Further developments regarding phone calls:

[lookout]

Adam would say struggle in the kitchen and I suspect two rifles were used.

I agree,Susan,, including a shotgun too. I rather feel that poor June tried her best too,but came off the worst.

[Adam]

Neville, June, Daniel & Nicholas getting shot & killed in bed while sleeping. And Sheila shot & killed in the twins bedroom. All with only 10 bullets being used, only one for Sheila. All possible.

Someone else finding the bodies, Jeremy did not have a key & probably knew what his job on the farm was on that day. So had no reason to look for anyone.

That is a much more believable murder/suicide crime scene. This is what Jeremy would have attempted.

However the kitchen fight, two rifle reloads & two phone call suggestions makes murder/suicide a lot less likely. Which makes me believe the phone call decision was made on the night to justify Nevilles kitchen presence.

[Adam]

For this to work it would also help if Jeremy did not ring Julie at 3am. Something her flatmates would also witness.


 

[susan]

lookout Sheila had the shotgun to start with and I suspect Ralph took it from her.  Poor June was taken by surprise and had no chance what a sad sad state of affairs.   I think of  Chris Foster who appeared to be fine next thing everyone and animal he loved were shot then himself and people say Sheila would not be capable of killing her family and she showed no signs that this could happen need I say more

[lookout]

Exactly,Susan. The girls' mind was so disturbed,,though sadly,the jury weren't told the extent of her illness,,nor what Doctor Ferguson had confirmed.Instead,,the judge who thought he knew everything,poo-pooed the idea of even mentioning how ill the girl was,latterly.

I wonder if Justice Drake ever dealt with a girl/woman in later cases who'd murdered her children ??

[Adam]

Exactly,Susan. The girls' mind was so disturbed,,though sadly,the jury weren't told the extent of her illness,,nor what Doctor Ferguson had confirmed.Instead,,the judge who thought he knew everything,poo-pooed the idea of even mentioning how ill the girl was,latterly.

I wonder if Justice Drake ever dealt with a girl/woman in later cases who'd murdered her children ??

It seems like you have the court transcript as you know a lot about what the jury were or were not told.

Everyone would love it if it were posted on here.

Thank you.

[tyler]

How do you know Sheila had to reload? Is it not possible that TWO weapons were used? After all,Fletcher could not positively match ten of the bullets to the Anschutz.

[lookout]

You'd do as well to start reading about the case,instead of coming out with inane comments.
What I've posted,is common knowledge from when the forum first began. Why not take those blinkers off for just a while and read Bambergates' posts,,where at least the man has been doing his own investigations,physically,then compiling notes including his own thoughts on the case.

As April mentioned earlier about the " herd mentality ",,well I'm afraid,,you're one of the sheep who find it easier to disagree without knowing the full history of something,,whatever it might be.

The same with the prosecution at Jeremys' trial.Because of all the twists and turns of everyone concerned who were putting in their sixpenn'orth,,there was no proof whatsoever in half of what Jeremy was accused of.
They picked holes in his " large breakfast "-------------which was a lie. What did that have to do with anything ? He could have been a diabetic for all anyone knew,and needed to boost his blood sugar. But we know he wasn't/isn't a diabetic,,and we also know that it was no hearty breakfast.
Apparently,,it was reported that Jeremy had appeared calm at one point outside WHF. That was BEFORE he knew what had happened,,and not after. But that was to add to the " psychopathic mind " of the" killer",,which was to be mentioned at a later date.
In actual fact,,on being told what had happened,he cried uncontrollably,but that was conveniently omitted,,as they were talking about a " killer " here,,and killers don't fall in a heap,crying.
Speaking of crying,,he was even criticised at the funerals,for " pretending " to cry,,so even his sorrow and mourning was ripped to shreds.
Jeremys' every move was being scrutinised.
Then horror of horrors,,RWB nearly broke his neck,hurtling to the police station because Jeremys' friend was homosexual. A dreadful " crime " back in the early 80's.That was as well as mud on the bicycle,,the rusty file,,scouring the nearby fields for fresh wheel marks,,blood on a cobweb.

Adam,,this is only part of their nit-picking in order to secure his conviction after the abysmal investigation into Diane Jones's murder,previously.Heads were already rolling after that,at EP.
Don't you see what I'm getting at ? A witchhunt,pure and simple to justify EP's " marvellous deductions ".

Now if you're as clever as you think you are,,please,please produce the forensic evidence that got him convicted.

[Adam]

You'd do as well to start reading about the case,instead of coming out with inane comments.
What I've posted,is common knowledge from when the forum first began. Why not take those blinkers off for just a while and read Bambergates' posts,,where at least the man has been doing his own investigations,physically,then compiling notes including his own thoughts on the case.

As April mentioned earlier about the " herd mentality ",,well I'm afraid,,you're one of the sheep who find it easier to disagree without knowing the full history of something,,whatever it might be.

The same with the prosecution at Jeremys' trial.Because of all the twists and turns of everyone concerned who were putting in their sixpenn'orth,,there was no proof whatsoever in half of what Jeremy was accused of.
They picked holes in his " large breakfast "-------------which was a lie. What did that have to do with anything ? He could have been a diabetic for all anyone knew,and needed to boost his blood sugar. But we know he wasn't/isn't a diabetic,,and we also know that it was no hearty breakfast.
Apparently,,it was reported that Jeremy had appeared calm at one point outside WHF. That was BEFORE he knew what had happened,,and not after. But that was to add to the " psychopathic mind " of the" killer",,which was to be mentioned at a later date.
In actual fact,,on being told what had happened,he cried uncontrollably,but that was conveniently omitted,,as they were talking about a " killer " here,,and killers don't fall in a heap,crying.
Speaking of crying,,he was even criticised at the funerals,for " pretending " to cry,,so even his sorrow and mourning was ripped to shreds.
Jeremys' every move was being scrutinised.
Then horror of horrors,,RWB nearly broke his neck,hurtling to the police station because Jeremys' friend was homosexual. A dreadful " crime " back in the early 80's.That was as well as mud on the bicycle,,the rusty file,,scouring the nearby fields for fresh wheel marks,,blood on a cobweb.

Adam,,this is only part of their nit-picking in order to secure his conviction after the abysmal investigation into Diane Jones's murder,previously.Heads were already rolling after that,at EP.
Don't you see what I'm getting at ? A witchhunt,pure and simple to justify EP's " marvellous deductions ".

Now if you're as clever as you think you are,,please,please produce the forensic evidence that got him convicted.

You come out with inane comments.

Common knowledge since the forum began ? You mean other people on the forum said it ?

[Adam]

You'd do as well to start reading about the case,instead of coming out with inane comments.
What I've posted,is common knowledge from when the forum first began. Why not take those blinkers off for just a while and read Bambergates' posts,,where at least the man has been doing his own investigations,physically,then compiling notes including his own thoughts on the case.

As April mentioned earlier about the " herd mentality ",,well I'm afraid,,you're one of the sheep who find it easier to disagree without knowing the full history of something,,whatever it might be.

The same with the prosecution at Jeremys' trial.Because of all the twists and turns of everyone concerned who were putting in their sixpenn'orth,,there was no proof whatsoever in half of what Jeremy was accused of.
They picked holes in his " large breakfast "-------------which was a lie. What did that have to do with anything ? He could have been a diabetic for all anyone knew,and needed to boost his blood sugar. But we know he wasn't/isn't a diabetic,,and we also know that it was no hearty breakfast.
Apparently,,it was reported that Jeremy had appeared calm at one point outside WHF. That was BEFORE he knew what had happened,,and not after. But that was to add to the " psychopathic mind " of the" killer",,which was to be mentioned at a later date.
In actual fact,,on being told what had happened,he cried uncontrollably,but that was conveniently omitted,,as they were talking about a " killer " here,,and killers don't fall in a heap,crying.
Speaking of crying,,he was even criticised at the funerals,for " pretending " to cry,,so even his sorrow and mourning was ripped to shreds.
Jeremys' every move was being scrutinised.
Then horror of horrors,,RWB nearly broke his neck,hurtling to the police station because Jeremys' friend was homosexual. A dreadful " crime " back in the early 80's.That was as well as mud on the bicycle,,the rusty file,,scouring the nearby fields for fresh wheel marks,,blood on a cobweb.

Adam,,this is only part of their nit-picking in order to secure his conviction after the abysmal investigation into Diane Jones's murder,previously.Heads were already rolling after that,at EP.
Don't you see what I'm getting at ? A witchhunt,pure and simple to justify EP's " marvellous deductions ".

Now if you're as clever as you think you are,,please,please produce the forensic evidence that got him convicted.

Jeremys breakfast was discussed at court.

You must have the court transcripts. Or did someone else say it on here ?

[Adam]

You'd do as well to start reading about the case,instead of coming out with inane comments.
What I've posted,is common knowledge from when the forum first began. Why not take those blinkers off for just a while and read Bambergates' posts,,where at least the man has been doing his own investigations,physically,then compiling notes including his own thoughts on the case.

As April mentioned earlier about the " herd mentality ",,well I'm afraid,,you're one of the sheep who find it easier to disagree without knowing the full history of something,,whatever it might be.

The same with the prosecution at Jeremys' trial.Because of all the twists and turns of everyone concerned who were putting in their sixpenn'orth,,there was no proof whatsoever in half of what Jeremy was accused of.
They picked holes in his " large breakfast "-------------which was a lie. What did that have to do with anything ? He could have been a diabetic for all anyone knew,and needed to boost his blood sugar. But we know he wasn't/isn't a diabetic,,and we also know that it was no hearty breakfast.
Apparently,,it was reported that Jeremy had appeared calm at one point outside WHF. That was BEFORE he knew what had happened,,and not after. But that was to add to the " psychopathic mind " of the" killer",,which was to be mentioned at a later date.
In actual fact,,on being told what had happened,he cried uncontrollably,but that was conveniently omitted,,as they were talking about a " killer " here,,and killers don't fall in a heap,crying.
Speaking of crying,,he was even criticised at the funerals,for " pretending " to cry,,so even his sorrow and mourning was ripped to shreds.
Jeremys' every move was being scrutinised.
Then horror of horrors,,RWB nearly broke his neck,hurtling to the police station because Jeremys' friend was homosexual. A dreadful " crime " back in the early 80's.That was as well as mud on the bicycle,,the rusty file,,scouring the nearby fields for fresh wheel marks,,blood on a cobweb.

Adam,,this is only part of their nit-picking in order to secure his conviction after the abysmal investigation into Diane Jones's murder,previously.Heads were already rolling after that,at EP.
Don't you see what I'm getting at ? A witchhunt,pure and simple to justify EP's " marvellous deductions ".

Now if you're as clever as you think you are,,please,please produce the forensic evidence that got him convicted.

The police did say Jeremy seemed very calm.

After finding out he went into a field to be sick. But said himself nothing came up.

His funeral crying was more of groan. Looking down & covering his face with his hand.

[Adam]

You'd do as well to start reading about the case,instead of coming out with inane comments.
What I've posted,is common knowledge from when the forum first began. Why not take those blinkers off for just a while and read Bambergates' posts,,where at least the man has been doing his own investigations,physically,then compiling notes including his own thoughts on the case.

As April mentioned earlier about the " herd mentality ",,well I'm afraid,,you're one of the sheep who find it easier to disagree without knowing the full history of something,,whatever it might be.

The same with the prosecution at Jeremys' trial.Because of all the twists and turns of everyone concerned who were putting in their sixpenn'orth,,there was no proof whatsoever in half of what Jeremy was accused of.
They picked holes in his " large breakfast "-------------which was a lie. What did that have to do with anything ? He could have been a diabetic for all anyone knew,and needed to boost his blood sugar. But we know he wasn't/isn't a diabetic,,and we also know that it was no hearty breakfast.
Apparently,,it was reported that Jeremy had appeared calm at one point outside WHF. That was BEFORE he knew what had happened,,and not after. But that was to add to the " psychopathic mind " of the" killer",,which was to be mentioned at a later date.
In actual fact,,on being told what had happened,he cried uncontrollably,but that was conveniently omitted,,as they were talking about a " killer " here,,and killers don't fall in a heap,crying.
Speaking of crying,,he was even criticised at the funerals,for " pretending " to cry,,so even his sorrow and mourning was ripped to shreds.
Jeremys' every move was being scrutinised.
Then horror of horrors,,RWB nearly broke his neck,hurtling to the police station because Jeremys' friend was homosexual. A dreadful " crime " back in the early 80's.That was as well as mud on the bicycle,,the rusty file,,scouring the nearby fields for fresh wheel marks,,blood on a cobweb.

Adam,,this is only part of their nit-picking in order to secure his conviction after the abysmal investigation into Diane Jones's murder,previously.Heads were already rolling after that,at EP.
Don't you see what I'm getting at ? A witchhunt,pure and simple to justify EP's " marvellous deductions ".

Now if you're as clever as you think you are,,please,please produce the forensic evidence that got him convicted.

There is a mountain of forensic & circumstantial evidence which has convicted Jeremy & failed to get him released. Already posted.

[lookout]

 I have come to the conclusion that you're either effing stupid altogether,,or just an aggravating troll who spends his time picking holes in posts all over the internet. You're unbelievably thick as well !

[Jane]

The police did say Jeremy seemed very calm.

After finding out he went into a field to be sick. But said himself nothing came up.

His funeral crying was more of groan. Looking down & covering his face with his hand.

Please stop being facetious. There probably WAS a moment when Jeremy "seemed very calm". A moment out of MANY others.

 If his last meal had been around 9 pm the previous evening, it would have been digested and therefore FAR more likely to have exited South as opposed to North.

I wasn't aware that there was a "set piece" for the display of grief at a funeral. I recall that at the funeral of his beloved son, my partner was completely dry eyed.

[lookout]

Jeremy was calm to the point of waiting for news from within the farmhouse. It was when he was told what had happened, that his calmness reverted to him crying uncontrollably,,which is the most normal function of anyone who is given this kind of news.