Police received screaming and ranting responses from inside farmhouse

[mike tesko]

Police received screaming and ranting responses from inside farmhouse

According to Shaw's account, police did not try to approach or get into the farmhouse before 7:30am, because they were in contact with Sheila inside the farmhouse from as early as 5:25am, at which stage they got responses from Sheila, who was running amok inside the farmhouse, screaming obscenities and religious rantings. The police knew she was armed with a gun, and that she was moving around inside the farmhouse, and they could not pinpoint her long enough to commence an approach to get into the farmhouse, until WPC Jeapes spotted the rifle at the bedroom window at about 7:15, which was the signal for the police to force an entry to get into the building by way of the (ground floor) back kitchen door on the other side of the building...

[mike tesko]

Whf was a large building, and from 5am there were over 10 trained firearms officers at the scene, plus numerous other police officers who could easily have contained the farmhouse and kept observations, to allow an approach to the house, but we are told that no such approach was actually made to the farmhouse until after another 10 firearms officers arrived at 7am...

[mike tesko]

So, what we have according to the official version of events, is that the police arrive at the farmhouse just before 4am and the only approach to get anywhere near to the house was made when PS Bews, PC Myall, and Jeremy set foot into the grounds and saw the figure moving about in the main bedroom. There is an hour delay before the first group of 10 firearms officers arrive at the scene at about 5am, and nobody makes any move towards the farmhouse. Then at about 6:30am, police at the scene send for two ambulances, one to go directly to the scene (farmhouse) and the other to be held back in pages lane), then at 7am another group of 10 armed officers arrive, and it takes until after the sighting of the rifle at the bedroom window (7:15am) for the police to eventually make a decision to get into the house, as described at about 7:30am...

Police at the scene had been sat there twiddling their thumbs for over three and a half hours, and nobody had thought to go along either to the front door of the house, or the rear door door and knock on the door, or look through any ground floor window...

I mean, I don't get it, if everyone was already dead, what took the police so long to make the approach to get into the farmhouse?

Why not simply go up to the door of the house and knock upon it?

Why not take a look into the kitchen window, or any other ground floor window?

If everyone was already dead by that stage, why wait three and a half hours to try to get into the house?

Boy scouts could have done a better job than the police, if it is their case that they waited three and a half hours before approaching the house, with everybody already dead inside, except for a dog...

Now, how dangerous was this dog?

Were the police frightened off by this dog barking inside the farmhouse, or what?

[boheme]

If JB was at the scene how did the Police manage to hide the fact that Sheila was running around screaming from him - as far as I am aware he makes no mention of this ?

[mike tesko]

If JB was at the scene how did the Police manage to hide the fact that Sheila was running around screaming from him - as far as I am aware he makes no mention of this ?

Jeremy was for the main sat in a patrol car or near the patrol car (CA07) which was parked up near the cottages along Pages lane - the screaming and rantings were overheard via the telephone eavesdrop which the operator patched through to the control room, which in turn was relayed to the firearm officers at the scene. Audio recordings of these events have not been disclosed, neither has any written record of what was said over the loud hailers by police outside the farmhouse, or the responses made by Sheila from inside the farmhouse. Anyone stood in pages lane, could not possible have been expected to hear any response made by Sheila from somewhere inside the farmhouse at the time these challenges were being made by the police from outside...

Jeremy did not mention any of these challenges, so does that mean that no such challenges were being made?

There is no information at all, from which side of the farmhouse, or how far away the police were when they made these challenges to the occupants inside the farmhouse, its all been kept a closely guarded secret for some reason...

The only information which has been provided is the positions taken up by members of the firearms team, just prior to the raid team making its approach to get into the farmhouse, after WPC Jeapes spotted the rifle leaning up against the bedroom window at about 7:15am ( she did not arrive at the scene until 7am)...

[mike tesko]

No official record exists to show reason why two ambulances were requested at the scene from 6:30am, onwards, and why was needed immediately at the farmhouse, whilst the the other was put on stand by in pages lane?

[vidvic]

And shaw's account is where? Surprised 'z' never mentioned this new information earlier as he would have been there at the time?

[Hartley]

I think J.R.R.Tolkien would have had a run for his money with some of these stories, had he still been in the land of the living.

Shaw's 'An Innocent Man', incomplete, unpublished and unreferenced manuscript can be viewed here:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:jP4ZtW5Off0J:www.sleuthingforjustice.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php%3Ff%3D74%26t%3D2445+Barbara+W

In addition to the lack of references, there are many parts which can be unequivocally dismissed as fantasy due to documents which have been posted on this forum. One such example is the claim that Peter Eaton argued with and punched Ralph, on this rare instance Shaw refers people to a police action report No. 1113. Unfortunately this is a complete fabrication, people can view the police action report 1113 in this thread: http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,1132.0.html

[mertol22]

Mike the rifle spotted nr the window, im thinking this was elsewhere before the police spotted it, and i was in the scouts and yes i could have done better, stun grenades were around then teargas this was quite a useless operation by then and now a useless police force who employ with officers with a criminal background so nothing new there.

[Hartley]

Police received screaming and ranting responses from inside farmhouse

According to Shaw's account, police did not try to approach or get into the farmhouse before 7:30am, because they were in contact with Sheila inside the farmhouse from as early as 5:25am, at which stage they got responses from Sheila, who was running amok inside the farmhouse, screaming obscenities and religious rantings. The police knew she was armed with a gun, and that she was moving around inside the farmhouse, and they could not pinpoint her long enough to commence an approach to get into the farmhouse, until WPC Jeapes spotted the rifle at the bedroom window at about 7:15, which was the signal for the police to force an entry to get into the building by way of the (ground floor) back kitchen door on the other side of the building...

My goodness gracious me. Why on Earth do people so blatantly lie? It's not as if on this occasion it cannot be checked, the relevant extract from Shaw's manuscript is below in red. People can make their own minds up whether or not it bears any resemblance to what is described by 'Tell Tale Mike'. 

It would be eighteen years before Paul Terzeon got to hear any of the above information. Nor was he aware in 1986 of a bizarre radio log message sent back to the control room from the TFU, who arrived at White House Farm a little after 5.00 am. Obviously one of the first jobs of the Tactical Firearms Unit was to try and make contact with anyone alive inside the house. It’s difficult to research this part of the story because the police still refuse to divulge the necessary tapes and transcripts. What we do know is that the crime scene was an isolated farmhouse and that possibly four or five seriously wounded people may have been inside – two of them children; it seems bizarre that if the farmhouse was utterly silent and devoid of any signs of movement or life, that no police officer would even approach the house or attempt any type of entry. The cat’s paw sneaked out the bag in March 2004 when a previously undisclosed 18 pages of Radio Log were handed over to Jeremy’s new defence team. Scanning through this documentation, a single entry stands out like lightning on a perfect summer’s day:

‘05.25 (a.m.)

Firearms team are in conversation with a person from inside the farm.’

It appears to be a staggering entry. How could the TFU be in conversation with someone inside the farmhouse if everyone inside the farmhouse was dead?

When confronted in 2004, Essex police thought long and hard about their answer. Firstly, they argued that the word ‘conversation’ was merely a bad choice of word to describe something that wasn’t… in fact… a conversation. My understanding of the word ‘conversation’ is that it refers to a verbal exchange of some kind – and this makes sense with the timing of the recording – a mere fifteen minutes after the TFU first arrived. The Radio Log further indicates that several minutes later the TFU were still making ‘challenges’ to someone ‘inside the building.’

[vidvic]

If the police were talking to Sheila, trying to get her to calm down, why would they not ask her brother to talk to her? This whole conversation was never mentioned to JB, yet allegedly lasted several hours. He was only 50m away, if that, no one mentioned it to him??
When the family started questioned the four murders and a suicide theory, why did the police never say, "look, we know it was her, we were talking to her" weeks before JB was in the frame??
Stan Jones would never have even entertained the JB theory if his colleagues had been talking to Sheila that morning.

[Roch]

If the police were talking to Sheila, trying to get her to calm down, why would they not ask her brother to talk to her? This whole conversation was never mentioned to JB, yet allegedly lasted several hours. He was only 50m away, if that, no one mentioned it to him??
When the family started questioned the four murders and a suicide theory, why did the police never say, "look, we know it was her, we were talking to her" weeks before JB was in the frame??
Stan Jones would never have even entertained the JB theory if his colleagues had been talking to Sheila that morning.

Good post. 

[mertol22]

 with Sheila inside they could have kept her talking and stormed there and then, as this was a firearm situation i would not expect them to ask Jeremy to speak to her, making him a target, seems they botched this up as well.

[grahameb]

Police received screaming and ranting responses from inside farmhouse

According to Shaw's account, police did not try to approach or get into the farmhouse before 7:30am, because they were in contact with Sheila inside the farmhouse from as early as 5:25am, at which stage they got responses from Sheila, who was running amok inside the farmhouse, screaming obscenities and religious rantings. The police knew she was armed with a gun, and that she was moving around inside the farmhouse, and they could not pinpoint her long enough to commence an approach to get into the farmhouse, until WPC Jeapes spotted the rifle at the bedroom window at about 7:15, which was the signal for the police to force an entry to get into the building by way of the (ground floor) back kitchen door on the other side of the building...

Mike, where did Shaw get this information from? Did he have any documentation to prove all this happened? Also I find it rather odd that the police didn't make Jeremy aware of all this? It is usual for police to wait for quite long periods in hostage situations and try various ways to make contact with the people involved. But I am unsettled as to why they would wait for so long when they got no response from anyone inside the house? In my opinion and I stress in my opinion I would have thought that if the police got no response ofter about half an hour then they would have investigated sooner? Unless of course it took a long time to get the armed response team to the scene?

[mike tesko]

For those who are interested, Shaw and myself shared private emails, where more than is published in his manuscript, is mentioned. I would advise everyone to be careful of an idiot who make posts on here without knowing or referring to the truth...