Author Topic: 'Fresh Evidence' - Unearthed in 'Mike Tesko's' review of case file, documents!!!  (Read 1313 times)

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Offline mike tesko

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In rather astonishing circumstances, a document has been found, confirming that 'Essex police', and the 'CPS', were made fully aware (October, 1985), that blood found inside the silencer 'could have belonged' to 'Robert Woodwis Boutlour'!
« Last Edit: June 04, 2021, 12:37:AM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline Roch

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In rather astonishing circumstances, a document has been found, confirming that 'Essex police', and the 'CPS', were made fully aware (October, 1985), that blood found inside the silencer 'could have belonged' to 'Robert Woodwis Boutlour'!

What are the astonishing circumstances?

Offline mike tesko

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Hi Roch..

The rather astonishing circumstances are that in October 1985, that Essex police, and the crown prosecution service, knew full well that the blood based evidence attributed to one silencer (sound moderator) or another could have belonged' to, or originated from 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour'. However, by the time the case came to trial, their case was supported by John Hayward and another expert named Elliot, who deliberately sought to mislead the court, by claiming that they were as sure as they could be that the blood in the sound moderator belonged exclusively to the victim 'Sheila Caffell' with a little mention, that there was a very remote chance, that the blood in question, could have been/was an intimate mixture of Neville and June Bamber(s) blood(excluding any reference to the scientific evidence, that the same blood group results could belong to 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour' (October 1985, findings)!

The jury were given the untrue explanation that either, the blood found in the silencer(s): was 'exclusive to Sheila' with a slight possibility that the blood could be an intimate mixture of the parents blood types! This works out at a 50% chance that the blood group results obtained by means of forensic testing, and analysis, of the blood originating, or belonging to one party (Sheila Caffell) or the other (a mixture of the parents blood)!

The blood experts 'deliberately kept silent', that back in October 1985 (a year before the start of 'Jeremy Bambers' trial, that one or other expert was/had r'eported back to Essex police', that the blood they had found/analysed could have come from 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour' who had the very same blood group types as 'Sheila Caffell'..

The Crown prosecution do not take/make any decision to either prosecute anyone/ anybody unless there is at least a 51% chance of succeeding in getting a conviction! It was a close call, when the CPS decided to mislead the court into accepting that insofar as the blood found inside the sound moderator was/is concerned that 'it equated' to a 50%/ 50% of the blood belonging to, either 'Sheila', or that it might have been an intimate mixture of the parents blood types!

The fact that the experts knew that the blood in that/this sound moderator that 'it could have belonged'/originated' from  'Robert Woodwis Boutflour' was not revealed in court, or to 'Bambers defence', which would have made it less likely that the blood originated exclusively to 'Sheila Caffell', since with 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour'(s) possible contributory factor being taken into account, there was only a 33% chance that the blood could have been, or was exclusive to 'Sheila Caffell' - that is/was a reduction of 17% prospect/chance in the possibility that the blood attributed 'exclusively' to 'Sheila,' being exclusive to her, by anybodies decision!

The defence. The jury. The trial judge. The general public at large - they all needed to be told the absolute bottom line truth, regarding this/that matter!

In my view, 'Jeremy Bambers' convictions will/should be cancelled out/quashed!
« Last Edit: June 04, 2021, 06:32:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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The fact of the matter, is that this wasn't/isn't just a case of the blood identified in the sound moderator being exclusive to ,'Sheila Caffell', or it being an intimate mixture of both parents blood,(s), there is a strong likelihood that 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour's blood was the blood found and identified inside that (those) sound moderators!
« Last Edit: June 04, 2021, 08:57:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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That 'bastardo', DCS 'Mick Ainsley' was/is a typical example of all the corrupted, lying, evil, scumbags, running and exercising Police work, in order to get a result that they set out, to prove (a corrupted, organisation)¡

You cannot trust, or believe anything a cop who operated between the mid to the late 1980's to the mid 1990's, because those who were in charge (including the home office, the secretary of state 'had to say', or 'were promoting')!
« Last Edit: June 04, 2021, 09:42:PM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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That 'bastardo', DCS 'Mick Ainsley' was/is a typical example of all the corrupted, lying, evil, scumbags, running and exercising Police work, in order to get a result that they set out, to prove (a corrupted, organisation)¡

You cannot trust, or believe anything a cop who operated between the mid to the late 1980's to the mid 1990's, because those who were in charge (including the home office, the secretary of state 'had to say', or 'were promoting')!

I have great.faith in the up to date modern police force - wrongs, will be righted!
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Convictions, and sentences, will almost certainly be overturned and put right!
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

Offline mike tesko

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Here is a snapshot of the all so important document, which refers to 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour(s)' blood sample ('exhibit/clot') being the same as 'Sheila Caffell'(s)..
« Last Edit: June 05, 2021, 02:53:AM by mike tesko »
"Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive"...

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In rather astonishing circumstances, a document has been found, confirming that 'Essex police', and the 'CPS', were made fully aware (October, 1985), that blood found inside the silencer 'could have belonged' to 'Robert Woodwis Boutlour'!

The defence don't strictly need a document that explicitly states that the blood could have belonged to Robert Boutflour.  That was already known at trial, as the family all gave blood samples prior to the trial for this very reason, it was known that Robert and Sheila had the same blood group, and the blood was never matched to Sheila - it was only a grouping.  Furthermore, the DNA captured later (1990s) was not blood-based. 

Given the circumstances in which the silencer was found and passed on, you would think all this is enough for reasonable doubt, but it appears 10 of the trial jury accepted a group match on the basis that:

(i). Robert Boutflour was the only other person with that group match; and,

(ii). while it could have been Robert's blood, they could not believe Robert (or any other relative) would frame Jeremy, which I suppose is the only obvious alternative if you don't accept that Jeremy did it.

I think a family framing is possible because the silencer evidence in regard to the blood and paint seems  consistent with it.

Briefly:

1. The blood distribution in the silencer and the absence of blood in the rifle may be consistent with what you would expect if the blood was planted.  (Expert opinion needed on this regarding blood spatter physics/forensics, with particular reference to tension dynamics).

2. No blood was found on the floor of the den, or in the back kitchen, or in the back corridor, or in the gun cupboard itself.

3. The silencer that was examined by the FSS for paint traces could not have made the scratches on the underside of the aga mantel while attached to the rifle and pivoted during a struggle.  The scratches are more consistent with what you would find if somebody deliberately made the scratches while holding the silencer only.

I believe point 1 could, with expert evidence, prove a framing.  You would need an expert report and maybe also somebody to dismantle the silencer and rifle, if they are still kept by Essex Police.  Point 2 is indicative but not actual proof because the silencer could have been returned by Jeremy without leaving blood anywhere.  It's not very likely, but it is possible due to the latitude in the timeframe that allows for blood to dry at room temperature over maybe an hour or so. 

Point 3 is not definitive of a framing because the scratches could have been made by Sheila before the incident or even by Jeremy himself during the incident, but it does help Jeremy.

But would they really frame him?  I think technically it is possible, but would they do it?

If Jeremy is innocent, I think it's more likely that the blood grouping was either simply wrong and/or the tests were compromised or contaminated and/or the jury were misdirected.

I need to adhere to my own resolution and stop commenting on the Forum.

Offline Roch

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Hi Roch..

The rather astonishing circumstances are that in October 1985, that Essex police, and the crown prosecution service, knew full well that the blood based evidence attributed to one silencer (sound moderator) or another could have belonged' to, or originated from 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour'. However, by the time the case came to trial, their case was supported by John Hayward and another expert named Elliot, who deliberately sought to mislead the court, by claiming that they were as sure as they could be that the blood in the sound moderator belonged exclusively to the victim 'Sheila Caffell' with a little mention, that there was a very remote chance, that the blood in question, could have been/was an intimate mixture of Neville and June Bamber(s) blood(excluding any reference to the scientific evidence, that the same blood group results could belong to 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour' (October 1985, findings)!

The jury were given the untrue explanation that either, the blood found in the silencer(s): was 'exclusive to Sheila' with a slight possibility that the blood could be an intimate mixture of the parents blood types! This works out at a 50% chance that the blood group results obtained by means of forensic testing, and analysis, of the blood originating, or belonging to one party (Sheila Caffell) or the other (a mixture of the parents blood)!

The blood experts 'deliberately kept silent', that back in October 1985 (a year before the start of 'Jeremy Bambers' trial, that one or other expert was/had r'eported back to Essex police', that the blood they had found/analysed could have come from 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour' who had the very same blood group types as 'Sheila Caffell'..

The Crown prosecution do not take/make any decision to either prosecute anyone/ anybody unless there is at least a 51% chance of succeeding in getting a conviction! It was a close call, when the CPS decided to mislead the court into accepting that insofar as the blood found inside the sound moderator was/is concerned that 'it equated' to a 50%/ 50% of the blood belonging to, either 'Sheila', or that it might have been an intimate mixture of the parents blood types!

The fact that the experts knew that the blood in that/this sound moderator that 'it could have belonged'/originated' from  'Robert Woodwis Boutflour' was not revealed in court, or to 'Bambers defence', which would have made it less likely that the blood originated exclusively to 'Sheila Caffell', since with 'Robert Woodwis Boutflour'(s) possible contributory factor being taken into account, there was only a 33% chance that the blood could have been, or was exclusive to 'Sheila Caffell' - that is/was a reduction of 17% prospect/chance in the possibility that the blood attributed 'exclusively' to 'Sheila,' being exclusive to her, by anybodies decision!

The defence. The jury. The trial judge. The general public at large - they all needed to be told the absolute bottom line truth, regarding this/that matter!

In my view, 'Jeremy Bambers' convictions will/should be cancelled out/quashed!

Mike, thanks for your response. I understand the issue with groupings SC / RWB. I thought you meant that the circumstances of the actual document coming to light were astonishing. BTW, have you seen were it was posted up on here that in one of the blood group / sound moderator sketches, DB's blood group is indicated as being present?

Offline lookout

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I'd read that all the Boutflour's blood contained the AK 1 enzyme. It's one of those genes that passes through the family, yet neither twin had the enzyme coming from Sheila ? I find this odd !

Offline Adam

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The defence don't strictly need a document that explicitly states that the blood could have belonged to Robert Boutflour.  That was already known at trial, as the family all gave blood samples prior to the trial for this very reason, it was known that Robert and Sheila had the same blood group, and the blood was never matched to Sheila - it was only a grouping.  Furthermore, the DNA captured later (1990s) was not blood-based. 

Given the circumstances in which the silencer was found and passed on, you would think all this is enough for reasonable doubt, but it appears 10 of the trial jury accepted a group match on the basis that:

(i). Robert Boutflour was the only other person with that group match; and,

(ii). while it could have been Robert's blood, they could not believe Robert (or any other relative) would frame Jeremy, which I suppose is the only obvious alternative if you don't accept that Jeremy did it.

I think a family framing is possible because the silencer evidence in regard to the blood and paint seems  consistent with it.

Briefly:

1. The blood distribution in the silencer and the absence of blood in the rifle may be consistent with what you would expect if the blood was planted.  (Expert opinion needed on this regarding blood spatter physics/forensics, with particular reference to tension dynamics).

2. No blood was found on the floor of the den, or in the back kitchen, or in the back corridor, or in the gun cupboard itself.

3. The silencer that was examined by the FSS for paint traces could not have made the scratches on the underside of the aga mantel while attached to the rifle and pivoted during a struggle.  The scratches are more consistent with what you would find if somebody deliberately made the scratches while holding the silencer only.

I believe point 1 could, with expert evidence, prove a framing.  You would need an expert report and maybe also somebody to dismantle the silencer and rifle, if they are still kept by Essex Police.  Point 2 is indicative but not actual proof because the silencer could have been returned by Jeremy without leaving blood anywhere.  It's not very likely, but it is possible due to the latitude in the timeframe that allows for blood to dry at room temperature over maybe an hour or so. 

Point 3 is not definitive of a framing because the scratches could have been made by Sheila before the incident or even by Jeremy himself during the incident, but it does help Jeremy.

But would they really frame him?  I think technically it is possible, but would they do it?

If Jeremy is innocent, I think it's more likely that the blood grouping was either simply wrong and/or the tests were compromised or contaminated and/or the jury were misdirected.

I need to adhere to my own resolution and stop commenting on the Forum.

'1. The blood distribution in the silencer and the absence of blood in the rifle may be consistent with what you would expect if the blood was planted.  (Expert opinion needed on this regarding blood spatter physics/forensics, with particular reference to tension dynamics)'

---------

That is a good point. The relatives prior to framing would also need to know whether back spatter would have gone through the silencer & reached the rifle nozzle.
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Adam

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The defence don't strictly need a document that explicitly states that the blood could have belonged to Robert Boutflour.  That was already known at trial, as the family all gave blood samples prior to the trial for this very reason, it was known that Robert and Sheila had the same blood group, and the blood was never matched to Sheila - it was only a grouping.  Furthermore, the DNA captured later (1990s) was not blood-based. 

Given the circumstances in which the silencer was found and passed on, you would think all this is enough for reasonable doubt, but it appears 10 of the trial jury accepted a group match on the basis that:

(i). Robert Boutflour was the only other person with that group match; and,

(ii). while it could have been Robert's blood, they could not believe Robert (or any other relative) would frame Jeremy, which I suppose is the only obvious alternative if you don't accept that Jeremy did it.

I think a family framing is possible because the silencer evidence in regard to the blood and paint seems  consistent with it.

Briefly:

1. The blood distribution in the silencer and the absence of blood in the rifle may be consistent with what you would expect if the blood was planted.  (Expert opinion needed on this regarding blood spatter physics/forensics, with particular reference to tension dynamics).

2. No blood was found on the floor of the den, or in the back kitchen, or in the back corridor, or in the gun cupboard itself.

3. The silencer that was examined by the FSS for paint traces could not have made the scratches on the underside of the aga mantel while attached to the rifle and pivoted during a struggle.  The scratches are more consistent with what you would find if somebody deliberately made the scratches while holding the silencer only.

I believe point 1 could, with expert evidence, prove a framing.  You would need an expert report and maybe also somebody to dismantle the silencer and rifle, if they are still kept by Essex Police.  Point 2 is indicative but not actual proof because the silencer could have been returned by Jeremy without leaving blood anywhere.  It's not very likely, but it is possible due to the latitude in the timeframe that allows for blood to dry at room temperature over maybe an hour or so. 

Point 3 is not definitive of a framing because the scratches could have been made by Sheila before the incident or even by Jeremy himself during the incident, but it does help Jeremy.

But would they really frame him?  I think technically it is possible, but would they do it?

If Jeremy is innocent, I think it's more likely that the blood grouping was either simply wrong and/or the tests were compromised or contaminated and/or the jury were misdirected.

I need to adhere to my own resolution and stop commenting on the Forum.

2. No blood was found on the floor of the den, or in the back kitchen, or in the back corridor, or in the gun cupboard itself.

----------

The small drops of blood inside the silencer are not going to leave the silencer once inside.
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Adam

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The defence don't strictly need a document that explicitly states that the blood could have belonged to Robert Boutflour.  That was already known at trial, as the family all gave blood samples prior to the trial for this very reason, it was known that Robert and Sheila had the same blood group, and the blood was never matched to Sheila - it was only a grouping.  Furthermore, the DNA captured later (1990s) was not blood-based. 

Given the circumstances in which the silencer was found and passed on, you would think all this is enough for reasonable doubt, but it appears 10 of the trial jury accepted a group match on the basis that:

(i). Robert Boutflour was the only other person with that group match; and,

(ii). while it could have been Robert's blood, they could not believe Robert (or any other relative) would frame Jeremy, which I suppose is the only obvious alternative if you don't accept that Jeremy did it.

I think a family framing is possible because the silencer evidence in regard to the blood and paint seems  consistent with it.

Briefly:

1. The blood distribution in the silencer and the absence of blood in the rifle may be consistent with what you would expect if the blood was planted.  (Expert opinion needed on this regarding blood spatter physics/forensics, with particular reference to tension dynamics).

2. No blood was found on the floor of the den, or in the back kitchen, or in the back corridor, or in the gun cupboard itself.

3. The silencer that was examined by the FSS for paint traces could not have made the scratches on the underside of the aga mantel while attached to the rifle and pivoted during a struggle.  The scratches are more consistent with what you would find if somebody deliberately made the scratches while holding the silencer only.

I believe point 1 could, with expert evidence, prove a framing.  You would need an expert report and maybe also somebody to dismantle the silencer and rifle, if they are still kept by Essex Police.  Point 2 is indicative but not actual proof because the silencer could have been returned by Jeremy without leaving blood anywhere.  It's not very likely, but it is possible due to the latitude in the timeframe that allows for blood to dry at room temperature over maybe an hour or so. 

Point 3 is not definitive of a framing because the scratches could have been made by Sheila before the incident or even by Jeremy himself during the incident, but it does help Jeremy.

But would they really frame him?  I think technically it is possible, but would they do it?

If Jeremy is innocent, I think it's more likely that the blood grouping was either simply wrong and/or the tests were compromised or contaminated and/or the jury were misdirected.

I need to adhere to my own resolution and stop commenting on the Forum.

3. The silencer that was examined by the FSS for paint traces could not have made the scratches on the underside of the aga mantel while attached to the rifle and pivoted during a struggle.  The scratches are more consistent with what you would find if somebody deliberately made the scratches while holding the silencer only.

----------

How do you know this?
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

guest29835

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3. The silencer that was examined by the FSS for paint traces could not have made the scratches on the underside of the aga mantel while attached to the rifle and pivoted during a struggle.  The scratches are more consistent with what you would find if somebody deliberately made the scratches while holding the silencer only.

----------

How do you know this?

I was there, Adam, and I know what Peggy and Pat got up to. I know the truth. I don't know how you can stay loyal to EastEnders after all this!