Allegedly biased summing up by the judge

[Adam]

Nevill being downstairs bare footed trying to calm Sheila down by talk while June slept does not sound credible.

Nevill then letting things escalate to murder/suicide and not using his huge physical advantages to negate Sheila is even more unlikely.

Starting to phone Bamber's AM during either time is not credible. If Sheila's mother & father could not control, her, Bamber would be of no use. He has said this himself.

[Adam]

Guilters agree with the first part of the defence scenario - Nevill & June shot in bed. Nevill getting downstairs.

Once in the kitchen the two sides differ.

Guilters saying he was chased and instantly attacked in the kitchen.

The defence saying Nevill had time to start phoning Bamber's AM & got an answer.

Both sides agree Nevill received horrific injuries from the kitchen attack.

[Steve_uk]

I thought it was Jeremy who iniated contact.

There was correspondence, but the initial contact came from Colin.

[ILB]

Guilters agree with the first part of the defence scenario - Nevill & June shot in bed. Nevill getting downstairs.

Once in the kitchen the two sides differ.

Guilters saying he was chased and instantly attacked in the kitchen.

The defence saying Nevill had time to start phoning Bamber's AM & got an answer.

Both sides agree Nevill received horrific injuries from the kitchen attack.

What defence scenario?

I know the CT put something across.

Bamber says " i haven't got a clue"

Rivlin never highlighted a defence scenario other than to say Shelia was the killer amongst other aspects.

I and others have put forward a defence scenario, which is forum fodder. The same with your scenario.

[ILB]

There was correspondence, but the initial contact came from Colin.

I know Jeremy wrote him an angry letter. Not profanity filled but accusing CC of " cashing in "

[ILB]

Guilters agree with the first part of the defence scenario - Nevill & June shot in bed. Nevill getting downstairs.

Once in the kitchen the two sides differ.

Guilters saying he was chased and instantly attacked in the kitchen.

The defence saying Nevill had time to start phoning Bamber's AM & got an answer.

Both sides agree Nevill received horrific injuries from the kitchen attack.

The Defence scenario at trial back in 86, was Shelia carried out the massacre after a mental break. Highlighting her condition.

Apart from the ritual cleaning aspect, I dont recall a SOC construction from Rivlin.

His job was to create reasonable doubt.

[Adam]

What defence scenario?

I know the CT put something across.

Bamber says " i haven't got a clue"

Rivlin never highlighted a defence scenario other than to say Shelia was the killer amongst other aspects.

I and others have put forward a defence scenario, which is forum fodder. The same with your scenario.

The defence had to keep to the crime scene evidence. Nevill and June being shot 9 times in the main bedroom.

Nevill being downstairs fully fit and bare footed while June slept then going upstairs to get shot 4 times is not credible.

The prosecution said of the defence scenario Nevill would have had difficulty speaking after his 4 bedroom shots.

[ILB]

Of course the starting point of the defence scenario was Jeremy recieved a call from Nevill. Its the case starter and cornerstone.

Nothing 40 odd years on can conclusively prove or disprove it.

[Adam]

I don't know enough about Nevill's 2 face shots to know if he could speak or not.

The adreleline would be running through Nevill and it was only 11 words he said. So agree with the prosecution - difficulty. But possible.

What I do not agree with is Nevill chose to start phoning Bamber's AM at 3.00am instead of reclaim his rifle & then ring 999 for an ambulance. 

[ILB]

I don't know enough about Nevill's 2 face shots to know if he could speak or not.

The adreleline would be running through Nevill and it was only 11 words he said. So agree with the prosecution - difficulty. But possible.

What I do not agree with is Nevill chose to start phoning Bamber's AM at 3.00am instead of reclaim his rifle & then ring 999 for an ambulance.

If it was proved that there was no way that Nevill phoned Jeremy that night then it would be case game set and match.

In the same breathe, had a call been proven from WHF to GH, then GH to Chelmsford,the police wouldnt have had a case and Jeremy would still be a free man today.

The calls couldnt be traced ( Jeremy Bamber enquired about it though in his interviews)

Reference the speaking aspect, its said he couldnt make purposeful talk on the account of his injuries but Jeremy can counter that aspect by simply saying " he recieved them after he rang and spoke to me

Appreciate you believe he would " just take the rifle "

[Adam]

If it was proved that there was no way that Nevill phoned Jeremy that night then it would be case game set and match.

In the same breathe, had a call been proven from WHF to GH, then GH to Chelmsford,the police wouldnt have had a case and Jeremy would still be a free man today.

The calls couldnt be traced ( Jeremy Bamber enquired about it though in his interviews)

Reference the speaking aspect, its said he couldnt make purposeful talk on the account of his injuries but Jeremy can counter that aspect by simply saying " he recieved them after he rang and spoke to me

Appreciate you believe he would " just take the rifle "

I am looking at the defence scenario.

I do agree that Nevill being downstairs, fully fit & bare footed is a non starter. He would not let things escalate.

I don't believe 11 words after his 4 shots in/by his bed is purposeful talk. Nevill believed he could say them as he started ringing Bamber according to the defence.

However I do not believe Nevill would choose the ringing Bamber option after his 4 upstairs shots.

[Adam]

The defence could not say Nevill called Bamber while fully fit.

Bamber's own words on the night & afterwards shows he would be of no use in helping Nevill calm Sheila down by talk.

Nevill would not need Bamber's help in physically restraining Sheila. 

The defence also knew June was an available fully functioning adult inside WHF. Who Nevill would go to first. 

[ILB]

What's this "fully fit'thing you always say?

He had a weight and height greater than Shelia.

I am 6 foot 4, my Mrs is 5 5 tops, if she has a firearm she can shoot me. I am not use to love or ornament.

[ILB]

I am looking at the defence scenario.

I do agree that Nevill being downstairs, fully fit & bare footed is a non starter. He would not let things escalate.

I don't believe 11 words after his 4 shots in/by his bed is purposeful talk. Nevill believed he could say them as he started ringing Bamber according to the defence.

However I do not believe Nevill would choose the ringing Bamber option after his 4 upstairs shots.

Bambers counter is that he phoned him before he was shot.

Whether you disbelieve that or I do is neither here or there.

There isnt evidence to say it didnt happen.

[Adam]

Bambers counter is that he phoned him before he was shot.

Whether you disbelieve that or I do is neither here or there.

There isnt evidence to say it didnt happen.

He said he didn't like to think about it.

Forums are for scenarios with a fully fit bare footed Nevill. Or Sheila phoning 999 at 6.09am & saying nothing.

The defence at trial & the CCRC have to be realistic.