Russia - worrying?

[Roch]

Different situation Rochski. The Ukranian's are not going to be carrying out suicide bombing via cars nor do the Russians have contractors.

Come on David, it is indefensible in either situation, Ukraine or Iraq. The contractors were clearly out of control. There are probably plenty more examples. Like the one Assange got in trouble for.

[David1819]

Come on David, it is indefensible in either situation, Ukraine or Iraq. The contractors were clearly out of control. There are probably plenty more examples. Like the one Assange got in trouble for.

Rochski the Iraqi people celebrated the American presence and gave them flowers. The Ukranian people are fleeing the Russians and giving them molotov cocktails.

https://streamable.com/855zvo

[Roch]

Rochski the Iraqi people celebrated the American presence and gave them flowers. The Ukranian people are fleeing the Russians and giving them molotov cocktails.

https://streamable.com/855zvo

This is just silly David. Some Iraqi people initially welcomed the US presence.  Obviously the 7,185 civilians killed in the first two months probably shouldn't be included that figure. 

Imagine if Mexico joined a defence and security cooperative alliance with Russia, China, Iran, North Korea etc, all of who started providing arms and weapons systems to Mexico.  They've already snapped up a number of central and south American states also.  But Mexico is the buffer zone. What would be the US reaction over there, if diplomatic requests that Mexico remains neutral fail?   

Remember, if you try to take the bull by the horns in frustration, everyone will be waving Mexican flags and the Mexicans will be making Molitov cocktails.

[David1819]

This is just silly David. Some Iraqi people initially welcomed the US presence.  Obviously the 7,185 civilians killed in the first two months probably shouldn't be included that figure. 

Imagine if Mexico joined a defence and security cooperative alliance with Russia, China, Iran, North Korea etc, all of who started providing arms and weapons systems to Mexico.  They've already snapped up a number of central and south American states also.  But Mexico is the buffer zone. What would be the US reaction over there, if diplomatic requests that Mexico remains neutral fail?   

Remember, if you try to take the bull by the horns in frustration, everyone will be waving Mexican flags and the Mexicans will be making Molitov cocktails.

You are not going to justify a war with hypothetical fictional scenarios Rockhski.

[killingeve]

Rochski the Iraqi people celebrated the American presence and gave them flowers. The Ukranian people are fleeing the Russians and giving them molotov cocktails.

https://streamable.com/855zvo

If this is true it begs the question why the US didn't just send in SEAL to take out SH as they did with OBL?  Why did the US spend so long in Iraq if they were just met with flowers akin to QE2 opening some new civil building?   

[Bubo bubo]

If this is true it begs the question why the US didn't just send in SEAL to take out SH as they did with OBL?  Why did the US spend so long in Iraq if they were just met with flowers akin to QE2 opening some new civil building?   

The problem with Iraq stems from the fact that there was no plan for the future ready to be executed. with regard to an initial recovery phase and then how the politics could be be managed thereafter.  They cleaned out the civil service Baathists' which led to chaos. The people turned against the West aided by a variety of insurgent terrorist groups. To this was added the internal religious divisions between the Sunni and Shia. The Shia majority had been previously down trodden by a minority. No wonder it all went 'Tits up'

[David1819]

If this is true it begs the question why the US didn't just send in SEAL to take out SH as they did with OBL? 

SH had 70,000 republican guard troops loyal to him and had access to bunkers in his palaces. OBL had a hide out on a dirt road with just his family. 

SH had his sons and other high ranking Baathists ready to replace him. 

One SEAL team is not going to be able to dismantle the Baathist party. 

Why did the US spend so long in Iraq if they were just met with flowers akin to QE2 opening some new civil building?[

Poor planning and dealing with a civil war between the Sunni and Shia population.

[killingeve]

SH had 70,000 republican guard troops loyal to him and had access to bunkers in his palaces. OBL had a hide out on a dirt road with with just his family. 

SH had his sons and other high ranking Baathists ready to replace him. 

One SEAL team is not going to be able to dismantle the Baathist party. 

Poor planning and dealing with a civil war between the Sunni and Shia population.

Exactly you had two warring factions: Sunnis and Shias akin to Ukraines some of whom align with the West and others who align with Russia.

Your world view of geopolitics is simple to say the least!

[killingeve]

If Ukraine/West want to live in peace and prosperity more should have been done to find a peaceful solution to Putin's security concerns whether they be real or rooted in paranoia. 

[killingeve]

How much time/effort did UK/EU spend trying to resolve Putin's security concerns compared with UK's withdrawal from EU?

[David1819]

Your world view of geopolitics is simple to say the least!

Stop projecting and have another special brew.

[Roch]

He thinks that the 7,185 civilians who died in the first two months is negligible - but is up in arms about events in Ukraine.

[David1819]

He thinks that the 7,185 civilians who died in the first two months is negligible - but is up in arms about events in Ukraine.

Most of the world is up in arms about what is happening in Ukraine. A dictator is trying to impose his will by  force on a democratic and peaceful country.

[Roch]

Most of the world is up in arms about what is happening in Ukraine. A dictator is trying to impose his will by  force on a democratic and peaceful country.

That's your assessment of the situation.

I suppose regarding Iraq, the world's powerful nation just decided it would find an excuse to plunder resources.

[David1819]

That's your assessment of the situation.

I suppose regarding Iraq, the world's powerful nation just decided it would find an excuse to plunder resources.

Ah right, the US spent a trillion dollars on war instead of just buying cheap Iraqi oil. They then left the country and Iraq's current oil market is 100% state owned by the Iraqi government.

Rochski no offence but you really haven't got a clue.