The window Jeremy used for entry

[Bubo bubo]

I said IF the Aga burns are accepted there are two chains of thought,that is two alternate scenarios.A live Nevill and a dead Nevill lying against it.

Your are simply dismissing the Aga proposal altogether Zoso,so you do not have a chain of thought regarding it at all.
As Roch says,better to keep an open mind regarding NEW evidence just in case.
Personally,I dont think the CCRC can sweep the Aga proposal aside very easily,not without being ridiculed,the findings are too strong.
Every expert at the time were in agreement that the marks were probably made on the night of the murders but could not work out how,both the silencer and poker were considered possible but didn't really fit too well under experiment.

Now however,I believe Boyce has finally hit the nail on the head and any surviving experts who were concerned with the case will endorse his findings and give him a pat on the back.

The Aga evidence WILL affect the case and give all those with a sense of fair play doubt of Bambers guilt.

The alignment of the marks (burns)  are so matched they cannot be pure coincidence. They also conform in shape. It is up to each of us to make up our minds. Have to confess to bias because I suggested the aga as the potential source.

[snow66!]

The alignment of the marks (burns)  are so matched they cannot be pure coincidence. They also conform in shape. It is up to each of us to make up our minds. Have to confess to bias because I suggested the aga as the potential source.

The Bubo/Boyce evidence!

It will indeed turn a corner in the Bamber case.

[ILB]

Have to agree with Dave.

Cannot see a referral on burns alone.

[Bubo bubo]

Might they instead suggest that Nevill was temporarily unconscious, at some point during the incident?

That could be an interpretation If the time for burning is relatively short. But if longer than say 15 mins why would JB still be at the farm. Finishing off SC and June would not take long if we go by EP's scenario. SO WHY HANG AROUND.

[Adam]

I said IF the Aga burns are accepted there are two chains of thought,that is two alternate scenarios.A live Nevill and a dead Nevill lying against it.

Your are simply dismissing the Aga proposal altogether Zoso,so you do not have a chain of thought regarding it at all.
As Roch says,better to keep an open mind regarding NEW evidence just in case.
Personally,I dont think the CCRC can sweep the Aga proposal aside very easily,not without being ridiculed,the findings are too strong.
Every expert at the time were in agreement that the marks were probably made on the night of the murders but could not work out how,both the silencer and poker were considered possible but didn't really fit too well under experiment.

Now however,I believe Boyce has finally hit the nail on the head and any surviving experts who were concerned with the case will endorse his findings and give him a pat on the back.

The Aga evidence WILL affect the case and give all those with a sense of fair play doubt of Bambers guilt.

How do you think Nevill got his 40+ non gunshot injuries. From head to toe?

The prosecution say this was during a violent kitchen attack by Bamber with the rifle.

Supporters say there was no kitchen attack and Nevill collapsed upon kitchen entrance.

Sheila and June then spent hours moving Nevill into different positions so Sheila could inflict those injuries.

[Adam]

Nevill falling onto an apparent scolding hot outside part of the aga & staying there did not happen.

Ditto the police putting Nevill's pyjama top on and lifting him onto a chair/coal scuttle, prior to crime scene photos being taken.

[Roch]

That could be an interpretation If the time for burning is relatively short. But if longer than say 15 mins why would JB still be at the farm. Finishing off SC and June would not take long if we go by EP's scenario. SO WHY HANG AROUND.

Yes, a temporary period of unconsciousness for Nevill supports a Sheila scenario more than a Jeremy scenario.  It may have coincided with June and/or the twins being attacked.

[Adam]

Everyone agrees Nevill received his other injuries after being shot.

ILB says Sheila's first of 3 attacks on Nevill was when he was fully fit. This was in the main bedroom.

Nevill or June did not reclaim the rifle although both fully fit.

June stayed in bed. Nevill left Sheila upstairs with the rifle to go downstairs and start ringing Jeremy's AM.

[Zoso]

Yes, a temporary period of unconsciousness for Nevill supports a Sheila scenario more than a Jeremy scenario.  It may have coincided with June and/or the twins being attacked.

So what led to the unconsciousness, being shot 4 times? Having his head smashed in - enough to crack his skull? When did that happen? Before or after he called Jeremy? If before, how did he manage to dial the number and talk to Jeremy? At that point wouldn't a 999 call be his best bet? If he had managed to dial 999 (as some believe) why ring Jeremy at all? If it happened after, that means his murder happened while Jeremy et al were outside and no one heard anything - including Jeremy.

Yes, it might fit a Sheila scenario, which is why it just doesn't work. All very desperate.

[Roch]

So what led to the unconsciousness, being shot 4 times? Having his head smashed in - enough to crack his skull? When did that happen? Before or after he called Jeremy? If before, how did he manage to dial the number and talk to Jeremy? At that point wouldn't a 999 call be his best bet? If he had managed to dial 999 (as some believe) why ring Jeremy at all? If it happened after, that means his murder happened while Jeremy et al were outside and no one heard anything - including Jeremy.

Yes, it might fit a Sheila scenario, which is why it just doesn't work. All very desperate.

An incident with Sheila. He could have made the call to Jeremy after regaining consciousness. Then he ascends the stairs and is shot for the first time.  Nobody knows exactly when the incident started or whether there was more than one incident that night.

[Zoso]

An incident with Sheila. He could have made the call to Jeremy after regaining consciousness. Then he ascends the stairs and is shot for the first time.  Nobody knows exactly when the incident started or whether there was more than one incident that night.

So after being knocked unconscious, he wasn't disorientated at all? I guess you have never been unconscious before. How did she manage to render him unconscious in the first place? If it was due to the battering he received that cracked his skull, he'd be in no shape to ascend anything. However, the main problem is that you can take Sheila out of that scenario and put Jeremy in it because as you say, no one knows when it all started. Even if you place some credence on the burns being caused by the Aga - it would tell up you nothing more than that.

[Roch]

So after being knocked unconscious, he wasn't disorientated at all? I guess you have never been unconscious before. How did she manage to render him unconscious in the first place? If it was due to the battering he received that cracked his skull, he'd be in no shape to ascend anything. However, the main problem is that you can take Sheila out of that scenario and put Jeremy in it because as you say, no one knows when it all started. Even if you place some credence on the burns being caused by the Aga - it would tell up you nothing more than that.

Well it would. As the timing of it occuring would need to be slotted in to the incident.  He could have been rendered unconscious as the result of slipping or tripping in an exhaustive struggle, in a confined and cluttered space. He was essentially combating a maniac, who also happens to be his own daughter.

[snow66!]

How do you think Nevill got his 40+ non gunshot injuries. From head to toe?

The prosecution say this was during a violent kitchen attack by Bamber with the rifle.

Supporters say there was no kitchen attack and Nevill collapsed upon kitchen entrance.

Sheila and June then spent hours moving Nevill into different positions so Sheila could inflict those injuries.

Nevills 40+ injuries were mainly from the waist up, being prodded and whacked with the rifle while seated after collapsing as you rightly say Adam.

[Adam]

Nevills 40+ injuries were mainly from the waist up, being prodded and whacked with the rifle while seated after collapsing as you rightly say Adam.

You think June and Sheila lifted Nevill into multiple positions.

Whacked. Not prodded.

[Adam]

Lower injuries -

Bruising on right and left knee.

Bruising to toes and feet.

-----------

This may have been due to bumping into things bare footed in the kitchen.

Bamber may have kicked him in the knees to try to stop Nevill from wrestling for the rifle.