Grounds for not referring Jeremy Bamber’s case back to the appeal court.

[Tricksy]

So what evidence did they have other than a statement of a disgruntled ex girlfriend, druggy and thief who is now living in canada, working as a school teacher and living the good life. Now tell me thats not suspicious. A little helping hand from essex police there, me thinks.

Well it was trial by jury 10-2 verdict so at the time the evidence was deemed sufficient to convict JB.

Since then through various appeals the defence has been unable to produce sufficient evidence to the contrary.

What is it that makes you cerain of his innocence?

I haven't made my mind up yet in regards to Jeremy Baber's guilt or innocence as I don't feel that I have studied the information sufficiently enough to answer that question yet.

However, I was and am in favour of him getting an appeal or a new trial.

The jury may have had sufficient evidence at that time, but I think new light has been shone on that evidence enough to question its validity.

In regard to the rejection of a new appeal, I am annoyed that the CCRC have taken the Police statements to be more reliable than the photographs. Although I do accept the point made about date and time stamps. And we know the Police never cover up anything don't we!? 

I am also annoyed that nothing has been said in regard to the Public Immunity Documents and the negatives that Essex Police Force will not give to the defence.

I am annoyed that Essex Police Force have disposed of some of the case evidence.

I would also question the use of the silencer as evidence. That it sat there for 34 days then was given to the Police in my view taints its use as evidence.

I think that there was reason enough in that appeal to warrant a new trial.

[Pete0001]

Also i don't think the photo's would prove his innocence, but they would show that the crime scene was tampered with whilst in the police's care. This alone should show that it was an unfair trial due to scene staging and he should then be granted a retrial.

You say tampered with but there's no evidence to back that up.. this is the problem.
They went into the farm and then made a mess of things.. you are suggesting they tampered with evidence with a plan in mind. This is not the case.... they believed it was a suicide and murder. No one was tampering with the scene to frame JB. They didn't suspect him at that time. So please stop suggesting that the scene was tampered with.
They went in and did a sloppy job because they thought it was an open and shut case. Bodies are always moved.
i.e. Photorgapher takes a picture of body with gun lying over the body. Officer knocks something or somehow disturbs the scene and says... "oh sorry.. hang on the arm was here.." and the photographer takes another picture... you now have 2 photographs and the wild theories about what went on could be endless.... or totally harmless and bare no relevance to the case.

I really do think there's too much focus on a scene that was in no way set up or tampered with to frame JB. I can't have been... he wasn't suspected then.

[Sparkfilms]

There are two conflicting views on the photography.

Peter Sutherst's view could change everything on this case.

There is the view - the complete opposite to what Mr Sutherst thinks by the 'expert' commissioned by the CCRC.

One of them is right. I hope that those of us who have taken an interest in the case get some kind of explanation.

I will be seeking an explanation myself.

[Janet (Formerly known as Takeshi)]

I think that there was reason enough in that appeal to warrant a new trial.

Tricksy, I agree with your last statement.

[Pete0001]

So what evidence did they have other than a statement of a disgruntled ex girlfriend, druggy and thief who is now living in canada, working as a school teacher and living the good life. Now tell me thats not suspicious. A little helping hand from essex police there, me thinks.

So you are saying that it's suspicious that someone can grow up and change from the way they were in their late teens to early 20's? Once your a "disgruntled ex girlfriend, druggy and thief" that's it for life then.. you'll always be that?

From what I've read on the subject with an open mind the evidence against JB was Mugford, the relatives and the sound moderator.. those were the main factors as well as the picture the prosecution painted of Jeremy and his life style behaviour.

Just my opinion.. I'm still undecided as to whether he's guilty or innocent. I do think it needs a retrial but then again I've only seen the evidence that has been posted on the internet.

[Pete0001]

I think that there was reason enough in that appeal to warrant a new trial.

Tricksy, I agree with your last statement.

But it depends what their putting on trial.. a badly executed police investigation or a mans guilt or innocence. One does not make him necessarily innocent and maybe the CCRC think that the errors made change nothing.

I dont know.. just a thought.

[Tricksy]

I think that there was reason enough in that appeal to warrant a new trial.

Tricksy, I agree with your last statement.

 :D Thanks.

I remember the case when it happened, although I was in my early teens, so didn't really follow it fully. I am just reading up on it at the moment, so, as I have said before, I haven't reached an opinion as yet on the innocence or guilt of Jeremy Bamber.

IMHO, based on what I have read, he does deserve a new trial.

[bb2010]

Along with Pete, I have only seen things that Mike has posted or is on Jeremy Bamber's official website. I have never been able to consider the other side of the story.

[Janet (Formerly known as Takeshi)]

 :D Thanks.

I remember the case when it happened, although I was in my early teens, so didn't really follow it fully. I am just reading up on it at the moment, so, as I have said before, I haven't reached an opinion as yet on the innocence or guilt of Jeremy Bamber.

IMHO, based on what I have read, he does deserve a new trial.

Same here. I was 13 years old at the time of the murders and I can vaguely remember it being reported in the news. I have only taken a real interest since 31/01/11 after reading an article in the Daily Mail about Jeremy Bamber's application to the CCRC. I still have a lot of reading to do and have not formed an opinion as to JB's innocence or guilt. However, from what I have read I believe his original trial to be unfair and I believe he deserves a retrial.

[Kaldin]

The evidence just wasn't there was it? There are no photos or other evidence showing that Sheila's body was moved prior to the SOC team moving her arm and the gun. The mantlepiece issue is a bit vague because there doesn't seem to be any specific photos of that area taken after the murders. 

[bb2010]

The evidence just wasn't there was it? There are no photos or other evidence showing that Sheila's body was moved prior to the SOC team moving her arm and the gun. The mantlepiece issue is a bit vague because there doesn't seem to be any specific photos of that area taken after the murders.

I agree Kaldin. The photo's of the mantlepiece are still unclear - I have no idea where the scratches were. I am also unsure why the Jeapes statement wasn't given more mileage. Those are the two things that I need clarity on.

[Kaldin]

The evidence just wasn't there was it? There are no photos or other evidence showing that Sheila's body was moved prior to the SOC team moving her arm and the gun. The mantlepiece issue is a bit vague because there doesn't seem to be any specific photos of that area taken after the murders.

I agree Kaldin. The photo's of the mantlepiece are still unclear - I have no idea where the scratches were. I am also unsure why the Jeapes statement wasn't given more mileage. Those are the two things that I need clarity on.

I don't know if the Jeapes statement was available at the original trial. I think that an appeal has to be based on  new stuff which wasn't available at the trial or wasn't known at the time of the trial.

That has been one of the confusing issues on this forum - the difference between evidence which is  new and evidence which was known in 1986 or during the appeal of 2002.

[Janet (Formerly known as Takeshi)]

Please bear in mind that there are still 211 photographs of the scene still undisclosed by Essex Police.

[Kaldin]

As I understand it, the Jeapes statement wasn't available at the 1986 trial. That's what I've read in several places anyway

Do you know when it became available?

[Tricksy]

Please bear in mind that there are still 211 photographs of the scene still undisclosed by Essex Police.

Have they ever given a reason as to why the defence have not received them? Or Copies of them?