Police arrival at WHF what next ?

[bloggs and son]

Check the logs, but be sure to also see the sentence which immediately follows.
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=732.0;attach=16098;image

I wonder why they say "A person from inside the farm". Why do they mention one specific person?

[lookout]

That's right,Grahame,and once inside the farmhouse,the police knew that Sheila hadn''t long " died ",so they put her in the recovery position to try and rescusitate her. Hence the blood on the sides of her mouth.

[lookout]

It was at that time, an " officer " ( no name ) on knowing that  someone was still alive in the place,then sent for the backup firearms team.

[Patti]

It was at that time, an " officer " ( no name ) on knowing that  someone was still alive in the place,then sent for the backup firearms team.

So what have we got here? Steve Myall thought he saw someone at the window. Jeapes thought she saw a gun in the window and the rad team are in conversation with a person inside the house....later met with no response......

[lookout]

Hi Patti,I'm sure that Sheila, at the stage of officer/s trying to revive her, wouldn't have either looked " stiff ",nor been " stiff ". This was when Jeremy was outside. Doesn't add up,does it.?

[Patti]

Hi Patti,I'm sure that Sheila, at the stage of officer/s trying to revive her, wouldn't have either looked " stiff ",nor been " stiff ". This was when Jeremy was outside. Doesn't add up,does it.?

Hi Lookout, I think there has been talk about one of the raid team giving Sheila CPR but I haven't come across anything that has supported that. Or why the blood trails down from each side of her mouth. Could it be from gasping...I just don't know...Can you tell from those pictures of Shelia Lookout, if RM was present....It's difficult to tell...such poor quality.

One of the SCO's noticed blood under her wrist and moved her arm. Would he have known RM was present say after 4 to 5 hours? Even after two? Would it have been very stiff to have moved?

[lookout]

If the truth be known,Patti,it's my belief that if someone tried to rescusitate Sheila,then clearly whoever it was, either didn't think she was dead at that time and thought it was worth trying to revive her, but certainly wouldn't have bothered if she'd looked pale/grey,which would have indicated her death.
Even a weak pulse will prompt anyone to put that person in a recovery position.
Any marks on Sheila's body would account,possibly,for someone performing CPR,as sometimes injuries can't  always be avoided.

The pictures are pretty misleading Patti,as they're copies of copies.Original negatives are the ones to go by. In some pictures of Sheila,she just looks asleep,and not like the cadaver that I'd imagine.
It wouldn't appear to me that there's any RM, LM,or Algor mortis. ( which is the pallor that develops )

[maggie]

If the truth be known,Patti,it's my belief that if someone tried to rescusitate Sheila,then clearly whoever it was, either didn't think she was dead at that time and thought it was worth trying to revive her, but certainly wouldn't have bothered if she'd looked pale/grey,which would have indicated her death.
Even a weak pulse will prompt anyone to put that person in a recovery position.
Any marks on Sheila's body would account,possibly,for someone performing CPR,as sometimes injuries can't  always be avoided.

The pictures are pretty misleading Patti,as they're copies of copies.Original negatives are the ones to go by. In some pictures of Sheila,she just looks asleep,and not like the cadaver that I'd imagine.
It wouldn't appear to me that there's any RM, LM,or Algor mortis. ( which is the pallor that develops )

Agreed lookout, Apart from the awful wounds, Sheila looks healthy and very peaceful.  There is no sign of tightening or shrinking of the skin.  Admittedly the photos make it difficult to be sure.  You could consider the possibility that someone may believe there was a chance of ressuscitating her and indeed had a go.

[Bridget]

If the truth be known,Patti,it's my belief that if someone tried to rescusitate Sheila,then clearly whoever it was, either didn't think she was dead at that time and thought it was worth trying to revive her, but certainly wouldn't have bothered if she'd looked pale/grey,which would have indicated her death.
Even a weak pulse will prompt anyone to put that person in a recovery position.
Any marks on Sheila's body would account,possibly,for someone performing CPR,as sometimes injuries can't  always be avoided.

The pictures are pretty misleading Patti,as they're copies of copies.Original negatives are the ones to go by. In some pictures of Sheila,she just looks asleep,and not like the cadaver that I'd imagine.
It wouldn't appear to me that there's any RM, LM,or Algor mortis. ( which is the pallor that develops )

You're thinking of pallor mortis, algor mortis relates to temperature. I'd say she's pretty pale, even in those poor photos.

[Patti]

If the truth be known,Patti,it's my belief that if someone tried to rescusitate Sheila,then clearly whoever it was, either didn't think she was dead at that time and thought it was worth trying to revive her, but certainly wouldn't have bothered if she'd looked pale/grey,which would have indicated her death.
Even a weak pulse will prompt anyone to put that person in a recovery position.
Any marks on Sheila's body would account,possibly,for someone performing CPR,as sometimes injuries can't  always be avoided.

The pictures are pretty misleading Patti,as they're copies of copies.Original negatives are the ones to go by. In some pictures of Sheila,she just looks asleep,and not like the cadaver that I'd imagine.
It wouldn't appear to me that there's any RM, LM,or Algor mortis. ( which is the pallor that develops )

Hi Lookout, you have seen June's full body exposure..which is not in the archives. Did you detect any RM in her body when you saw it? I know it's difficult...there is a picture of June's legs in the archives...It's one I don't like posting, because it is very upsetting for some.

I wonder if this has been examined by JB's team and has it been confirmed that RM was not present? The other thing lookout is that she has undigested food in her tummy...the others had not.

What about moving her arm, would that have been easy if RM had set in?

You can tell me to shut up lololol

[lookout]

Yes,Maggie,it's the healthiest looking corpse I've ever seen. Good job we're not working on the old puce or brown pics as once was or we would be baffled altogether.

[maggie]

You're thinking of pallor mortis, algor mortis relates to temperature. I'd say she's pretty pale, even in those poor photos.

Well she would be pale bridget, even if still alive her body would be in a huge state of shock and any blood circulating would have rushed to her vital organs to try and support them.  Have seen a fair few dead bodies in my time albeit not for some years now but she does'nt look as tho' she's been dead for 4 hours or more. imho

[maggie]

Yes,Maggie,it's the healthiest looking corpse I've ever seen. Good job we're not working on the old puce or brown pics as once was or we would be baffled altogether.

Yes, lookout,  do you think she may have had makeup on?  But for all that it is the way her face is relaxed and at rest, there is no sign of tightness or as you say the look of a cadavar

[lookout]

Hi Patti,now yes,that's an entirely different " take " with June's pics,as she practically looks " laid out ", and it's plain to see that she'd been dead longer than Sheila. I'd pointed out earlier that if a rectal temperature had been taken of Sheila,then that would have pretty well determined her time of death.
Sheila had the undigested food in her stomach,yes.While the others didn't,which meant that Sheila enjoyed her " midnight snacks ",after all the family had eaten together earlier.
You'd be able to move the arm from the shoulder ( in one,,,,rather than bending from the elbow ) where there are " ball and socket joints )

[lookout]

Ooops,Bridget,I'm getting mixed up with livor and algor.