Author Topic: Important Question For NGB  (Read 7014 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Aunt Agatha

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 562
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #75 on: October 16, 2021, 08:18:PM »
I am sorry I do not understand your first sentence?

Which secret society?  And who gave orders from above?


Many of them were/are masons.

Offline killingeve

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 299
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #76 on: October 16, 2021, 08:38:PM »
All I want is a brief summary of the theory involving a second silencer.

I am assuming it revolves around it originating from Anthony Pargeter or one of the other relatives?

Offline killingeve

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 299
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #77 on: October 16, 2021, 08:41:PM »

Many of them were/are masons.

And you think they hatched a plan at a lodge one evening?

Offline Aunt Agatha

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 562
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #78 on: October 16, 2021, 09:02:PM »
And you think they hatched a plan at a lodge one evening?


Well it never went exactly to plan.
Jeremy was supposed to die that night also.
He called the police and everything had to change thereafter.

Offline killingeve

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 299
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #79 on: October 16, 2021, 09:50:PM »

Well it never went exactly to plan.
Jeremy was supposed to die that night also.
He called the police and everything had to change thereafter.

Who would want to kill Bamber, along with the rest of the family, and why?

Offline Rob_

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4829
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #80 on: October 16, 2021, 09:52:PM »
Not sure why Rob disputes evidence which is 36 years old.

Even the CT only dispute one piece - the silencer. That is only because the relatives handed it in.

I am not disputing any evidence I look at it all with a open unbiased view, it's you ignoring evidence that does not fit your narrative that I object to.

Offline Aunt Agatha

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 562
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #81 on: October 16, 2021, 10:14:PM »
Who would want to kill Bamber, along with the rest of the family, and why?


It’s not that black and white.

I don’t think we will ever know, for sure.

I am of the belief neither Jeremy or Sheila committed this crime.

There is no evidence that Jeremy was there and the evidence doesn’t really point at Sheila either.

The evidence does prove that Jeremy didn’t do it.


Offline Bubo bubo

  • Veteran Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3357
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #82 on: October 16, 2021, 10:31:PM »

It’s not that black and white.

I don’t think we will ever know, for sure.

I am of the belief neither Jeremy or Sheila committed this crime.

There is no evidence that Jeremy was there and the evidence doesn’t really point at Sheila either.

The evidence does prove that Jeremy didn’t do it.
I too have wondered whether if there was third party involvement and that there was an attempt to lure JB to the farm so that he to could be killed. However, the planners could not guarantee how he would respond/react. This would then explain the obvious staging of the crime scene which would then make it open to be him who staged it and this would be laid at his door.

I am much more in favour of a serious mistake by the TFG when they entered the property or because they failed to enter when some of the victims were still alive. I tend towards the former.

The actual events of the day especially the delaying of SOCO's access to the crime scene suggest it was EP who staged the crime scene. You might wish to examine the fact that EP destroyed the clothing used in the coverup and which features in my posts which describes a very different narrative from that which was presented and used at trial to convict JB

Offline Aunt Agatha

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 562
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #83 on: October 16, 2021, 10:40:PM »
I too have wondered whether if there was third party involvement and that there was an attempt to lure JB to the farm so that he to could be killed. However, the planners could not guarantee how he would respond/react. This would then explain the obvious staging of the crime scene which would then make it open to be him who staged it and this would be laid at his door.

I am much more in favour of a serious mistake by the TFG when they entered the property or because they failed to enter when some of the victims were still alive. I tend towards the former.

The actual events of the day especially the delaying of SOCO's access to the crime scene suggest it was EP who staged the crime scene. You might wish to examine the fact that EP destroyed the clothing used in the coverup and which features in my posts which describes a very different narrative from that which was presented and used at trial to convict JB


Somebody thinking outside the box.

I agree with almost everything you’ve just stated.

Everything fits when one also knows the background and problems within the family.

Offline Adam

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 44410
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #84 on: October 16, 2021, 11:03:PM »
I am not disputing any evidence I look at it all with a open unbiased view, it's you ignoring evidence that does not fit your narrative that I object to.

What evidence am I ignoring?
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Adam

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 44410
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #85 on: October 16, 2021, 11:06:PM »

It’s not that black and white.

I don’t think we will ever know, for sure.

I am of the belief neither Jeremy or Sheila committed this crime.

There is no evidence that Jeremy was there and the evidence doesn’t really point at Sheila either.

The evidence does prove that Jeremy didn’t do it.

'the evidence doesn’t really point at Sheila either.'

----------

Agree with that.

Why would Nevill phone Bamber and say 'Sheila has gone crazy' if it was a third party? And how would Nevill have the time?
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Aunt Agatha

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 562
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #86 on: October 17, 2021, 02:14:AM »
'the evidence doesn’t really point at Sheila either.'

----------

Agree with that.

Why would Nevill phone Bamber and say 'Sheila has gone crazy' if it was a third party? And how would Nevill have the time?


I believe, based on my conversations with Jeremy, and later evidence, though he may disagree, is that this was a professional hit.
All the evidence proves it was neither Jeremy or Sheila and the judge directly mislead the jury by stating it has to be one or the other. If not Sheila, then it was Jeremy.  (Mason)

If a gun was held at Nevilles head, or at one of the women and he was told to make that call to Jeremy to lure him in, then that is the call he had to make.
Neville also called the police.  He got a sever beating for calling for help.

Jeremy however turned up with the police. That I think was unexpected.
A figure at the window and lights going of and on prove sheila was alive in the house. She even called the cops herself!! Why would she do that if she was the killer with cops outside?

Jeremy was supposed to die and all the estate goes to RB (mason).
RB was an unsavoury figure and he was about to lose everything.
The family caught wind of his ‘dark side’ and the thought of of a life behind bars, along with other seedy characters, resulted in no choice but to have the family killed.

RB I don’t think organised it. He mentioned it to one or some of his gang members (masons) and a plan was hatched with or without RB’s knowledge.

That plan failed as Jeremy brought in the cops too soon.

Order came directly from above (masons) to destroy all the evidence in the house to eliminate any possibility of there being any evidence left of an intruder.

The lead team (masons) on site were told what to do as the cover up began.

Disturbingly, sheila was still alive.  She knew what went on that night and she had to be eliminated too before anybody could question her. This is where the police training on site came in.

A figure was seen crossing a field in the early hours in the direction away from the house.

With the plan not going as smoothly as it was, with JB outside with the cops,!things needed to be done quickly to point the killings at Jeremy.  The silencer had to be planted with blood (RB’s blood) and a request for a dna from RB was also refused by the judge (mason).

This work I believe was carried out by RB himself. The planting of a silencer with blood inside it and a silencer with chipped paintwork on it, taken from around the aga.  RB had to do this for the safety of the gang (masons) and his own family.

I have no idea whether he told his immediate family of his actions, perverting the course of duty.

The family were sniffing and stealing within days giving RB the opportunity to plant the silencer.

Job done!

And with a Masonic defender and prosecutor it came to pass that the Masonic judge deliberately mislead the jury when summing up.

Follow
Th money!!  I do not believe or ever have that either of these two innocent souls committed any murders.


Offline killingeve

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 299
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #87 on: October 17, 2021, 08:25:AM »
Personally I think claims of  a hitman, mason involvement and long lists of individuals who conspired against Bamber are too far fetched.  Excluding the latter it was agreed at trial the murderer was either Bamber or Sheila Caffell.  Bamber's claim of a phone call from Mr Bamber saying 'Sheila has gone crazy with a gun' really put paid to any other scenario.

[`Opinion of MT']

There was 'an operaration' underway, in the area of whf, on the evening of 6th August 1985. 'Aerial photographs' were filmed of 'the farmhouse' and 'surrounding fields' , and 'a pond' [a drug (aerial) dump site] . How coincidental that 'Special Branch' and other security services were conducting 'an intelligence led operation' , involving one of 'Jeremy Bambers contacts' who was living and operating from' Amsterdam', Holland' [a suspected international drug lord]? Also, what is widely not known, is that 'Jeremy Bamber' and 'his family' were the subject of a surveilance, which had been issued to coincide with the visit of 'Sheila Caffell' and 'her children' to her 'foster parents farmhouse' at 'whf'. Moreover, there exist official surveilance records confirming the 'Special Branch' officers had 'Jeremy Bamber' under an intense surveilance operaration, from as early as the 4th August 1985 [which was due to expire some 28 days later. In point of fact, 'Jeremy Bamber' was monitored and tracked back to his cottage, at 9 Head Street, Goldhanger, Essex, on the evening prior to when the shooting incidents unfolded during the early hours of 7th August 1985. He was followed and tracked leaving whf and returning to his cottage at about 10.00pm on the evening before the shootings took place. 'Special Branch officers' know that 'Jeremy Bamber' did not return to tge family farmhouse that same evening, and that he left his cottage to go to tge farmhouse, as he was instructed to do so, by 'PC West'..
« Last Edit: October 17, 2021, 09:42:AM by mike tesko »

Offline Adam

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 44410
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #88 on: October 17, 2021, 09:00:AM »
Personally I think claims of  a hitman, mason involvement and long lists of individuals who conspired against Bamber are too far fetched.  Excluding the latter it was agreed at trial the murderer was either Bamber or Sheila Caffell.  Bamber's claim of a phone call from Mr Bamber saying 'Sheila has gone crazy with a gun' really put paid to any other scenario.

Bamber did say in his police interviews Nevill may have said 'she' (not Sheila) on the phone.

This was after the police said Sheila could not have shot herself twice.

He did not say who 'she' could be.

He also suggested the second shot could be due to reflex's or by Crispy.

Sheila would have been breathing but unconcious after the very damaging first shot. So not able to fire a second shot.

« Last Edit: October 17, 2021, 09:01:AM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Adam

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 44410
Re: Important Question For NGB
« Reply #89 on: October 17, 2021, 09:05:AM »

I believe, based on my conversations with Jeremy, and later evidence, though he may disagree, is that this was a professional hit.
All the evidence proves it was neither Jeremy or Sheila and the judge directly mislead the jury by stating it has to be one or the other. If not Sheila, then it was Jeremy.  (Mason)

If a gun was held at Nevilles head, or at one of the women and he was told to make that call to Jeremy to lure him in, then that is the call he had to make.
Neville also called the police.  He got a sever beating for calling for help.

Jeremy however turned up with the police. That I think was unexpected.
A figure at the window and lights going of and on prove sheila was alive in the house. She even called the cops herself!! Why would she do that if she was the killer with cops outside?

Jeremy was supposed to die and all the estate goes to RB (mason).
RB was an unsavoury figure and he was about to lose everything.
The family caught wind of his ‘dark side’ and the thought of of a life behind bars, along with other seedy characters, resulted in no choice but to have the family killed.

RB I don’t think organised it. He mentioned it to one or some of his gang members (masons) and a plan was hatched with or without RB’s knowledge.

That plan failed as Jeremy brought in the cops too soon.

Order came directly from above (masons) to destroy all the evidence in the house to eliminate any possibility of there being any evidence left of an intruder.

The lead team (masons) on site were told what to do as the cover up began.

Disturbingly, sheila was still alive.  She knew what went on that night and she had to be eliminated too before anybody could question her. This is where the police training on site came in.

A figure was seen crossing a field in the early hours in the direction away from the house.

With the plan not going as smoothly as it was, with JB outside with the cops,!things needed to be done quickly to point the killings at Jeremy.  The silencer had to be planted with blood (RB’s blood) and a request for a dna from RB was also refused by the judge (mason).

This work I believe was carried out by RB himself. The planting of a silencer with blood inside it and a silencer with chipped paintwork on it, taken from around the aga.  RB had to do this for the safety of the gang (masons) and his own family.

I have no idea whether he told his immediate family of his actions, perverting the course of duty.

The family were sniffing and stealing within days giving RB the opportunity to plant the silencer.

Job done!

And with a Masonic defender and prosecutor it came to pass that the Masonic judge deliberately mislead the jury when summing up.

Follow
Th money!!  I do not believe or ever have that either of these two innocent souls committed any murders.

'All the evidence proves it was neither Jeremy or Sheila'

----------

Agree there is no evidence Sheila fired a weapon or fought Nevill. Which shows it was Bamber.

What incriminating evidence would Bamber leave at the crime scene?
'Only I know what really happened that night'.