesko]

There is ample evidence available that relatives did not hand over a silencer to police (albeit on the second occasion) on the 11th September 1985, and that this silencer was fingerprinted by DS Davidson and DS Eastwood on 13th September 1985, and that on the 20th September police sent it to the lab' at Huntingdon, to be checked for BLOOD and FIBRES, and that this particular silencer was examined at the lab' on the 26th September 1985, when red paint from the aga surround in the kitchen at the scene was discovered engrained in its knurled end. There is clear documentary evidence that around the time Ann Eaton handed that silencer over to police in September 1985, that her brother David Boutflour contacted police by telephone on 12th September 1985 to inform police that he had found the gun silencer...

Now which part don't you understand?

How can Ann Eaton and the relatives have the silencer in their possession until 11th September 1985, if Ron Cook kept it in his possession for 17 days from 13th August 1985, and which he supposedly sent to the lab' on the 30th August 1985, inside which was found Sheila's blood? Surely, the silencer the relatives found, and which they did not hand over to police until 11th September 1985, cannot be the same silencer inside which Sheila's blood was present - nothing could be any clearer that what we are talking about are two different silencers, not the same silencer. One silencer found by relatives, which they still had in their possession until 11th September 1985. One silencer found by relatives which was not fingerprinted by Eastwood and Davidson until 13th September 1985. One silencer found by relatives which was not sent to the lab' to be checked for blood and fibres until 20th September 1985. One silencer that did not get examined at the lab' until 26th September 1985 at which point red paint was found upon it - get the facts right, the silencer handed to police by relatives on 11th September 1985, did not have Sheila's blood inside it, it only had red paint ingrained into the knurl of the silencers end cap...

Sheila's blood was found in the other silencer, the one police had sent to the lab' on 30th August 1985...

How is it possible for the relatives to have possession of the same silencer until 11th September 1985, which police had already sent to the lab' on 30th August 1985?

It couldn't have happened, the same silencer could not have been sent to the lab'on 30th August 1985, and still be in the possession of the relatives until 11th September 1985, and not itself sent to the lab' until the 20th September 1985...

IMPOSSIBLE, both silencers can't be the same one, Sheila's blood in one silencer, red paint from the aga in the kitchen on the other silencer...

FACT!!!

[mike tesko]

THE EVIDENCE, disproving the suggestion that there is no evidence:-

Ammunition box
Cardboard box containing silencer and Ammunition
Silencer

Check above items for blood, fibres and fingerprints:-

Above items forwarded to Lab' on 20th September 1985, SC/786/85  Refers...

[mike tesko]

As can be seen, Essex police still had possession of a silencer until the 20th September 1985, and this silencer could not have been the same silencer already at the lab' from 30th August 1985 (DB/1) inside of which was found Sheila Caffells blood...