Author Topic: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason  (Read 15813 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Roch

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17579
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #105 on: May 21, 2012, 03:59:PM »
I didn't say you did give misleading or inaccurate information.  ???

I'm not taking the mick here, but you've completely lost me, I have no idea what you are going on about.  ???

We're like two UBoats in the Atlantic.  Let's forget it and move on.  I think I know how to solve the issue if it arises again

bloggs and son

  • Guest
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #106 on: May 21, 2012, 04:01:PM »
My apologies, that is how it came across to me at the time.

I have a tendency to correct people when they are giving incorrect or misleading information, as I believe it serves no purpose other than to confuse people, it's one thing to refer to a contentious issue, it's quite another to be completely inaccurate. Granted I'm not immune to making an error myself, but I hardly think this reflects badly on me in the manner you suggest.  ???
As this concerns the information that ngb gave you, are you implying that he did give you incorrect information?

NewChilledOutHartley

  • Guest
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #107 on: May 21, 2012, 04:01:PM »
We're like two UBoats in the Atlantic.  Let's forget it and move on.  I think I know how to solve the issue if it arises again

Tactics? Are we playing battleships now?  ;D

I agree, let's move on.

NewChilledOutHartley

  • Guest
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #108 on: May 21, 2012, 04:03:PM »
As this concerns the information that ngb gave you, are you implying that he did give you incorrect information?

My god, what is wrong with people.  ??? Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo it doesn't.

Offline Roch

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17579
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #109 on: May 21, 2012, 04:05:PM »
Tactics? Are we playing battleships now?  ;D

I agree, let's move on.

I was thinking of that film Das Boot  :D

NewChilledOutHartley

  • Guest
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #110 on: May 21, 2012, 04:05:PM »
I was thinking of that film Das Boot  :D

Aaaaah, that works also.  ;D

Offline Roch

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17579
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #111 on: May 21, 2012, 04:13:PM »
Aaaaah, that works also.  ;D

Wasn't there also a Reeves & Mortimer sketch where they used to say "I think we're at cross purposes"?  Something to do with Bra's  ;D  The UBoat thing was a reference to when the captain is trying to rendevous with another captain, Thompsen.

NewChilledOutHartley

  • Guest
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #112 on: May 21, 2012, 04:24:PM »
Wasn't there also a Reeves & Mortimer sketch where they used to say "I think we're at cross purposes"?  Something to do with Bra's  ;D  The UBoat thing was a reference to when the captain is trying to rendevous with another captain, Thompsen.

Sorry, you've lost me again.  :-[  ;D

It's not really my thing. I got the Das Boot reference though, so at least that's something to feel proud about.  :)

Offline Nuala

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1542
  • I am not a number
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #113 on: May 21, 2012, 04:30:PM »

I'm not certain that this coming forward was entirely voluntary.  I'm interested in anything that has come to light which gives an indication as to how she was interviewed.  I don't think anything has been made public relating to this.  Maybe it is tenuous and open to allegations of 'spin' or maybe not.  Re your last sentence, it could be read as her having had a 'sword held over her head'.


Neither am I, Rochford. JM could have faced a string of very serious charges, not least in relation to the murders, the police would have had her over a barrel in respect of these. That JM was instead given sweeping immunity against prosecution may well suggest that JM a very interesting deal was done.

NewChilledOutHartley

  • Guest
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #114 on: May 21, 2012, 04:37:PM »
EXTRACT FROM 2002 APPEAL JUDGEMENT: http://www.homepage-link.to/JUSTICE/judgements/Bamber/index.html

Ground 5 – evidence relevant to the credibility of Julie Mugford

331. Ground 5 raises issues relating to Julie Mugford. When she had given a statement to the police in September 1985, she had made admissions of dishonest conduct in which she had been involved. She referred to a burglary offence committed jointly with the appellant and to a cheque book fraud committed jointly with Susan Battersby. She was not prosecuted for either offence nor was Susan Battersby prosecuted for the cheque book fraud which she too had admitted to the police. The first limb of ground 5 is a complaint that the prosecution failed to disclose the fact that both Julie Mugford and Susan Battersby were given immunity.

332. As Mr Temple points out, in answer to that aspect of the matter, Julie Mugford and Susan Battersby were not granted immunity as such but a decision was taken by the DPP not to prosecute. We therefore read this ground as being a complaint that the documentation relating to the decision not to prosecute each of the witnesses was not disclosed to the defence.

333. The jury knew about the admissions made to the police. They further knew that neither of the girls had been prosecuted for these offences. Julie Mugford told the jury that she had "got a caution for it". When the judge summed the case up to the jury, he referred to her receiving "a police caution". Mr Turner's submission is that the jury were misled by being told that she had received a "police caution", and that the prosecution were under a duty to correct this wrong impression.

334. It is undoubtedly correct that Julie Mugford had not received a formal police caution in the sense that that expression is clearly understood by police officers and lawyers. It may be that the trial judge in translating Miss Mugford's reference to a caution into a formal police caution had misunderstood the position. However it seems unlikely to us that the jury would have understood the significance of a formal police caution as opposed to any other warning as to her future behaviour.

335. However, whether or not the jury understood the legal distinction of a formal police caution, we fail to see how this could have had any possible impact upon their considerations. What mattered in assessing the weight to be given to the witness's evidence was their own admitted dishonesty, and how they had behaved in relation to such dishonesty, not how the authorities had responded to their admissions. Any failure to correct the judge's reference to a formal police caution cannot be laid at the door of the police since the position was clearly understood by the lawyers and hence such a failure could not in any way taint the evidence of the police officers involved in the inquiry.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2012, 04:42:PM by -Hartley- »

Buddy

  • Guest
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #115 on: May 21, 2012, 05:07:PM »
The fact is she wasn't prosecuted. The suggestion is that she was threatened with prosecution unless she gave evidence (I think). But it seems clear to me that she went to them, she volunteered the information re the cheques and caravan park burglary, and they didn't make the decision not to prosecute until after she had given her statements about the murders.
No she did not go to the police, Battersby did after her tearful confession in the cafe, so Julie never approached the police.
As for paying off of the fraud to the bank, Julie was accompanied by DS Jones, and the bank manager was never asked to give evidence, even though he was aware that the girls were escorted by police officers, and said that this was Julies decision, and nothing to do with them
This is IMO a lie.
Mugford got away with drug smuggling, bank fraud, and robbery, and got £25,000 for her troubles.
I do not know if Jeremy is innocent, but I am quite clear that Mugford is not telling the truth.

Offline Patti

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13193
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #116 on: May 21, 2012, 05:07:PM »
Her credibility is flawed no matter how you look at it.....It was a mixture of truths and false information made up from hearsay, what might have been and how she interpreted  it all.....and how we perceive it.

I had no idea of the money Jeremy would get. It was my understanding that he would be paid if he was released. 

JM was aware....otherwise how did she know this?

When the verdict was given I was in a neutral place, I don't think I was at the hotel?


Come on gal surely you must have known where you were on verdict day? Stan Jones knew where you were...he told you the verdict.

Jeremy told me that he paid 2000 to Matthew M.

But, juile he had an alibi.....was this made up?

Jeremy told me that the bible was on her chest

Oh dear! lol  ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)

It goes on and on...........



« Last Edit: May 21, 2012, 05:10:PM by Patti »

Offline Patti

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13193
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #117 on: May 21, 2012, 05:08:PM »
No she did not go to the police, Battersby did after her tearful confession in the cafe, so Julie never approached the police.
As for paying off of the fraud to the bank, Julie was accompanied by DS Jones, and the bank manager was never asked to give evidence, even though he was aware that the girls were escorted by police officers, and said that this was Julies decision, and nothing to do with them
This is IMO a lie.
Mugford got away with drug smuggling, bank fraud, and robbery, and got £25,000 for her troubles.
I do not know if Jeremy is innocent, but I am quite clear that Mugford is not telling the truth.

5 Stars Buddy....Hope you are alright.  :)

guest154

  • Guest
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #118 on: May 21, 2012, 05:14:PM »
If I was JM and had that deal in place before the trial. The last place I would want to be would be in that court room giving evidence. I think she was used by the papers and didn't realise the dangers she was actually in.

Offline Bridget

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5065
Re: Forum Members Posts Being Deleted For No Reason
« Reply #119 on: May 21, 2012, 05:42:PM »
No she did not go to the police, Battersby did after her tearful confession in the cafe, so Julie never approached the police.
As for paying off of the fraud to the bank, Julie was accompanied by DS Jones, and the bank manager was never asked to give evidence, even though he was aware that the girls were escorted by police officers, and said that this was Julies decision, and nothing to do with them
This is IMO a lie.
Mugford got away with drug smuggling, bank fraud, and robbery, and got £25,000 for her troubles.
I do not know if Jeremy is innocent, but I am quite clear that Mugford is not telling the truth.

Sorry, but that is incorrect. Julie confided in Susan, who advised her to go to the police. She then went on holiday with her boyfriend. It wasn't until she returned from her trip that she learned that Julie had indeed gone to the police, and JB was now under arrest. Julie approached the police herself.
....just cos I eat worms...