Author Topic: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll  (Read 58664 times)

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Offline Adam

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #540 on: October 04, 2014, 09:30:PM »
The West Memphis Three, Arkansas, USA.
Three eight year old boys were brutally killed in 1993. Their naked, bound bodies were found in a drainage ditch.
Three West Memphis teenagers were arrested and convicted on dubious "evidence". Among other things, the testimony of a mail order "expert" on Satanic, ritual killings.
Very interesting case.

I don't know that case.

There are no doubt more people that incorrectly get 'not guilty' and are free. Good lawyers and lack of evidence means they get off.

I believe there are very few convicted criminals who are innocent. A lot have admitted their crime, due to overwhelming evidence. A few still protest their innocence. Such as Jeremy, who is the only lifer who still protests.
« Last Edit: October 04, 2014, 09:31:PM by Adam »
'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline lookout

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #541 on: October 04, 2014, 09:32:PM »
No wonder there's confusion. It's not what you'd call straightforward as it SHOULD have been,or WOULD have been had the right person/s been named !!

Yes,jansus,it is frustrating and wrong in a case of this magnitude.

Offline Caroline

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #542 on: October 04, 2014, 09:32:PM »
Fair enough. What things?

There are lots of things, like everyone else, I have questions and things I'm not sure about. But there are other things I am quite sure about (as far as I can be for someone who wasn't there).
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Offline Adam

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #543 on: October 04, 2014, 09:40:PM »
There are lots of things, like everyone else, I have questions and things I'm not sure about. But there are other things I am quite sure about (as far as I can be for someone who wasn't there).

You should create a thread on Jeremy's written answers to you're questions.

Would be interesting.

People were trying to interpret his WS to say he phoned Julie before the police the other day. Until you posted what he had recently told you.

'Only I know what really happened that night'.

Offline Jan

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #544 on: October 04, 2014, 10:35:PM »
You should create a thread on Jeremy's written answers to you're questions.

Would be interesting.

People were trying to interpret his WS to say he phoned Julie before the police the other day. Until you posted what he had recently told you.

The thing is Adam if he is innocent he does not know everything does he?

He did not know what the original notebooks from the officers said, he does not know what they heard inside the house , He does not know what they found when they went in the house and he did not know at the time  what notes the relatives made or the fact that they hounded the police to change their direction.

He can only say what he knew or said - if the police embellished that to suit their scenario or moved things in the house  he cant prove that the same that we can not.


Offline Caroline

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #545 on: October 04, 2014, 10:37:PM »
The thing is Adam if he is innocent he does not know everything does he?

He did not know what the original notebooks from the officers said, he does not know what they heard inside the house , He does not know what they found when they went in the house and he did not know at the time  what notes the relatives made or the fact that they hounded the police to change their direction.

He can only say what he knew or said - if the police embellished that to suit their scenario or moved things in the house  he cant prove that the same that we can not.

If
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Offline Jane

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #546 on: October 04, 2014, 10:39:PM »
If



Didn't Rudyard Kipling write that :D :D :D?

Offline Reader

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #547 on: October 05, 2014, 04:17:PM »
I have questions and things I'm not sure about.
If you were working in a police control room at night when, due to a call from a member of the public about a domestic incident at a farm, you were asked to drive to that farm, wouldn't you immediately want to know who it was that had called the police station to report the incident?

Offline lookout

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #548 on: October 05, 2014, 05:08:PM »
 Of course. A few minutes are spent on the phone anyway,explaining who you are,etc,plus the nature of the crime.

Offline Reader

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #549 on: October 05, 2014, 05:32:PM »
The scenario is that you are on call to go on a shout if required, but someone else is answering the incoming calls.

Offline Caroline

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #550 on: October 05, 2014, 05:36:PM »
If you were working in a police control room at night when, due to a call from a member of the public about a domestic incident at a farm, you were asked to drive to that farm, wouldn't you immediately want to know who it was that had called the police station to report the incident?

Reader, the one thing I am CERTAIN in my own mind about, is that the call from Neville never happened. I don't think there is anything suspicious about the logs or what occurred and it all fits in with what Jeremy originally claimed.
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Offline Reader

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #551 on: October 05, 2014, 05:53:PM »
But if you were in the control room when Pc West took a call about WHF, wouldn't you want to know who had called Pc West before going there?

Offline Caroline

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #552 on: October 05, 2014, 07:41:PM »
But if you were in the control room when Pc West took a call about WHF, wouldn't you want to know who had called Pc West before going there?

Not really, I'd want to know who was at the scene. West probably did mention who called but it didn't need to be written twice!
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Offline scipio_usmc

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #553 on: October 05, 2014, 09:48:PM »
The thing I find frustrating is the things that matter are actually down to interpretation by "experts" and they all disagree with themselves!

The experts don't disagree about anything significant.  You have not cited any expert testimony that refutes his guilt you have just recited a bunch of different claims from people here. 

What is frustrating to you is that you don't want to believe Jeremy is guilty but the evidence all points to it and you are stuck ignoring it without any rational basis to do so. 

The blood in the silencer even on the day Hayward changed his mind and if it was blood only possible by blood spatter by a contact shot - why would junes and nevilles blood possibly be in there and why on earth would Junes DNA be there?

1)Hayward didn't change his mind, his assessments are consistent.

2) If June and/or Nevill's blood were inside as well as Sheila's that means they also suffered contact shots.  Each had a shot that could have been a contact shot but was viewed as more likely not being a contact shot.  But the only blood determined to be inside was Sheila's. 

3) The DNA found inside (June's DNA was found as well as Sheila's) was the result of contamination.  Someone who handled something with June's DNA and Sheila's DNA on them also handled the inside of the moderator.  The moderator tested negative for the presence of blood prior to being tested for DNA so the DNA found inside was not blood based.

4) You have not pointed to any conflicting expert testimony.  You are ignoring the experts.

A) The experts on both sides agree that there was no way for Nevill and June's blood to intimately mix and yet be mistaken for Sheila's

B) The defense expert obtained by the trial defense team agreed there was no way the blood would not intimately mix and could thereby have been blood from multiple people without it being detected.

C) The defense expert obtained for the appeal could not establish it is possible for the blood of multiple victims killed within a short time of one another not intimately mixing in a moderator.  He claimed he knew of an example where it happened on cloth (though he could not prove there was such a case because he could not provide the name of such case) and admitted testing woudl be necessary to prove it could happen in a moderator but he knew of no one who successfully acocmplished such a test.  The prosecution expert tested that it would not get hot enough.  He also admitted he had no way to know for sure if June and Nevlle's blood did mix together if it could mask the blood of the other.  Nor could the expert explain how it would be possible for AK1, which is less stable than AK2-1, to outlive AK2-1 because in this instance AK1 was foudn but no AK2-1 and that is what differentiates June and Sheila's blood.
 
So you are going on allegations that the defens eexpert admitted were speculative and there was no way he could prove because he lacked the means to test the things he was suggesting in the lab.   

D) Whether it was Sheila's blood or that of her parents makes not much difference either way the moderator was used. Jeremy claimed he left the gun out with no moderator attached and 48-50 bullets left int he kitchen.  The notion Sheial went to the closet and got the moderator an dinstalled it herself and while she was there decided to get 5 more bullets instead of using all 25 fromt he supply left in the kitchen is absurd. That is what Jermey maintained at trial that she installed the moderator and used it to kill her parents and sons then she removed it and put it away before killing herself.  Anyone who buy's that needs to see me about purchasing a bridge. 

One minute its a deadly weapon that Sheila could not possibly use - then someone says its no more that a slightly beefed up air rifle.

There is no contradiction at all.  They speak to 2 different issues.  The claim it is a beefed up airgun merely speaks to the low power of the weapon. 

No one suggested the recolil or weight of the wepaon would be too much for her to handle.  The suggestion she would not be able to use it is because she would not know how.  you and other Jeremy supporters suggest that just because shooting sometimes takes place on a farm tha tmeans she had to have witnessed it and that means she would know how to use the murder weapon.  It is not  asafe assumption that someone seeing another person shoot a shotgun will be able to shoot a shotgun.  But it is even more foolish to claim that it would mean someone would know how to use a semi-automatic rifle.  A shotgun and the murder weapon operate differently.  To load the murder wepaon you had to not only load the magazine and insert it into the wepaon you then needed to manually feed a round into the chamber by working the bolt.  She would not have known she needed to load a round manually first let alone how to do so.  She would not learn either from watching people shoot shotguns.


She would have broken her nails - then we learn the length of her nails was not even recorded.

It is easy to tell if nails are broken but they were not.  The photos show her nails were long. It is hard to load rounds into a magazine without breaking your nails unless you are very careful.  As the spring in the magazine compresses it becoems harder and harde rot load the last round being quite difficult.  The reason is because it was new and not used much and was not stored with bullets in it.  If you leave bullets in a magazine constantly the spring loses tension. They didn't do that though.

Thanks to her illness she alreayd hand dexterity issues, even worse though her medicaiton would make that worse and she was not taking the medicaiton that would counter such effects thus woudl have shakes.  That combined with being in a crazy frenzy makes it unlikely she would load the magazine slow and very carefully.  She would have been in a rush and crash her nails on it trying to load it.

But the even greater dange rto her nails was during the struggle with Nevill.  Especially as she was bashing him with the gun.  Just wielding a bat against  aball often results in women breaking nails let alone tightly gripping the gun and bashing it against his arm, into his face and bashing his head so hard the stock of the gun broke.   

The night dress - no other blood on it- but there is a document on here that may indicate otherwise.

Post this document.  It is one of Mike's fairytales.  In the meantime blood on the back of her gown would not establish she was invovled in the murders anyway.  Back spatter gets on the front of a perpetratorr not the back.  You get blood on your back either by sitting in it, lying in it or having your back near someone who is being attacked by someone else.

The hand swabs - they were re-submitted -were they actually the originals or were they new ones? if so they would not have GSR on them.


The same ones were resubmitted.  The defense has no evidence to the contrary.

The Dickinson report said there was no reason why Sheila would have blood from the victims on her - but everyone else said she would.

The Dickinson report deosn't say anything about the killer not being likely to get blood on him/her and his/her clothing.  You as usual have no idea what you are talking about.

The experts at trial noted the blood that got on the gun while Nevill was being beaten and how blood would have gotten on the killer and his/her clothing as well during the course of such beating.  Also that the killer would have gotten high velocity spatter of the adult victims during the firing of the gunshots.  Also how the killer would have hag GSR on his/her clothing. 

Nevilles injuries - most were cause by gun shot - and if he was slumped on a chair and could not fight back I cant see any reason why Sheila could not have then hit him.

Nevill became slumped over fromt he beating he wasn't beaten while slumped over.  Nevill was knocked out and collapsed into the position he was found in.  He was shot in that position not beaten while in that position.

The killer had no reaosn to beat Nevill if he ha dbeen passed out.  he killer beat Nevill into unconscousness so that the killer could relaod the gun and shoot him.

She had been round guns all her life so I cant see any reason why she could not have fired the gun and there was no need to be a crack shot from that distance.

The tight grouping of shots is not easy.  Hitting with all 25 shots would not be easy either not all shots were fired that close and some targets were moving.  It would take expertise with the weapon to not miss at all and gorup the round tight.  Not only did she lack expertise worse she had dexterity issues including problems caused by her medicaiton causing her to have tremors. That makes it evne less liekly than just her lack of expertise at being able to gorup the shots close and never miss.

worse yet having guns around the house your whole life doesn't mean you know how to load and fire those guns let alone a gun that operates differently than those that were owned by your family as you were growing up.

The murder weapon was the first semi-auto, there is no evidence it was used ever by Nevill or much by anyone else. Only around 100 rounds had been put through it prior to the murders (including Anthony's use little more than a week prior to the murders).  Jeremy used it a few times to become proficient with it for target use but there is no evidence Sheila was visiting there when he did so. There is nothing at all to suggest Sheila would know how to operate the murder weapon.  Ther eis evidence Jeremy tried to teahc her how to load the magazine but she refused to touch it.  Maybe he was just trying to get her prints on it but she refused so that doesn't support her knowing how to use it rathe rit shows she had no interest in it.  She thus had no way to know how to load the magazine, or to insert it, how to chamber a round (nor any evidence she would know she needed to manully chamber a round) or how to release the magazine to then be able to relaod it.

You just want to believe Jeremy is innocent so believe she would just know as if it is obvious and easy and as if it is easy to not miss even when suffering from problems that cause dexterity issues including poor hand eye coordination. .

The moderator  is the key  and I bet everyone of us would fight to the bitter end to have such a vital piece  of evidence removed if it had been - taken out of a box - put in a car boot where there were bloodied clothes , handled by family members , put in a wardrobe , handled in a tissue and put in a piece of cardboard tube.

What bloody clothes you mean the stained panties that were in a trash can that Ann wa snot sure whether she brought home that day or instead on Sunday?

Even if that day there is no way for a bloodstain to jump from the panties out of the garbage bin into a box and then to result in blood drops on the first 6-8 baffles. 

No experts claimed that blood could have been contaminated in the matter you suggest the experts say the opposite that is why such claim was not made at trial or on appeal.

Far from listeining to the experts you are running with nonsens emade up by Mike and others liek him.

It has also been written that the police at one stage tested the moderator on the end of the rifle by firing bullets through it to match LAN lines. Lets sincerely hope that was after al the blood tests had been done.

Bullets travel through the center of themoderator they don't hit the areas where the blood was lodged so would not be likely to dislodge said blood but if such did result in blood being removed all that would accoplish is to leave less evidence for the prosecution to use.  It would deposit extra blood or somehow be able to change the blood type of the blood found inside.

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Mr. Gee

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Re: A Call To Essex Police From Neville? - The poll
« Reply #554 on: October 05, 2014, 10:11:PM »
Quote from: scipio
There is no contradiction at all.  They speak to 2 different issues.  The claim it is a beefed up airgun merely speaks to the low power of the weapon.

No one suggested the recolil or weight of the wepaon would be too much for her to handle.  The suggestion she would not be able to use it is because she would not know how.
Scipio that was not the suggestion at all. This is what he said:
Quote from: john
Its frankly absurd to suggest that Sheila could have overpowered both Nevill and June with what was effectively an overrated airgun.  It just wouldn't have happened and that is my professional opinion.  Nevill could have dealt with her even if shot once, whoever fired those shots knew how to operate that rifle properly and it most certainly wasn't slender-built Sheila.
Where he clearly says that it was an overrated airgun and that was the reason Sheila couldn't have overpowered Nevill.
I sometimes have to laugh at some of these silly things put over by some guilters. If it was Sheila they reason she was so weak and short and it is implied "only a girl" and the gun was effectively only one step up from an airgun so Nevill who was so massive and strong that he would never be overpowered by such a person.
But if it was Jeremy suddenly Nevill becomes a very weak old man who had just been beaten half to death by massively strong Jeremy and then shot to death with his .22 powerful semi automatic. Why he becomes some character like Rambo against this poor sick old man.
Surely even you can see this trickery with words by some? ;D ;D ;D
« Last Edit: October 05, 2014, 10:13:PM by Mr. Gee »