Much ado about nothing...

[Hardy Boy]

Is his 2002 statement online?

Assume he made a WS in 1985. EP would have passed this to the CCRC.

Mis remembered things. He also suggests this several times when talking to Blake.

Getting more unlikely that the CCRC are going to change there mind.

I think the biggest challenge will be knocking out four contemporaneous logs/statements, they will override  any journalistic Podcast, unless their is evidence to prove they are Fake/fabricated.  Jean Rowes statement was singed on the 8th of August, she was 58 at the time which would make her 98 if she’s still with us. Inspector Burrell signed his hand written one on the 13th of Sept 1985, Roch said someone thought it was a memo, but… Memo or statement, it documents what Burrell did at 06:09am  and that’s the part that actually matters, he’s also provided a written statement/memo.

[Jonathan]

I think the biggest challenge will be knocking out four contemporaneous logs/statements, they will override  any journalistic Podcast, unless their is evidence to prove they are Fake/fabricated.  Jean Rowes statement was singed on the 8th of August, she was 58 at the time which would make her 98 if she’s still with us. Inspector Burrell signed his hand written one on the 13th of Sept 1985, Roch said someone thought it was a memo, but… Memo or statement, it documents what Burrell did at 06:09am  and that’s the part that actually matters, he’s also provided a written statement/memo.

There's also the fact that Milbank seems to have said nothing at the time to his superiors or anyone else for that matter. Or if he did it was covered up for some reason.

[Adam]

I think the biggest challenge will be knocking out four contemporaneous logs/statements, they will override  any journalistic Podcast, unless their is evidence to prove they are Fake/fabricated.  Jean Rowes statement was singed on the 8th of August, she was 58 at the time which would make her 98 if she’s still with us. Inspector Burrell signed his hand written one on the 13th of Sept 1985, Roch said someone thought it was a memo, but… Memo or statement, it documents what Burrell did at 06:09am  and that’s the part that actually matters, he’s also provided a written statement/memo.

Does the CCRC have common sense discretion as well.

The liklihood of Sheila keeping herself alive,  dialling 999 at 6.09am when the police had been outside with a loud speaker for 2 hours, not saying anything & then Milbank not saying anything is slim to zero.

[Hardy Boy]

Does the CCRC have common sense discretion as well.

The liklihood of Sheila keeping herself alive,  dialling 999 at 6.09am when the police had been outside with a loud speaker for 2 hours, not saying anything & then Milbank not saying anything is slim to zero.

Which was all documented, no response, phone off hook, statements and logs match,  and actually there’s no record of a 999 call anywhere at all that Millbank mentioned,   without checking again, 

This is his recollection
      He answered a call on the 9s system.
      No one spoke.
      He listened to an open line.
      He heard movement-type noises but isn’t sure what they were.

He never said as far as I’m aware    I saw a 999 call come in from WHF.
I saw a call logged from that number.  Someone dialled 999


Everything Millbank is suggesting is consistent with a patched up line to WHF which was set up, the unfortunate part being, Rowe never said anything to him when she put it through, she assumed Millbank was waiting for the call when in fact he’d just started his shift at 6.00am and probably not been briefed?  All Millbank knows is what system the call came through on which was the 9s and Jean Rowe not  saying anything might have caused him confusion as to who the caller was.

[Rob_]

Which was all documented, no response, phone off hook, statements and logs match,  and actually there’s no record of a 999 call anywhere at all that Millbank mentioned,   without checking again, 

This is his recollection
      He answered a call on the 9s system.
      No one spoke.
      He listened to an open line.
      He heard movement-type noises but isn’t sure what they were.

He never said as far as I’m aware    I saw a 999 call come in from WHF.
I saw a call logged from that number.  Someone dialled 999


Everything Millbank is suggesting is consistent with a patched up line to WHF which was set up, the unfortunate part being, Rowe never said anything to him when she put it through, she assumed Millbank was waiting for the call when in fact he’d just started his shift at 6.00am and probably not been briefed?  All Millbank knows is what system the call came through on which was the 9s and Jean Rowe not  saying anything might have caused him confusion as to who the caller was.

Surely the operator would have spoken to Milbank? and someone would have informed him a call was about to come through that was on the 9 system but not a 999 call that he needed to monitor the line?

[Hardy Boy]

Surely the operator would have spoken to Milbank? and someone would have informed him a call was about to come through that was on the 9 system but not a 999 call that he needed to monitor the line?

Jean Rowe doesn’t mention speaking to Millbank because her job wasn’t to brief him,  it was to connect the WHF line to HQ and her job was done, she was busy with other things to do.    Jean Rowe wouldn’t have known that Millbank had just started his shift, she’d been in conversation since early hours so just did what she was asked to do, the key part is, she never even listened in to the line. Rowe did what she was asked to do that’s all, she only notes connecting the lines, her silence with Millbank marches what he said anyway “no one spoke” so they both match up.

[Hardy Boy]

Jean Rowe doesn’t mention speaking to Millbank because her job wasn’t to brief him,  it was to connect the WHF line to HQ and her job was done, she was busy with other things to do.    Jean Rowe wouldn’t have known that Millbank had just started his shift, she’d been in conversation since early hours so just did what she was asked to do, the key part is, she never even listened in to the line. Rowe did what she was asked to do that’s all, she only notes connecting the lines, her silence with Millbank marches what he said anyway “no one spoke” so they both match up.

If Rowe said in her statement ‘she never listened into the line” how can that be a 999 emergency call?  It’s impossible, it’s the Operators Job to try to make conversation on an emergency call, it’s not her job to be silent, she would have greeted any 999 call with “EMERGENCY WHICH SERVICE” “ Do you need Police, Fire Or Ambulance.

[Roch]

If Rowe said in her statement ‘she never listened into the line” how can that be a 999 emergency call?  It’s impossible, it’s the Operators Job to try to make conversation on an emergency call, it’s not her job to be silent, she would have greeted any 999 call with “EMERGENCY WHICH SERVICE” “ Do you need Police, Fire Or Ambulance.

I don't think it's being suggested that Rowe took the call.

[BarefootDanC]

Does the CCRC have common sense discretion as well.

Yes, because their decision on whether or not to make a referral is based on how the Court of Appeal are likely to treat it.

[Hardy Boy]

I don't think it's being suggested that Rowe took the call.

Right, thanks Roch  that gives me something to chew on 😂. So which is it: Jean Rowe’s statement is forged, another operator secretly made the same connection, or WHF somehow had a direct 999 line into the incident room straight through to Millbank
If Jean Rowe physically made the connection, as she says, who made the other one  and where’s the record? Because Burrell’s statement, the incident room log, and West’s record all say the same thing: the line was patched via the 9s system. To then dismiss all of this it has to be shown that the line wasn’t patched by Rowe, or Rowe’s statement is forged and all the others are forged, and either there was record of another OP making the connection or a direct line link to Incident room 🙈

I understand you don’t want to give too much away Roch, every little helps though 😂😂😂

[Jonathan]

The line was being monitored. It would have been noticed if at 6.09 Sheila cut the line in order to make a fresh call. Is this someone else lying?

[Hardy Boy]

The line was being monitored. It would have been noticed if at 6.09 Sheila cut the line in order to make a fresh call. Is this someone else lying?

Ive done a research, my only question was could a direct line have been installed at WHF because Neville was a Magistrate?

In the 1980s:
   A call going straight to the Police via the 999 would require a pre-installed direct circuit (a private line), not the public telephone network.
   If such a direct line existed, no operator intervention would be required at all.

So is this a possibility, well it has to contradict every available document that shows a patched call with WHF was made at 6.09am by physical means by Jean Rowe.  What’s the chances of a 999 call coming through and a connection by the Operator or another operator and Jean Rowe all at the same time?

Rowe’s statement was taken the next morning, earlier than most others,  it could have been normal procedural, but it does stand out, and it does cause a slight flag for me?

Statement taken and signature witnessed by Dc 1878 ORPE at above address
at9.00am .Thursday 8th of August 1985
( signed.PJ ORPE Dc 1878

[Hardy Boy]

The line was being monitored. It would have been noticed if at 6.09 Sheila cut the line in order to make a fresh call. Is this someone else lying?

Roch has thrown a few crumbs down, he’s not giving us the Loaf 😂😂😂🙈

[Roch]

Roch has thrown a few crumbs down, he’s not giving us the Loaf 😂😂😂🙈

All I'm saying is that, within the whole 999 from the campaign and those who have contributed from outside the claim, it has never been claimed that Rowe was the initial call taker.

[Hardy Boy]

All I'm saying is that, within the whole 999 from the campaign and those who have contributed from outside the claim, it has never been claimed that Rowe was the initial call taker.

Thanks Roch, If Rowe wasn’t the call-taker, who was then,  A 999 call couldn’t bypass the operator in the 1980s, without a direct line from WHF to the police,  and there’s no record of any other operator or is there and the only evidence available shows Jean Rowe made that connection?