significance of long delay between both shots...

[mike tesko]

The pathologist, Peter Venezis, hit the nail on the head when he said there was a delay between both shots received or sustained by Sheila, and that the lower neck wound did not kill her - but the one under the chin did...

Let's get the facts right...

Venezis testified to the effect that the presence of bruising around the lower entry wound on the neck, was the clearest evidence yet that Sheila did not and had not died as a result of the first shot, and that there was a delay before she sustained the second fatal shot under the chin. He was not able to put a time on the amount of delay, other than to say that it would have been possible for Sheila to have walked around a bit in between the two shots...

He drew attention to the lack of vertical bloodstains on the front of her nightdress suggesting that he would have expected to find some evidence of this if she had been walking around in between shots?

He failed to consider or take into account that the blood from the lower entry would may have dried in the interim period between both shots being received, and that if there was such a delay and consequences, there might not be any evidence of vertical blood on the nightdress, by virtue of the fact that blood from the initial lower neck wound had already dried.

[mike tesko]

The lower entry wound bled sufficiently enough to create the triangular bloodstain on the front upper part of Sheila's nightdress, before the second shot was fired...

In order for the triangular bloodstain on the upper right hand side of the nightdress to be there prior to the second shot being sustained, the fingers of Sheila`s right hand would have to be released from the gun that fired the initial shot and applied to the neck in the vicinity of the lower entry wound so that the fold of her arm acted like a void and bridge to allow blood from the lower entry wound to contaminate the nightdress...

What this means, is that whoever fired the shots, did not fire them both in quick succession, one after the other - but there was a considerable delay between both...

[mike tesko]

Now...

If Jeremy was the crack shot that the relatives would have us Believe, why did it take him two shots to kill Sheila?

[mike tesko]

Why, if jeremy was the crack shot the relatives would have us believe, did he shoot Sheila almost sideways through the neck?

[mike tesko]

Why, if jeremy was the crack shot the relatives would have us believe, did he shoot Sheila almost sideways through the neck?

How exactly did crack shot Bamber expect to kill Sheila by shooting her almost sideways on into the neck?

[Hartley]

Let's get the facts right...

Venezis testified to the effect that the presence of bruising around the lower entry wound on the neck, was the clearest evidence yet that Sheila did not and had not died as a result of the first shot, and that there was a delay before she sustained the second fatal shot under the chin. He was not able to put a time on the amount of delay, other than to say that it would have been possible for Sheila to have walked around a bit in between the two shots...

Yikes!!!  It's only gone and happened again. 

Yes please could we get the facts right?

You might want to set out a bit earlier for your next meeting with 'Z', as I fear that your nose would be on time, but you would be twenty minutes late. 

[mike tesko]

It took crack shot Bamber eight bullets to kill robust Ralph Bamber, it took crack shot Bamber seven bullets to kill elderly June Bamber, it took crack shot Bamber five bullets to kill a defenceless Daniel, and another three to bring to an end the life of young Nicholas. Then, crack shot Bamber could n`t even get it right when he supposedly tried to kill Sheila by shooting her sideways through the neck?

[mike tesko]

It took crack shot Bamber eight bullets to kill robust Ralph Bamber, it took crack shot Bamber seven bullets to kill elderly June Bamber, it took crack shot Bamber five bullets to kill a defenceless Daniel, and another three to bring to an end the life of young Nicholas. Then, crack shot Bamber could n`t even get it right when he supposedly tried to kill Sheila by shooting her sideways through the neck?

There seems to be a level of incompetence in all these shootings, which suggests the person who did the shootings was far from being a crack shot like Jeremy? More likely to have been someone who was not very good with guns...

[sc82]

Also, if Jeremy was the shooter, why would there have been a delay between shots? Its been documented that Sheila would have likely been floored for a short time after the first shot so that would have been a perfect opportunity for Jeremy to fire the 2nd shot. There wouldn't have been a need for there to be any significant delay between shots as it doesn't seem Sheila would have been fit to put up a fight after the first shot.

[Hartley]

There seems to be a level of incompetence in all these shootings, which suggests the person who did the shootings was far from being a crack shot like Jeremy? More likely to have been someone who was not very good with guns...

I think you need to make your mind up, one minute, depending on what theory you are presenting, you're trying to suggest that Jeremy didn't know much about firearms, then the next your are suggesting he is a 'crack' shot.

Well the truth is actually more likely to be somewhere between the two.

Then we have the wounds to the five victims, you suggest that the wounds are spread all over the place, a little inaccurate, yet on the other hand, not a single shot failed to hit one of the victims, so perhaps they could be described as more accurate than you suggest.

In fact for Sheila, who was inexperienced with firearms, to have fired 25 shots, whilst being in a psychotic rage, and somehow hitting the target with 100% accuracy, could be considered highly unlikely.

Your example of needing several shots to murder the twins and somehow trying to link it to Jeremy's ability with firearms, whether he was a 'crack' shot or not is irrelevant as these particular shots were contact shots, the number of shots fired also does not have anything to do with Jeremy's ability.

Another interpretation of the shootings, would be that shots were sadistically fired to cause pain to June and Neville, before finishing June off with an execution style shot between the eyes, perhaps the same was intended for Neville but he had a lot more fight in him than expected.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Given enough time we could make anything fit, which is precisely why unless these speculative theories, are based on some sort of evidence, then they aren't worth a damn.

[mike tesko]

Yet to be worked out by those in favour of Bambers guilt, is precisely how Sheila managed to be holding the fingers of her right hand against her neck long enough for blood to pool in the fold of her arm to dry, before the second shot under the chin was executed?

If Jeremy was the killer, then surely he would have known it unlikely that shooting Sheila sideways on in the neck stood little  chance of killing Sheila? Even more so, when as she must have done, put the fingers of her right hand up against her neck - OUCH, that hurts?

[sc82]

In fact for Sheila, who was inexperienced with firearms, to have fired 25 shots, whilst being in a psychotic rage, and somehow hitting the target with 100% accuracy, could be considered highly unlikely.

I would argue people in psychotic rages are capable of just about anything. Now, playing devils advocate, I could imagine if Jeremy hated his parents as much as some say, he may shoot them in a "sadistic" manner as you put it but why on earth would he unleash such hatred on the children? I just can't see it. To me, that is more of an indication of someone behaving in an irrational, psychotic manner

[Hartley]

I would argue people in psychotic rages are capable of just about anything. Now, playing devils advocate, I could imagine if Jeremy hated his parents as much as some say, he may shoot them in a "sadistic" manner as you put it but why on earth would he unleash such hatred on the children? I just can't see it. To me, that is more of an indication of someone behaving in an irrational, psychotic manner

As I said, we could make anything fit.

Perhaps, if it was Jeremy, who had no particular problem with the children, but did also not want to share the estate with them, then he shot them in their sleep several times to ensure that they did not suffer. one still had their thumb in their mouths.

[sc82]

As I said, we could make anything fit.

Perhaps, if it was Jeremy, who had no particular problem with the children, but did also not want to share the estate with them, then he shot them in their sleep several times to ensure that they did not suffer. one still had their thumb in their mouths.

When it only needed one shot?? And him being such a good shot and all??  To me it just doesn't fit. Its so over the top and unecessary. As you say, Jeremy didn't have any particular problem with the children so I dont understand...although some may say he did that precisely to make it look as though Sheila had gone crazy I guess.

[Newbury1]

Also, if Jeremy was the shooter, why would there have been a delay between shots?
Its been documented that Sheila would have likely been floored for a short time after the first shot so that would have been a perfect opportunity for Jeremy to fire the 2nd shot.
There wouldn't have been a need for there to be any significant delay between shots as it doesn't seem Sheila would have been fit to put up a fight after the first shot.

I did give an account to a previous question you posed on a different thread (Campion Calling Aunt Agatha #46) in this respect, but received no response from you (not that you have to respond of course).

The delay between shots to SC could have been down to the first shot being accidental (as previously posted).

JB may have hoped that having shot SC in the throat and rendering her unconscious, that she may die; however when SC stirred JB was forced into firing the 2nd shot to make sure she died.

The second shot was not something JB planned for, but when SC did stir after the first shot he panicked and had to fire the 2nd shot. He could not let her live after what he had just done. The second shot did the job!

This is just a reply to your post and food for thought - not fact!