Barbara De"ath discussing sea wall

[ILB]

It goes through Wyke Farm. As stated by Wilkinson. Which is better than driving past 45.

Or he can go around the back.

Not sure how many residents were there. WHF usually had 2 residents. Together with farm workers in seperate properties.

You will confirm whether he had the option of avoiding Wyke farm completely upon your visit.

Very risky

Yes I'll confirm

[Zoso]

Appendix 1 Carol Ann Lee:

Jeremy telephoned Julie from Bourtree Cottage around 10pm. He sounded "pissed off", telling her: "I've been thinking on the tractor and the crime will have to be tonight or never." Aware that he was referring to killing his entire family, Julie told him not to be stupid-he was just fed up because he had been stuck on the tractor all day. They spoke for about twenty minutes. He told her she might hear from him later, athough Julie "thought nothing of this."

Jeremy later described how, after ending the call, he had something to eat and drink and watched television before going to bed around 11:30pm. None of his neighbours heard anything from him. A local car valet who knew Jeremy by sight took a stroll around the village about midnight after drinking in the Chequers; he noticed a number of cars outside Bourtree Cottage, including Jeremy's Astra, but couldn't remember if any lights were on inside the property.

Thanks Steve. I still question how anyone could recall seeing his car weeks later.

[Adam]

Thanks Steve. I still question how anyone could recall seeing his car weeks later.

What do you think of Bamber's reason for June's bike arriving at his cottage 2 days before the massacre - so Julie could cycle several miles to catch a bus when going home?

[Adam]

The left turn pathway around 300 yards before the prosecutions does look very wide & cycle friendly. Going by enlarging Google Maps Satellite.

As Rob said farm tracks are partly designed for tractors.

This farm track actually leads part of the way to a farm. Which is around 150 yards away from where Bamber would take his right turn towards Pages Lane.

After his right turn he goes across two fields onto Pages Lane. Completely avoiding Wyke Farm. The tracks alongside these two fields don't look as wide. But still good enough to cycle on.

[Adam]

If he couldn't cycle alongside the final two fields, he could dump the bike & walk across them. Collecting the bike on the way back.

This walk across these 2 fields leads him to the back of WHF. Avoiding Wyke Farm. A walk of 100 - 300 yards.

[Adam]

The prosecution would want to submit one cycle route to the jury.

The left turn farm track they choose does lead from The Sea Wall to Pages Lane in a virtual straight line. The shortest route and on the best terrain.

Wyke Farm is a long way from Pages Lane. No one will hear or see a silent bike spending 5-10 seconds going past in 2am outside darkness.

However for me, unless shown otherwise after ILB's visit, Bamber also had the other farm track option onto Pages Lane which avoided Wyke Farm.

[Hardy Boy]

The prosecution would want to submit one cycle route to the jury.

The left turn farm track they choose does lead from The Sea Wall to Pages Lane in a virtual straight line. The shortest route and on the best terrain.

Wyke Farm is a long way from Pages Lane. No one will hear or see a bike spending 5-10 seconds going past in 2am outside darkness.

However for me, unless shown otherwise after ILB's visit, for me he also had the other farm track option onto Pages Lane which avoided Wyke Farm.

The prosecution said the following................ on Tuesday 6 August 1985 he had returned by bicycle (taking a route which avoided the main roads) in the early hours of the following morning.  They cannot give one cycle route because they don't know the route he took, just like you don't know and no one on this forum knows if he cycled or not.  How do i know this...........no one has come forward and said they seen him cycle a route and he hasn't admitted he cycled a route.  They went for him cycling, because JM said he planned to cycle and in a later statement on the 18/11/1985 went back to say that she saw the cycle at Jeremy's cottage on the Sunday the 4th and it wasn't at the house the day of the murders on the 7th.   So if he cycled there and back, how do you account for Julie not seeing the bike again at the House?

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4952.0;attach=34828;image

Ann is still looking for the Cycle on the 15th of August.

[Adam]

The prosecution said the following................ on Tuesday 6 August 1985 he had returned by bicycle (taking a route which avoided the main roads) in the early hours of the following morning.  They cannot give one cycle route because they don't know the route he took, just like you don't know and no one on this forum knows if he cycled or not.  How do i know this...........no one has come forward and said they seen him cycle a route and he hasn't admitted he cycled a route.  They went for him cycling, because JM said he planned to cycle and in a later statement on the 18/11/1985 went back to say that she saw the cycle at Jeremy's cottage on the Sunday the 4th and it wasn't at the house the day of the murders on the 7th.   So if he cycled there and back, how do you account for Julie not seeing the bike again at the House?

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=4952.0;attach=34828;image

Ann is still looking for the Cycle on the 15th of August.

It was at the farm on the day of the murders. Bamber probably put it somewhere out of the way. He said himself he had brought the bike over for Julie to use.  Didn't AE find it in the shed?

Once ILB gives his photographic feedback on the other left turn farm track leading to Pages Lane, everyone will know whether he had another option after leaving The Sea Wall. To me it looks very much like he did have the other option.

Agree we will never know what route he took.

[Rob_]

It was at the farm on the day of the murders. Bamber probably put it somewhere out of the way. He said himself he had brought the bike over for Julie to use.  Didn't AE find it in the shed?

Once ILB gives his photographic feedback on the other left turn farm track leading to Pages Lane, everyone will know whether he had another option after leaving The Sea Wall. To me it looks very much like he did have the other option.

Agree we will never know what route he took.

Although we will never know the route he took, there should be a plausible one.

Once you are off the public rights of way, it is unlikely the tracks are cycle friendly, and public rights of way can be pretty rough anyway.

I cannot find the route you are referring to that avoids Wycke's farm? using public rights of way that is? Edges of fields are not public rights of way and generally would not be cyclable.

[Hardy Boy]

It was at the farm on the day of the murders. Bamber probably put it somewhere out of the way. He said himself he had brought the bike over for Julie to use.  Didn't AE find it in the shed?

Once ILB gives his photographic feedback on the other left turn farm track leading to Pages Lane, everyone will know whether he had another option after leaving The Sea Wall. To me it looks very much like he did have the other option.

Agree we will never know what route he took.

Ann found it at Jeremy's cottage on the 22nd of August it was outside the backdoor, yet Julie never saw it, so where had it been?..........Barlow seen it there the previous day at Jeremy's cottage

https://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=5815.0;attach=37694;image

[ILB]

Have to go by RB and Jeremy as a valid source until I make the pilmagrige there myself.

[Zoso]

What do you think of Bamber's reason for June's bike arriving at his cottage 2 days before the massacre - so Julie could cycle several miles to catch a bus when going home?

No idea - why ever it was there, I don't think he used the bike.

[Adam]

No idea - why ever it was there, I don't think he used the bike.

Please give your opinion. Third request.

What do you think of Bamber's reason for bringing the bike to his cottage 2 days before the massacre - so Julie could cycle several miles to get a bus when going home?

[Adam]

Have to go by RB and Jeremy as a valid source until I make the pilmagrige there myself.

So Bamber knew about The Sea Wall.

Wonder why he never testified or said in his police interviews or to his lawyers it couldn't be cycled.

The prosecution said he cycled The Sea Wall and the defence agreed it was possible.

Agree RB believes he cycled and said there was sufficient light.

[Adam]

Although we will never know the route he took, there should be a plausible one.

Once you are off the public rights of way, it is unlikely the tracks are cycle friendly, and public rights of way can be pretty rough anyway.

I cannot find the route you are referring to that avoids Wycke's farm? using public rights of way that is? Edges of fields are not public rights of way and generally would not be cyclable.

You were saying the farm tracks around fields are wide enough for tractors. Which going by Google Maps Satellite I agree with. So certainly fine to walk & cycle.

Not sure what 'public right of way' is supposed to mean. If the terrain was adequate then it was a cycle option.

Please do not pretend you don't know the farm track I am referring to.