'U were Sheila's accomplice' - (his response) - 'You fucking Clever Bastard'...

[mike tesko]

Or possibly the burn marks on Nevills back Roch,which the campaign team say have been solved,or at least they claim to know what made them.

please bear in mind, that if 'NEVILLE Bambers' body had always been in the position that his body was subsequently found in (with his head in the coal skuttle) the position it was found [by a reliance upon crime scene photographs) could not, and does not support the claim that the raid team who officially entered the kitchen from the back passage way (let's say at around 7.30am) we're prevented from passing through the internal door which afforded access or exit, between the back hallway and the kitchen, primarily due to something 'very heavy' on the kitchen side of the door, obstructing access by firearm officers set upon entering the premises..

[mike tesko]

The 'STAGED KITCHEN CRIME SCENE' (photographs) do not show or indicate that the six man raid team could have been delayed in entering the kitchen. What this tells everyone, in consideration of all the now known facts, is that the jury at 'Jeremy Bambers' October 1986' Chelmsford Crown Court trial, convicted him by a reliance upon ' Manufactured', 'Imaginary', and 'deliberately falsified evidence'!

How many of us, fall into the trap that those who think and act like they are gods and goddesses, and we must, should take heed on their version of the actual facts in any particular, or given 'script', or 'event'...

[Roch]

Or possibly the burn marks on Nevills back Roch,which the campaign team say have been solved,or at least they claim to know what made them.

It's not an aspect I've taken much interest in. The idea of heating, prodding and maiming doesn't seem to fit with a guilty JB. Why would he waste time on adding an unnecessary layer of complexity? Surely he would be time-bound to some extent. There is probably an argument from some quarters that it was done to suggest Sheila was 'crazy'. But surely Jeremy would have known that Sheila and Nevill had had a relatively good relationship. Would it not be June who Sheila might mutilate?  Personally I do not think it's key to solving the case.

[mike tesko]

The 'STAGED KITCHEN CRIME SCENE' (photographs) do not show or indicate that the six man raid team could have been delayed in entering the kitchen. What this tells everyone, in consideration of all the now known facts, is that the jury at 'Jeremy Bambers' October 1986' Chelmsford Crown Court trial, convicted him by a reliance upon ' Manufactured', 'Imaginary', and 'deliberately falsified evidence'!

How many of us, fall into the trap that those who think and act like they are gods and goddesses, and we must, should take heed on their version of the actual facts in any particular, or given 'script', or 'event'...

The general  public at large are being brainwashed into accepting or believing that the version of the powers that be in any given circumstance, or event, is the absolute, actual real truth! It's a deception...

[snow66!]

The 'STAGED KITCHEN CRIME SCENE' (photographs) do not show or indicate that the six man raid team could have been delayed in entering the kitchen. What this tells everyone, in consideration of all the now known facts, is that the jury at 'Jeremy Bambers' October 1986' Chelmsford Crown Court trial, convicted him by a reliance upon ' Manufactured', 'Imaginary', and 'deliberately falsified evidence'!

How many of us, fall into the trap that those who think and act like they are gods and goddesses, and we must, should take heed on their version of the actual facts in any particular, or given 'script', or 'event'...

But why did they stage anything that morning Mike,was it to cover up the fact that Sheila shot herself after they entered.

[Roch]

But why did they stage anything that morning Mike,was it to cover up the fact that Sheila shot herself after they entered.

I am preparing a reply to one of your earlier posts. It will contain info regarding the theories of what happened.

[Jane]

But why did they stage anything that morning Mike,was it to cover up the fact that Sheila shot herself after they entered.

Why would they have needed to, Snow? They'd have been quite within their rights to shoot anyone who was armed. It would have been within their line of duty.

[snow66!]

Why would they have needed to, Snow? They'd have been quite within their rights to shoot anyone who was armed. It would have been within their line of duty.

Hi Jane,Yes of course they would,but i think what is roughly being said is,some believe Sheila shot herself after the raid team entered.The police then made a decision to cover this up and say she died much earlier,to save any embarrassment over the fact they were unable to save her.Because of this white lie shall we say,things eventually spiralled out of control once the relatives got involved,making things awkward.Something like that i believe Jane.

[Jane]

Hi Jane,Yes of course they would,but i think what is roughly being said is,some believe Sheila shot herself after the raid team entered.The police then made a decision to cover this up and say she died much earlier,to save any embarrassment over the fact they were unable to save her.Because of this white lie shall we say,things eventually spiralled out of control once the relatives got involved,making things awkward.Something like that i believe Jane.

I imagine such an idea would have been seriously debunked during debriefing, especially as the belief was that she'd been responsible for the deaths of her children and parents.

[snow66!]

It's not an aspect I've taken much interest in. The idea of heating, prodding and maiming doesn't seem to fit with a guilty JB. Why would he waste time on adding an unnecessary layer of complexity? Surely he would be time-bound to some extent. There is probably an argument from some quarters that it was done to suggest Sheila was 'crazy'. But surely Jeremy would have known that Sheila and Nevill had had a relatively good relationship. Would it not be June who Sheila might mutilate?  Personally I do not think it's key to solving the case.

Hi Roch,how are you today.Well the thing is,if the burn marks were made that night,there had to be a reason.Adam still thinks it was to see if Nevill was still alive,even after the head shots,i do not.Anyway,you say Sheila would not have tortured Nevill,but as i have said i do not see the marks as torture ormutilation.More a religious ceremony.And remember,Nevill happened to end up in the kitchen beside the Aga and not June.I also believe that by this time Sheila was seeing everyone around her as evil,not just June.I think you would need to see Sheilas medical rscords and speak to a psychologist or religious expert on good and evil.You have to get into Sheilas head that night,something only a psychologist is qualified to do.I would like to see the next podcast or tv doc dedicated to this subject.Lets  just take a look at the marks again,was Sheila telling us why she carried out the shooting? Instead of the marks being symbols of good,maybe she was telling us her family were evil and that is why they had to die.The first mark looks like an eye,could this indicate the all seeing eye,the eye of Lucifer.The second mark seems to have a V shape within the circle,this may indicate a sign of the Devil.The last mark seems to have a six or a nine shape within it,again connected to evil.Three marks.And  Sheila wrote the number three many times in her jotter,all with a curled end,an ancient or occult way of writing the number.If Sheila was obsessed with good and evil,there is no doubt she would know many signs and symbols of such.Anyway the campaign team say they know what made the marks.Why they were made,they havent yet explained .Anyway we will know in due course what the campaign team have to say about them, and what importance they think they hold.

[mike tesko]

But why did they stage anything that morning Mike,was it to cover up the fact that Sheila shot herself after they entered.

'Sheila' did not shoot herself, once downstairs in the kitchen, or on the second occasion upstairs on the floor of the main bedroom after her body was transferred from on top of the bed, onto the bedroom floor..

[Bubo bubo]

Hi Roch,how are you today.Well the thing is,if the burn marks were made that night,there had to be a reason.Adam still thinks it was to see if Nevill was still alive,even after the head shots,i do not.Anyway,you say Sheila would not have tortured Nevill,but as i have said i do not see the marks as torture ormutilation.More a religious ceremony.And remember,Nevill happened to end up in the kitchen beside the Aga and not June.I also believe that by this time Sheila was seeing everyone around her as evil,not just June.I think you would need to see Sheilas medical rscords and speak to a psychologist or religious expert on good and evil.You have to get into Sheilas head that night,something only a psychologist is qualified to do.I would like to see the next podcast or tv doc dedicated to this subject.Lets  just take a look at the marks again,was Sheila telling us why she carried out the shooting? Instead of the marks being symbols of good,maybe she was telling us her family were evil and that is why they had to die.The first mark looks like an eye,could this indicate the all seeing eye,the eye of Lucifer.The second mark seems to have a V shape within the circle,this may indicate a sign of the Devil.The last mark seems to have a six or a nine shape within it,again connected to evil.Three marks.And  Sheila wrote the number three many times in her jotter,all with a curled end,an ancient or occult way of writing the number.If Sheila was obsessed with good and evil,there is no doubt she would know many signs and symbols of such.Anyway the campaign team say they know what made the marks.Why they were made,they havent yet explained .Anyway we will know in due course what the campaign team have to say about them, and what importance they think they hold.

I think that one  was made while Nevill was dying next to the AGA. The police moved and restaged his body and had to add additional marks to confuse the situation. They needed to move his body to gain access to the firebox on the AGA to burn 'stuff' later labelled Fire Debris. See my Kitchen Capers thread.

[lookout]

Because Nevill's body was behind the door, sitting crouched on a chair, his body would have been displaced when breaking into the farmhouse. He wasn't found with his head in the scuttle either as it would have been placed in there by officers when his body was displaced.

[lookout]

Because Nevill's body was behind the door, sitting crouched on a chair, his body would have been displaced when breaking into the farmhouse. He wasn't found with his head in the scuttle either as it would have been placed in there by officers when his body was displaced.

[snow66!]

I think that one  was made while Nevill was dying next to the AGA. The police moved and restaged his body and had to add additional marks to confuse the situation. They needed to move his body to gain access to the firebox on the AGA to burn 'stuff' later labelled Fire Debris. See my Kitchen Capers thread.

OK, i will need a while to read your threads Bubo,and properly understand your scenario.