Author Topic: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.  (Read 15213 times)

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Offline Adam

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Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« on: December 27, 2025, 03:45:PM »
Please create them here.

The Jeremy scenario should start from him leaving his cottage & end with him returning. Entrance/exit important. Events inside WHF should match the bullet casings & body locations 

A Sheila scenario which has an invented build up would be thrown out of court, the CCRC & COA. But feel free anyway. Or just agree with the 1986 defence scenario.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2025, 03:51:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Jonathan

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2025, 04:10:PM »
Are you asking for my scenarios? Or asking other forum members to put forward their speculation on what "Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios" might be?

Offline Adam

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2025, 04:17:PM »
Are you asking for my scenarios? Or asking other forum members to put forward their speculation on what "Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios" might be?

Yours, as a new poster.

Everyone else has created at least one.

If you are a guilter, just a Jeremy scenario is fine. Vice versa if a supporter.

If on the fence then two scenarios will explain why.
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline David1819

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2025, 05:15:PM »
Yours, as a new poster.

Everyone else has created at least one.

If you are a guilter, just a Jeremy scenario is fine. Vice versa if a supporter.

If on the fence then two scenarios will explain why.

Does CC/KE/Curiosity/Munksa/Jonathan have a different scenario for each account?

Offline Jonathan

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2025, 05:54:PM »
This seems to me the simplest scenario - regardless of the perpetrator.

Jem leaves his cottage and cycles to WHF. He uses the saw blade to gain entry through the shower room window. He takes the kitchen phone off the hook - disabling any attempt by parents to make an outgoing call from the bedroom if they heard him downstairs. He gets the loaded rifle from where he has hidden it in a cupboard earlier - not leaving it out as he had claimed in case Nevill put it away somewhere where it might take a while to find - attaches a silencer. He has to use a silencer to minimise the chance of shots being heard by anyone nearby.

He climbs the stairs - his mother and father have not heard him - he enters their room puts 4 into June then 4 into Nevill. He goes to the boys' room - it takes him a while to summon the courage to shoot them - but he does so with one bullet each.

He believes all but Sheila have been incapacitated so he goes downstairs to reload in the kitchen. Nevill has managed a partial recovery comes downstairs, staggers in and a fight ensues - silencer gets chipped paint on it - Jem prevails against his weakened father battering him with the rifle butt. Nevill slumps where he is later found - Jem puts 4 more into Nevill's head killing him.

Jem fully reloads and goes back upstairs to find Sheila in the bedroom with June who has made progress crawling to the telephone. He puts more into June then at gunpoint commands a terrified Sheila to lie down and close her eyes. He shoots Sheila in the neck but she wriggles at the touch of the silencer so he misses the clean shot - realises he's made a mess of it but needs to wait to see if the shot is fatal. He goes into the boys bedroom puts all bar one bullet into them to make it look like a maniac attack.

Back in parents room Sheila is not dead - he can't risk her surviving but can't wait too long for her to die naturally. He waits but she still won't expire. Finally unable to wait any longer he puts the fatal shot into her head and leaves the empty rifle with her. He takes the bedroom phone downstairs and after removing the existing phone (putting it under magazines) plugs it in - dials his cottage and leaves the phone off the hook - creating the scene for the later "Nevill phone call". He puts the silencer in the cupboard where it is later found - he's not worried about DNA as the technology is in it's infancy and he doesn't know about it.

He exits the house using the window above the sink  - banging it shut so the latch falls and locks it from inside. He cycles home.

Offline Adam

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2025, 06:18:PM »
This seems to me the simplest scenario - regardless of the perpetrator.

Jem leaves his cottage and cycles to WHF. He uses the saw blade to gain entry through the shower room window. He takes the kitchen phone off the hook - disabling any attempt by parents to make an outgoing call from the bedroom if they heard him downstairs. He gets the loaded rifle from where he has hidden it in a cupboard earlier - not leaving it out as he had claimed in case Nevill put it away somewhere where it might take a while to find - attaches a silencer. He has to use a silencer to minimise the chance of shots being heard by anyone nearby.

He climbs the stairs - his mother and father have not heard him - he enters their room puts 4 into June then 4 into Nevill. He goes to the boys' room - it takes him a while to summon the courage to shoot them - but he does so with one bullet each.

He believes all but Sheila have been incapacitated so he goes downstairs to reload in the kitchen. Nevill has managed a partial recovery comes downstairs, staggers in and a fight ensues - silencer gets chipped paint on it - Jem prevails against his weakened father battering him with the rifle butt. Nevill slumps where he is later found - Jem puts 4 more into Nevill's head killing him.

Jem fully reloads and goes back upstairs to find Sheila in the bedroom with June who has made progress crawling to the telephone. He puts more into June then at gunpoint commands a terrified Sheila to lie down and close her eyes. He shoots Sheila in the neck but she wriggles at the touch of the silencer so he misses the clean shot - realises he's made a mess of it but needs to wait to see if the shot is fatal. He goes into the boys bedroom puts all bar one bullet into them to make it look like a maniac attack.

Back in parents room Sheila is not dead - he can't risk her surviving but can't wait too long for her to die naturally. He waits but she still won't expire. Finally unable to wait any longer he puts the fatal shot into her head and leaves the empty rifle with her. He takes the bedroom phone downstairs and after removing the existing phone (putting it under magazines) plugs it in - dials his cottage and leaves the phone off the hook - creating the scene for the later "Nevill phone call". He puts the silencer in the cupboard where it is later found - he's not worried about DNA as the technology is in it's infancy and he doesn't know about it.

He exits the house using the window above the sink  - banging it shut so the latch falls and locks it from inside. He cycles home.

That matches the crime scene evidence. Except June was shot 5 times in bed.

Julie said the twins were shot first. If correct I believe it was once each.

Don't believe Nevill fell where he was found. Head in a coal scuttle.

Also believe it likely he disabled the phones upon entrance. No reason why the bedroom phone should be im the kitchen.

The kitchen attack was so crazed, believe it would have been after he had chased Nevill. An injured Nevill upstairs would want to save energy & try to stop Bamber when he gets back upstairs.
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Adam

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2025, 06:32:PM »
This seems to me the simplest scenario - regardless of the perpetrator.

Jem leaves his cottage and cycles to WHF. He uses the saw blade to gain entry through the shower room window. He takes the kitchen phone off the hook - disabling any attempt by parents to make an outgoing call from the bedroom if they heard him downstairs. He gets the loaded rifle from where he has hidden it in a cupboard earlier - not leaving it out as he had claimed in case Nevill put it away somewhere where it might take a while to find - attaches a silencer. He has to use a silencer to minimise the chance of shots being heard by anyone nearby.

He climbs the stairs - his mother and father have not heard him - he enters their room puts 4 into June then 4 into Nevill. He goes to the boys' room - it takes him a while to summon the courage to shoot them - but he does so with one bullet each.

He believes all but Sheila have been incapacitated so he goes downstairs to reload in the kitchen. Nevill has managed a partial recovery comes downstairs, staggers in and a fight ensues - silencer gets chipped paint on it - Jem prevails against his weakened father battering him with the rifle butt. Nevill slumps where he is later found - Jem puts 4 more into Nevill's head killing him.

Jem fully reloads and goes back upstairs to find Sheila in the bedroom with June who has made progress crawling to the telephone. He puts more into June then at gunpoint commands a terrified Sheila to lie down and close her eyes. He shoots Sheila in the neck but she wriggles at the touch of the silencer so he misses the clean shot - realises he's made a mess of it but needs to wait to see if the shot is fatal. He goes into the boys bedroom puts all bar one bullet into them to make it look like a maniac attack.

Back in parents room Sheila is not dead - he can't risk her surviving but can't wait too long for her to die naturally. He waits but she still won't expire. Finally unable to wait any longer he puts the fatal shot into her head and leaves the empty rifle with her. He takes the bedroom phone downstairs and after removing the existing phone (putting it under magazines) plugs it in - dials his cottage and leaves the phone off the hook - creating the scene for the later "Nevill phone call". He puts the silencer in the cupboard where it is later found - he's not worried about DNA as the technology is in it's infancy and he doesn't know about it.

He exits the house using the window above the sink  - banging it shut so the latch falls and locks it from inside. He cycles home.

What route do you believe he cycled?

The Sea Wall cycle path was around 3 miles. He then would cycle up Pages Lane. This is a road of around 1 mile.

The BHL route was quicker but passed a lot of properties.
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Rob_

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2025, 06:48:PM »
From the arc pattern of the shots to one of the twins, the shots must have been fired in one go not one shot to each child then the perpetrator coming back latter later to fire more times.

PV also gives this opinion in his autopsy.

From a human point of view the sound moderator makes little difference MF also says this.

Offline Adam

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2025, 07:30:PM »
From the arc pattern of the shots to one of the twins, the shots must have been fired in one go not one shot to each child then the perpetrator coming back latter later to fire more times.

PV also gives this opinion in his autopsy.

From a human point of view the sound moderator makes little difference MF also says this.

Agree the twins and Sheila may have slept through everything.

Or the twins were shot once each early on & later 6 times in succession.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2025, 07:32:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Jonathan

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #9 on: December 27, 2025, 07:59:PM »
From the arc pattern of the shots to one of the twins, the shots must have been fired in one go not one shot to each child then the perpetrator coming back latter later to fire more times.

PV also gives this opinion in his autopsy.

From a human point of view the sound moderator makes little difference MF also says this.

I'd say there are multiple scenarios with different sequences of shootings - mine is just one. But I do think the parents must have been first. Possibly the twins were last - used as a bargaining chip to get Sheila to comply - "lie down quietly and they live". Jem did not hold up his end of the bargain.

Offline Rob_

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2025, 08:19:PM »
I'd say there are multiple scenarios with different sequences of shootings - mine is just one. But I do think the parents must have been first. Possibly the twins were last - used as a bargaining chip to get Sheila to comply - "lie down quietly and they live". Jem did not hold up his end of the bargain.

With June in full view lying on the floor do you really think Sheila would simply lie down?

If she resists the shot is impossible, why does Bamber take the risk of walking Sheila right past June?   

Offline Jonathan

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2025, 08:27:PM »
With June in full view lying on the floor do you really think Sheila would simply lie down?

If she resists the shot is impossible, why does Bamber take the risk of walking Sheila right past June?   

Many people will do as they are told if they have a gun pointing at them. You're a woman confronted by a bigger man with a gun - not much you can do to resist.

Offline Rob_

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2025, 08:38:PM »
Many people will do as they are told if they have a gun pointing at them. You're a woman confronted by a bigger man with a gun - not much you can do to resist.

not if someone is lying shot to pieces on the floor a few feet away you don't, you have nothing to lose but run or fight as best you can.   

Offline Jonathan

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2025, 08:43:PM »
not if someone is lying shot to pieces on the floor a few feet away you don't, you have nothing to lose but run or fight as best you can.   

Maybe you might do this  - others will be almost paralysed with fear

as I said maybe Jem told her he'd spare the twins if she did as she was told

believing that Sheila could be manoeuvred into position is not a difficult hurdle to overcome

Offline Adam

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Re: Jonathan's Jeremy & Sheila scenarios.
« Reply #14 on: December 27, 2025, 08:47:PM »
Doubt that Bamber had the main bedroom light on when he lead Sheila to her death. The hallway light would have provided enough. He knew his way around.

Sheila was already very drowsy and half asleep so may not have noticed June. If she did, there was nothing she could do to stop Bamber shooting her.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2025, 08:48:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.