Channel 5 documentary 8th June 9.00 pm - 10.30 pm

[Jonathan]

Very skeptical of the mill bank audio.

You would have to come to a view that someone threatened Milbank and silenced him for four decades.

I would be shouting from the rooftops if I knew an Innocent man was rotting in prison,

Or he played along a little with a pretty young journalist lady. He's been known about for years - but seems noone spoke to him until Heidi Blake. The CT probably as surprised as anyone when they heard the audio.

Bamber's lawyers would have braced Milbank a decade ago - but knew the evidence showed the call was patched through by the operator. So the "999 call" merely went in vanilla as part of a scattergun application - only to be given additional life by Heidi Blake.

The basics are consistent - a call went through to him at 6.09am. Might have come direct from inside WHF? He went along with HB's line of questioning.

He seemed to dispute he'd given a statement to Essex Police clarifying the circumstances of the call. Then emailed HB to say he might have done. Then refused to have anything more to do with her.

All thing being considered you could not take this into a courtroom.

[Jonathan]

Would like to have heard Heidi put to him that the evidence suggested the call was put through by the operator. But I suppose that might have killed the story.

[Adam]

Unless I misunderstood the doc, jeremy is not saying the relatives deliberatley fabricated the silencer.

He is suggesting the police took all the WHF & relatives silencers. EP got the silencers mixed up & gave one of the relatives silencers for testing instead. This had RB's blood in.

Optimistic!

He would still have to explain how one of the other silencers had the aga paint on.

[Jane]

Would like to have heard Heidi put to him that the evidence suggested the call was put through by the operator. But I suppose that might have killed the story.

An example, perhaps, of why witnesses are only permitted to answer the question put to them and nothing more, in case it alters the story.

[snow66!]

I'm afraid I don't see how. In fact, if it was accepted, any suggestion that NB was moved could be damaging to Bamber as the police W/S clearly state they saw him in his final position through the window before entering.

I just think that Boyce's experiment looks like a far better approximation of NB's mysterious wounds than the previous, perfectly round efforts. How they fit into the crime, if they fit at all, cannot be known. They weren't an issue at trial so almost certainly not a ground of appeal.

Yes, I agree that the suggestion that Nevill was moved corrupts the Aga burn evidence, AD!
All that Boyce/JBs legal team had to do was prove the Aga burnt Nevill on the night of the murders and leave it up to the CCRC to explain when this happened.
And obviously the CCRC would have to conclude that the burns must have happened sometime before 3.30 no matter who the killer was.
The thing is, Philip Boyce claims the Aga parts would have taken hours to burn Nevills back which simply does not fit in with the prosecution scenario sent to the DPP in 1985/6.
The police scenario has Nevill being shot in bed, chased to the kitchen and shot to death soon after on the scuttle, so no time for any back burning for several hours!
The only conclusion that makes sense is that Nevills back was burned on the Aga before he went up stairs around 3.15.
So I think it can be known how/when the burns fit in AD, and a good lawyer could put forward a good case for JBs innocence.

[Adam]

Yes, I agree that the suggestion that Nevill was moved corrupts the Aga burn evidence, AD!
All that Boyce/JBs legal team had to do was prove the Aga burnt Nevill on the night of the murders and leave it up to the CCRC to explain when this happened.
And obviously the CCRC would have to conclude that the burns must have happened sometime before 3.30 no matter who the killer was.
The thing is, Philip Boyce claims the Aga parts would have taken hours to burn Nevills back which simply does not fit in with the prosecution scenario sent to the DPP in 1985/6.
The police scenario has Nevill being shot in bed, chased to the kitchen and shot to death soon after on the scuttle, so no time for any back burning for several hours!
The only conclusion that makes sense is that Nevills back was burned on the Aga before he went up stairs around 3.15.
So I think it can be known how/when the burns fit in AD, and a good lawyer could put forward a good case for JBs innocence.

The police scenario does have time for Jeremy to burn Nevill's back. That may have been a reason he was lifted onto the coal scuttle.

[snow66!]

The police scenario does have time for Jeremy to burn Nevill's back. That may have been a reason he was lifted onto the coal scuttle.

Yes, but not if we accept the Aga caused the burns and they took several hours to form, Adam!
AD hinted that he thought the Aga knobs made more sense than the round uniform marks of the rifle barrel.

[snow66!]

Would like to have heard Heidi put to him that the evidence suggested the call was put through by the operator. But I suppose that might have killed the story.

Philip Walker and an ex telephone engineer have appeared in an hour long youtube video discussing the possibility of the Milbank call, Jonathan.
Its under the title 'all things conflict', can't remember the hosts name!

[Adam]

https://youtu.be/tg-vPeWRoOc?is=mbEBlfieXvu2FYWy

[Jonathan]

Philip Walker and an ex telephone engineer have appeared in an hour long youtube video discussing the possibility of the Milbank call, Jonathan.
Its under the title 'all things conflict', can't remember the hosts name!

What "possibility"? It was patched through by the operator monitoring the line. This isn't up for debate.

[Adam]

Not sure about Phillip's claim that if he admitted guilt early on, his 25 years would not have been increased to a whole life tarriff. It was a horrendus crime.

Appealing straight away in a high profile crime may have resulted in getting a technicality within 10 years. As it did for Barry George & Sion Jenkins.

[Adam]

Philip is talking about the 999 call again.

It took me about 10 minutes to link Burrell, Rowe & Milbank. Then work out that Sheila would not dial 999, say nothing & leave the phone off the hook if the police were outside or she wanted to commit suicide.

[snow66!]

What "possibility"? It was patched through by the operator monitoring the line. This isn't up for debate.

I haven't watched the video, Jonathan, don't know if they discuss the link up by Jean Rowe or not!
They have more need to do a video on the Aga burns!

[Adam]

Seems they are saying it was off the hook & the police linked themselves up to the open line at around 5.50am.

They are saying all Sheila had to do was put the phone back on it's cradle at 6.09am to disconnect the police listening in. She could then dial 999.

Optimistic.

[ILB]

Or he played along a little with a pretty young journalist lady. He's been known about for years - but seems noone spoke to him until Heidi Blake. The CT probably as surprised as anyone when they heard the audio.

Bamber's lawyers would have braced Milbank a decade ago - but knew the evidence showed the call was patched through by the operator. So the "999 call" merely went in vanilla as part of a scattergun application - only to be given additional life by Heidi Blake.

The basics are consistent - a call went through to him at 6.09am. Might have come direct from inside WHF? He went along with HB's line of questioning.

He seemed to dispute he'd given a statement to Essex Police clarifying the circumstances of the call. Then emailed HB to say he might have done. Then refused to have anything more to do with her.

All thing being considered you could not take this into a courtroom.

When did Milibank first surface to JB?