Motive for murders - Jeremy versus the relatives...

[Jan]

Adam - in her original statement he mentioned supper - then according to JM - he mentioned nothing else about his family


then in the next very long statement

I said to him ‘you sound pissed off’. He said I have been thinking on the tractor and the crime will have to be tonight or never. I told him not to be so stupid and that he was only saying this because he had had a bad day on the tractor. He also told me that he had only just got back from work and had had supper with his parents and Sheila and the twins and that was why he late in phoning me.


She then went to bed - but said she could not sleep because she knew what he was going to do?? But said nothing.


My other post was from the call in the morning.


If the court transcript is different - then she gave three different versions.

One he made no mention of the deed
two - he mentioned it and she knew what he was going to do
three - he mentioned it but she did not believe him


hmmm - which one is it?

[Steve_uk]

I think Adam's post #149 must be referring to Chapter 27 page 252:

From the beginning Bamber was trying,according to Miss Mugford,to commit the perfect murder,a murder  that would not be discovered. After disregarding a plan to sedate his parents,shoot them and set fire to the house because the insurance cover was too low,he devised a second plan. This was to stage the killings  himself,and make it look as if his sister had committed the crime because she was mad. He told Julie he had found a way to get in and out of the house without trace,leaving through a kitchen window which would appear to have been shut from the inside due to the design of the catch.  "On the evening before the murders",Arlidge said,"he phoned his girlfriend in Lewisham and said he had been thinking of the murders and decided it would be tonight or never. She told him not to be so stupid."

It's not exactly the same thing as #149 Adam.

[Alias]

Adam - in her original statement he mentioned supper - then according to JM - he mentioned nothing else about his family


then in the next very long statement

I said to him ‘you sound pissed off’. He said I have been thinking on the tractor and the crime will have to be tonight or never. I told him not to be so stupid and that he was only saying this because he had had a bad day on the tractor. He also told me that he had only just got back from work and had had supper with his parents and Sheila and the twins and that was why he late in phoning me.


She then went to bed - but said she could not sleep because she knew what he was going to do?? But said nothing.


My other post was from the call in the morning.


If the court transcript is different - then she gave three different versions.

One he made no mention of the deed
two - he mentioned it and she knew what he was going to do
three - he mentioned it but she did not believe him


hmmm - which one is it?

One he made no mention of the deed
two - he mentioned it and she knew what he was going to do
three - he mentioned it but she did not believe him
four - he mentioned it, but she thought he meant that he was not going to do it and sighed with relief

We all know what many different stories mean, don´t we?!

[Adam]

I think Adam's post #149 must be referring to Chapter 27 page 252:

From the beginning Bamber was trying,according to Miss Mugford,to commit the perfect murder,a murder  that would not be discovered. After disregarding a plan to sedate his parents,shoot them and set fire to the house because the insurance cover was too low,he devised a second plan. This was to stage the killings  himself,and make it look as if his sister had committed the crime because she was mad. He told Julie he had found a way to get in and out of the house without trace,leaving through a kitchen window which would appear to have been shut from the inside due to the design of the catch.  "On the evening before the murders",Arlidge said,"he phoned his girlfriend in Lewisham and said he had been thinking of the murders and decided it would be tonight or never. She told him not to be so stupid."

It's not exactly the same thing as #149 Adam.

There are bits of court transcripts in the book. It is what she said in court, rather than what Arlridge said she said.

[Jan]

but that should be the same as what she said in her statements surely - they were only short conversations . You cant have one rule for Jeremy and one for her?

[Jan]

She changed the conversations and times  between statements and now you tell us her court appearance- and in Sept said she knew what he had been planning - before , during and after the murders . And yet she went and Identified those poor children knowing all that . JB was not with her - only the police - so she could have confessed all she knew on that day  - they would have taken her to a safe place and she never would have had to see him again. I can not see that if you believe her you can possibly, in anyway, defend that.

[Adam]

Either way Julie dismissed Jeremy's 'now or never'claim.

Perhaps the final motivation for him to literally get on his bike. Then ring Julie at 3am to show he was not just all talk.

[Caroline]

I think Adam's post #149 must be referring to Chapter 27 page 252:

From the beginning Bamber was trying,according to Miss Mugford,to commit the perfect murder,a murder  that would not be discovered. After disregarding a plan to sedate his parents,shoot them and set fire to the house because the insurance cover was too low,he devised a second plan. This was to stage the killings  himself,and make it look as if his sister had committed the crime because she was mad. He told Julie he had found a way to get in and out of the house without trace,leaving through a kitchen window which would appear to have been shut from the inside due to the design of the catch.  "On the evening before the murders",Arlidge said,"he phoned his girlfriend in Lewisham and said he had been thinking of the murders and decided it would be tonight or never. She told him not to be so stupid."

It's not exactly the same thing as #149 Adam.

Hi Steve, sorry, made a mistake, it's in Chapter 29, Page 203

 

[Jan]

Either way Julie dismissed Jeremy's 'now or never'claim.

Perhaps the final motivation for him to literally get on his bike. Then ring Julie at 3am to show he was not just all talk.

I thought according to you he had planned this for months  and had several motives without killing 5 members of his family to impress the girlfriend

[Caroline]

Either way Julie dismissed Jeremy's 'now or never'claim.

Perhaps the final motivation for him to literally get on his bike. Then ring Julie at 3am to show he was not just all talk.

This flies in the face of just about every guilty theory that I've ever heard. Probably because it's nonsense!!

[Steve_uk]

I thought according to you he had planned this for months  and had several motives without killing 5 members of his family to impress the girlfriend

Julie was an irrelevance. I don't think Jeremy ever really loved anyone. Why he split up with Suzette Ford remains a mystery,but I think he might have been happiest with her..

[Jan]

Julie was an irrelevance. I don't think Jeremy ever really loved anyone. Why he split up with Suzette Ford remains a mystery,but I think he might have been happiest with her..

probably why he would not have taken the risk of telling Julie anything at all.

[Jan]

She changed the conversations and times  between statements and now you tell us her court appearance- and in Sept said she knew what he had been planning - before , during and after the murders . And yet she went and Identified those poor children knowing all that . JB was not with her - only the police - so she could have confessed all she knew on that day  - they would have taken her to a safe place and she never would have had to see him again. I can not see that if you believe her you can possibly, in anyway, defend that.

Adam can you defend that ? in her own statements stating she knew everything? Why did she not safely tell the police on the day?


"I lay in bed but did not go to sleep as I knew that Jeremy had murdered his family"


And yet she told the newspapers after the trial - he never admitted his guilt - not in court and never to me . 

[Caroline]

Adam can you defend that ? in her own statements stating she knew everything? Why did she not safely tell the police on the day?


"I lay in bed but did not go to sleep as I knew that Jeremy had murdered his family"


And yet she told the newspapers after the trial - he never admitted his guilt - not in court and never to me .

I've often wondered why EP didn't ask Julie to get Jeremy to incriminate himself? It would have been easy to record such a conversation. It wasn't the dark ages, I'm sure they had the technology!!

[mike tesko]

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David Boutflour, appears confused as to how he found the silencer in the cupboard, choosing to give two different accounts of how it was situated, located, and recovered...