Bamber guilty, surely!

[mike tesko]

Can you shed any light on Nevill's positioning? From the photos I have seen on here he was found on the floor with his head in the coal scuttle and in a 'sitting' position with rigor mortis having set in. I understand that the theory is that his body was on a chair, blocking the door that the police had to break down and that from the window, at that angle/position his body would not have been visible.

Ralphs lifeless body was sat on a wooden chair behind an internal door which afforded a through fare between that part of the farmhouse in the immediate vicinity of an external door and downstairs office where the gun cupboard was located (on one side of the internal door) and the kitchen. The police did not break down the internal door behind which was sat Ralph`s body. The door in question opened up into the kitchen area. Police nudged open the door in question, which caused Ralph`s body to topple off the chair ...

You could only see Ralph`s body once it had been toppled from the chair behind the door, from the vantage point of someone outside the kitchen window...

[susan]

Patti  As I said earlier Neville was murdered by a very disturbed tortured person and his PJ,s were around his shins to humiliate I suspect.

[susan]

Campion Yes I do think the 3 has a religious connotation the 3 was written 5 times hence 5 deaths the burns made on Neville,s back again 3 all the letters are identical virtually to a list of Swedish Proverbs and so many of them could be related to a very disturbed person with a deeply misguided religion.  Just my theory I am trying to connect the 3 this is also related to the Devil.

[susan]

G I agree to a certain extent but anything I have posted re: the extended family is well documented on the internet on Jeremy,s sites and after all they helped to convict him and they did benefit from his conviction.  I rest my case.  I would never never wish to cause offence to anyone on the forum.

[G]

G I agree to a certain extent but anything I have posted re: the extended family is well documented on the internet on Jeremy,s sites and after all they helped to convict him and they did benefit from his conviction.  I rest my case.  I would never never wish to cause offence to anyone on the forum.

That's ok Susan. Critisism is accepted. I was talking about abuse. I didn't mean we shouldn't mention them. After all we must remember they are innocent in the eyes of the law. It is we who have the reservations.

[ajross]

Maybe Nevill was already slumped on the chair with exhaustion when he took the last of the shots to the head?
Sorry,I got confused.I thought Mike was saying that the door to the kitchen was the door that EP broke down.The internal one? I do believe that the internal door could,however have had to have been forced as Nevills body could very possibly have been behind it.
I certainly do not believe that any killer put Nevill in that position.His body was clearly unsettled by EP because blood had stated to run again,hence the need to surround the coal scuttle with cushions.

I guess the exhaustion is the best conclusion and that he was shot in that position fatally, we will probably never know. I didn't know his pyjamas were down but also read a strange post in another thread yesterday about Sheila's privates being exposed when found.
I have read various reasons why they didn't enter sooner including the reports of somebody being alive inside and supposedly conversing with them (although I have read that this is disputed) and also that they were waiting for more police. I have also read that if Nevill was in the chair behind that internal door (which was only forced open) then his body cannot be seen from the window. Lastly, the reasons I have read for the blood seepage after death have been that blood had pooled in the bodies and then leaked out when they were moved. I'm not suggesting I agree or disagree with anynof these assertions though, I'm just looking for debate. I think it a shame that sika has chosen to leave along with hartley as i want to hear both sides of the story. While typing I have just remembered that I read there were a pair of bloody panties in a bucket in the kitchen which is interesting with regards to sheila being 'exposed' but what i think is likely is that EP used them to mop up Nevill's blood, relised they shouldn't have used that particular garment and staged managed that to make it look like somebody had attempted to clean them

[susan]

G  I really do agree with you and I admit I do carried away at times in defence of Jeremy after the things I have read about his extended family.

[tyler]

ajross.........Sheilas underwear was soaking in a bucket as she had got "caught short" with her period.She was menstruating at the time of her death.

Susan........I,along with yourself and many others am in agreement regarding the relatives.I think that they acted appallingly and were interested in only one thing.

Did Sika leave of his own accord.or was he magicked away?Personally,I thought he was a moron! 

[G]

Did Sika leave of his own accord.or was he magicked away?Personally,I thought he was a moron! 

I had a sneeky feeling he was a troll and if he stayed any longer we probably would have found that out?

[susan]

G  Did not know Mr. Sika had gone when did this happen.

[tyler]

I had a sneeky feeling he was a troll and if he stayed any longer we probably would have found that out?

I dont think that you were the only one that had a feeling that he was a troll.

[G]

G  Did not know Mr. Sika had gone when did this happen.

He just decided to up sticks and go for some reason. I think he took offence because someone called him a newbie or something?

[Patti]

Ralphs lifeless body was sat on a wooden chair behind an internal door which afforded a through fare between that part of the farmhouse in the immediate vicinity of an external door and downstairs office where the gun cupboard was located (on one side of the internal door) and the kitchen. The police did not break down the internal door behind which was sat Ralph`s body. The door in question opened up into the kitchen area. Police nudged open the door in question, which caused Ralph`s body to topple off the chair ...

You could only see Ralph`s body once it had been toppled from the chair behind the door, from the vantage point of someone outside the kitchen window...

Disagree Mike sorry.....

If Nevill had been dead for 4 hours, his body would have rigour mortise. If like you say the police knocked his body over and his head landed in the scuttle.....Then tell me how did he bleed onto the floor?   I was lead to believe that dead people don't bleed.

[Patti]

Can you shed any light on Nevill's positioning? From the photos I have seen on here he was found on the floor with his head in the coal scuttle and in a 'sitting' position with rigor mortis having set in. I understand that the theory is that his body was on a chair, blocking the door that the police had to break down and that from the window, at that angle/position his body would not have been visible. What I struggle with is why, a man who has just phoned for emergency assistance, then had what seems an alimighty struggle before being shot repeatedly (and possibly tortured with a burning poker or gun barrel) is doing sat in a chair? I'm not arguing guilt or innocence, I just wonder what others think about this? I guess being exhausted and shot he may have slumped in the chair and just stayed there but with the violence involved I find this hard to believe. I guess it may not be significant but it leads me to question the 'official' course of events

I struggle with it too....

Phone call at 3:26......no mention of any shooting to Jeremy or the police.....No blood was found on the telephone either.

22 minutes later all the family appear to be dead........

One thing I have thought of and that is......Shelia could have well been in the kitchen with her father; uninjured at the time.  She could have heard that police were outside and gone back upstairs in order not to be seen.....Then shot herself. On saying that the main bedroom window was open, but yet no one heard any shots.

[tyler]

Disagree Mike sorry.....

If Nevill had been dead for 4 hours, his body would have rigour mortise. If like you say the police knocked his body over and his head landed in the scuttle.....Then tell me how did he bleed onto the floor?   I was lead to believe that dead people don't bleed.

I dont think Mike has said that Nevills head landed in the scuttle?More like EP put his head there to contain the bleeding?