"I didn't mean to be horrible to Jeremy.."

[Adam]

Disadvantages in Julie going to the police. If Bamber was innocent.

There was no evidence against Bamber. He was innocent.

She would be charged by the police. When caught lying.

The police are experts in telling if someone was lying.

Having a criminal record may effect her teaching career.

It was a month after the massacre.

To make Bamber look bad, she had to implicate herself in the caravan break in. Effecting her teaching career ?

Her own 1984 crime may come to light. Effecting her teaching career ?

There was no financial reward in approaching the police.

It shows she was upset about splitting up with Bamber.

She would be on her own. No other witnesses could support her claims.

Bamber would have the last laugh. When Julie was exposed.

She would have to follow through her approach. Right through to the ultimate (unlikely) conviction. Lying to the world.

It would show she was vindictive. Once exposed.

She may quickly wilt under pressure.  This is something she had never attempted before, and a massive long term lie. So why bother in the first place ?

It would show she had no sympathy for a grieving man. Once exposed.

It would show how upset she was that she was no longer with Bamber. Once exposed.

It would show she was stupid. Once exposed.

An approach may ultimately be time consuming. Depending on her success. Taking up months or years of her life. Effecting her second degree and teaching career.

It would be her word against Bamber's. For the last month the police had treated it as murder/suicide, which was correct as she knew he was innocent. 

She will not know the details of the forensic evidence. It may show Sheila was the killer. Which would not be surprising as Bamber was innocent.

It would be bringing other people into this, such the deceased grieving relatives and her own friends and relatives.

She may feel bad after her initial approach. But is coming clean now an option ?

She had already given a WS and gone around with Bamber for one month. The police will know she had approached them after she split with Bamber.

She was attempting to reverse a decision announced in the media, which the police were in public sticking to - murder/suicide. One month after the massacre.

Her approach may only last a few minutes. Experienced police officers may dismiss it, after all Bamber was innocent. Bamber may not even find out about Julie's attempt for revenge.

If an unsuccessful police approach  became news in the media, she would forever be looked upon as a heartless and lying woman. Friends and relatives may desert her.

                                        -----------------

'Wild animal' or not, Julie was not stupid. Attempting to frame an innocent man of murdering his family. Because she was apparently jilted. Really.

[maggie]

Oh David! There's a whole background behind that story. She was only 16 and knowing the guy concerned, it's highly unlikely that he told her of his impending marriage!!! He had the hots for her, big time, but the consequence of "having the hots" was the prime reason for his forthcoming nuptials He reasoned that she'd probably be high maintenance and described her as being "flaky".

I don't believe it's fair to blame Sheila for the reaction men had for her appearance. I would guess at 16 although she would have been aware she had an effect on men she would have had little or no idea how to manage it.  I'd guess it's hardly something you can speak about to your less attractive girlfriends or in fact most other women.
Much is spoken about Sheila's obsessing about her appearance and I would imagine at some point it became her only sense of self worth and she learned to identify herself through her looks believing that is all she had to offer.

[maggie]

FAULTLESS, Maggie! Brilliant post.

Thank you Jane, much appreciated. 

[Jane]

I don't believe it's fair to blame Sheila for the reaction men had for her appearance. I would guess at 16 although she would have been aware she had an effect on men she would have had little or no idea how to manage it.  I'd guess it's hardly something you can speak about to your less attractive girlfriends or in fact most other women.
Much is spoken about Sheila's obsessing about her appearance and I would imagine at some point it became her only sense of self worth and she learned to identify herself through her looks believing that is all she had to offer.

Absolutely Maggie. When the guy in question met her, she'd apparently cadged a lift to a pub, far enough out of the immediate location, for her parents not to get to hear about it, although I'm sure they did! She'd asked him -and others, I suppose!- for cigarettes. A good way to meet those of the opposite sex, I seem to recall. I guess she saw her only value being reflected in men's eyes when they looked at her.

[Roch]

Then why not kill Colin?

Some spurned partners have either killed or attempted to kill their children and commit suicide. It's obviously a known phenomena.

[Jane]

Some spurned partners have either killed or attempted to kill their children and commit suicide. It's obviously a known phenomena.

Roch, in the world of human nature, whilst ANYTHING may be possible, it isn't necessarily probable.

[lookout]

Some spurned partners have either killed or attempted to kill their children and commit suicide. It's obviously a known phenomena.

Very true,and in most instances where children have been involved there have been issues of who has custody of the children.
The " I'd kill them first before he has them " must be echoed through courts all around the country where an acrimonious divorce has taken place------or," over my dead body will he take them ".

[Roch]

Roch, in the world of human nature, whilst ANYTHING may be possible, it isn't necessarily probable.

Hi Jane.. my personal opinion.. I'm sure others will disagree.

It seems probable to me that Sheila killed her children and attempted to commit suicide, as a result of the following combined triggers:

(1)   Unresolved internal conflict, stemming from the ingrained religiosity of her mother, which fed in to her psychotic delusions / self-perception

(2)   Reduced dosage of anti-psychotic medication

(3)   Recent contact with her birth mother and any resulting, conflicting emotions this would inevitably stir-up

(4)   Resentment towards Colin Caffell for obvious reasons, including rejection and the annulment of any rekindling of their marriage

(5)   Any suggestion that she required extra assistance with the care of the twins – which could be interpreted as interference or loss of control over them (and have a potentially catastrophic effect!)

(6)   Culmination of any historic suicidal ideation, due to dissatisfaction with her problematic life

With regard to any interpretation of ‘temporary fostering’ being irrelevant (because Colin would have care of the kids etc.) – do people really believe that Sheila would be happy for Colin to increase his responsibility for the kids to the detriment of her own responsibility?

[lookout]

That's the way I see it. It's a logical explanation of a woman who'd been let down by pretty well everyone

[Caroline]

Hi Jane.. my personal opinion.. I'm sure others will disagree.

It seems probable to me that Sheila killed her children and attempted to commit suicide, as a result of the following combined triggers:

(1)   Unresolved internal conflict, stemming from the ingrained religiosity of her mother, which fed in to her psychotic delusions / self-perception - Sheila only expressed such conflicts when she was ill - she was taking medication and reduced or not, she was on a HIGH dose.

(2)   Reduced dosage of anti-psychotic medication - she was still on a HIGH dose

(3)   Recent contact with her birth mother and any resulting, conflicting emotions this would inevitably stir-up

(4)   Resentment towards Colin Caffell for obvious reasons, including rejection and the annulment of any rekindling of their marriage - When was she rejected, she got on well with Colin?

(5)   Any suggestion that she required extra assistance with the care of the twins – which could be interpreted as interference or loss of control over them (and have a potentially catastrophic effect!). They were already being looked after by others, she hadn't expressed any real resentment and we only have Jeremy's word as to what was discussed at the supper table.

(6)   Culmination of any historic suicidal ideation, due to dissatisfaction with her problematic life. I'm sure many people have 'thought' about suicide at one time or another, but never attempt it. It's a big step from wanting to kill yourself, to killing 4 people. Had she wanted to kill herself and take her children with her, I doubt that blasting them in the head with a rifle she had no experience of - wouldn't have been her first thought and she'd have wanted to die with them. She had plenty of opportunity previous to her trip to WHF.

With regard to any interpretation of ‘temporary fostering’ being irrelevant (because Colin would have care of the kids etc.) – do people really believe that Sheila would be happy for Colin to increase his responsibility for the kids to the detriment of her own responsibility?

Was he increasing his responsiblity?

[Jane]

Hi Jane.. my personal opinion.. I'm sure others will disagree.

It seems probable to me that Sheila killed her children and attempted to commit suicide, as a result of the following combined triggers:

(1)   Unresolved internal conflict, stemming from the ingrained religiosity of her mother, which fed in to her psychotic delusions / self-perception

(2)   Reduced dosage of anti-psychotic medication

(3)   Recent contact with her birth mother and any resulting, conflicting emotions this would inevitably stir-up

(4)   Resentment towards Colin Caffell for obvious reasons, including rejection and the annulment of any rekindling of their marriage

(5)   Any suggestion that she required extra assistance with the care of the twins – which could be interpreted as interference or loss of control over them (and have a potentially catastrophic effect!)

(6)   Culmination of any historic suicidal ideation, due to dissatisfaction with her problematic life

With regard to any interpretation of ‘temporary fostering’ being irrelevant (because Colin would have care of the kids etc.) – do people really believe that Sheila would be happy for Colin to increase his responsibility for the kids to the detriment of her own responsibility?

Thank-you for that, Roch. It is indeed a possibility if all the above is exactly how you state it.......................however we have to factor in Jeremy's dissatisfaction with his life at the farm, his resentment of what he may have seen as Sheila living they high life, having 'goodies' handed to her on a plate, by 'the olds' whilst he was having to work to pay for it, his dislike of parental restraints, and his 'hatred' of June. One has to wonder what was going through his mind when he took a silent and unresponsive Sheila home from that weekend party. One can only speculate on any conversation which may have occurred. Neither he nor Julie have been very expansive about it. I think it's very probable that his plans began to fruit during that journey.

[Caroline]

Some spurned partners have either killed or attempted to kill their children and commit suicide. It's obviously a known phenomena.

And their parents?

[lookout]

Not uncommon,particularly is this case where guns had been available.

[Roch]

And their parents?

Well F.E. wasn't surprised June had been killed. 

Sheila's parents were either meant to be killed (either June individually or both); or they were killed as a direct result of intervention on their part during the incident (with there having been no intention to kill them at the outset).

Given Sheila was 'crazy' or 'berserk' etc. she was likely to be experiencing psychotic delusions.  Therefore  it is difficult to discern exactly what her thoughts or intentions were for June / Nevill.  It seems likely an argument had been brewing and occurring during the course of the night?  Or perhaps it was out of the blue?

Sadly, all the protagonists are dead - so we will never know exactly.

[Jane]

Well F.E. wasn't surprised June had been killed. 

Sheila's parents were either meant to be killed (either June individually or both); or they were killed as a direct result of intervention on their part during the incident (with there having been no intention to kill them at the outset).

Given Sheila was 'crazy' or 'berserk' etc. she was likely to be experiencing psychotic delusions.  Therefore  it is difficult to discern exactly what her thoughts or intentions were for June / Nevill.  It seems likely an argument had been brewing and occurring during the course of the night?  Or perhaps it was out of the blue?

Sadly, all the protagonists are dead - so we will never know exactly.

Exactly so. We only have Jeremy's word for it that there was any kind of verbal altercation.