My agreements/disagreements with supporters. Re: The Sea Wall route::

[ILB]

Feel like I am in a parallel universe.

A eight minute drive at 2am in 1985 in an Enid Blyton style village is a " risky affair "

[ILB]

And wake up everyone in the process driving at breakneck speed 

If he started his car up in Goldhanger at silly hours he run the risk of being observed driving away from his cottage and out of the village. Where would he park at WHF?  If he drove up Pages Lane he run the risk of waking up those in the farm cottages.  If he parked at the bottom of Pages Lane or on the B1023 then he run the risk of passers by seeing his car.  And yes others are out and about at silly hours: police patrol cars, emergency personnel, medics, etc.  It was the height of the holiday season with holiday makers departing and arriving from airports and ferry crossings.  All it would take is one person to observe his car and game over. 

If he cycled he had to move the bike along Head Street and Fish Street.  Same risks as above. 

If he walked and wore dark clothing and was able to camaflouge his person it would present little risk.  If someone spotted such a person they would be unable to identify. 

So he either walked or didn't leave WHF until the call from NB.  I reckon its the latter.

Park on Pages Lane and saunter down to the farmhouse. Perhaps put the cycle in the boot and once on Pages Lane disembarked on the bicycle down to the farmhouse.

I can't see him walking it, but he may have done. I don't think " it been too tiring " would have put him off doing it.

The Sea wall route going over land in the middle of the night is just ridiculous.

Reference the vicinity, it was completely dead. Bews remarked that Bambers astra was the only car he had seen as they'd been on patrol nearby on an industrial estate.

[ILB]

There is a chance of a patrol car pulling him over if they clock him. This is either driving, cycling, or walking.

They will believe he is out robbing or up to some kind of skullduggery.

Outward journey, he can lie and abort. Return journey he's fucked.

Visual wise if he encounters any pedestrians ( highly unlikely) there is a greater risk of an ID via walking or cycling.

Nobody will take much notice of a car going past if they are walking down a street. They'd had no reason to. They wouldn't believe that the person driving is on their way to massacre five people ( or on their way back from doing so) very doubtful a reg number would be memoriesd or even make of a car.

We're there industrial premises nearby? Who would be out and about in a small village in an affluent area in 1985 at that time? No pubs open, Maybe an insomnia sufferer walking his dog?

But logically speaking the only thing what would have clocked JB at that time would be foxes and cats.

[Cambridgecutie]

Not one person in the history of mankind jumps out of bed at the sound of a car starting. When in a deep sleep.

I could literally drive to the Tesco garage now in a loud ford transit van and come back and not be witnessed by any neighbours or indeed anyone and this is half past 8 in 2025.

But people don't stay in a deep sleep all night.  They drift in and out of REM and RAM 1,2,3 and 4.  Only stages 3 and 4 are deep sleep.

But we are not talking about 8.30pm in 2025.  We are talking about circa 3am in 1985 in a very sleepy village in the height of summer where most people will have windows open. 

You can see the set up and how the cars are parked. 

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.7458272,0.7561388,3a,75y,188.2h,69.08t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sGcezE90HIbcGNNXpUf3CIQ!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D20.918409120337202%26panoid%3DGcezE90HIbcGNNXpUf3CIQ%26yaw%3D188.19893660007935!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDMxMi4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D

[Adam]

The prosecution case is he cycled The Sea Wall. On the bike he stole 2 days earlier. Lots of advantages -

Good terrain.

Good vision.

Flat terrain.

Passing no properties.

4.2 miles.

He lived 5 minutes from it.

He grew up 5 minutes from it.

He worked 5 minutes from it.

Would not be physically tiring.

--------

Not sure what else he needed.

[ILB]

But people don't stay in a deep sleep all night.  They drift in and out of REM and RAM 1,2,3 and 4.  Only stages 3 and 4 are deep sleep.

But we are not talking about 8.30pm in 2025.  We are talking about circa 3am in 1985 in a very sleepy village in the height of summer where most people will have windows open. 

You can see the set up and how the cars are parked. 

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.7458272,0.7561388,3a,75y,188.2h,69.08t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sGcezE90HIbcGNNXpUf3CIQ!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fcb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile%26w%3D900%26h%3D600%26pitch%3D20.918409120337202%26panoid%3DGcezE90HIbcGNNXpUf3CIQ%26yaw%3D188.19893660007935!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu&g_ep=EgoyMDI1MDMxMi4wIKXMDSoASAFQAw%3D%3D

Absolutely no risk of him getting clocked moving his astra out of head street. Let alone driving the route.

[Rob_]

There is a chance of a patrol car pulling him over if they clock him. This is either driving, cycling, or walking.

They will believe he is out robbing or up to some kind of skullduggery.

Outward journey, he can lie and abort. Return journey he's fucked.

Visual wise if he encounters any pedestrians ( highly unlikely) there is a greater risk of an ID via walking or cycling.

Nobody will take much notice of a car going past if they are walking down a street. They'd had no reason to. They wouldn't believe that the person driving is on their way to massacre five people ( or on their way back from doing so) very doubtful a reg number would be memoriesd or even make of a car.

We're there industrial premises nearby? Who would be out and about in a small village in an affluent area in 1985 at that time? No pubs open, Maybe an insomnia sufferer walking his dog?

But logically speaking the only thing what would have clocked JB at that time would be foxes and cats.

Probably not, but on hearing 5 people have been killed just down the road they would go trotting into the local station and report it.

I am up at 3 am most days, it's surprising what you see sometimes. I am convinced Bamber would not drive.

[ILB]

The prosecution case is he cycled The Sea Wall. On the bike he stole 2 days earlier. Lots of advantages -

Good terrain.

Good vision.

Flat terrain.

Passing no properties.

4.2 miles.

He lived 5 minutes from it.

He grew up 5 minutes from it.

He worked 5 minutes from it.

Would not be physically tiring.

--------

Not sure what else he needed.

EP/ DPP got a DI to do the routes in October 85. A month after Bamber was remanded.

With 500 people interviewed in the locacility and not one single soul clocking Bamber they had to get creative.

Do you believe EP should have replicated a sea wall journey in the timeframe that Jeremy Bamber is supposed to have made the murder journey?

[ILB]

Probably not, but on hearing 5 people have been killed just down the road they would go trotting into the local station and report it.

But without a reg number or even a description of the car make ( which you would not remember as you'd have no reason to) the information would be rendered useless.

However a visual ID walk or cycle, you could make a description ( brown hair, male, in his twenties)

If you made eye contact or even a fleeting glance you could make a positive ID parade.

[ILB]

The prosecution case is he cycled The Sea Wall. On the bike he stole 2 days earlier. Lots of advantages -

Good terrain.

Good vision.

Flat terrain.

Passing no properties.

4.2 miles.

He lived 5 minutes from it.

He grew up 5 minutes from it.

He worked 5 minutes from it.

Would not be physically tiring.

--------

Not sure what else he needed.

He says he has no idea of it

You can make assumptions, but you cannot disprove what he states in this regard. You will never be able to.

You know this.

[Adam]

EP/ DPP got a DI to do the routes in October 85. A month after Bamber was remanded.

With 500 people interviewed in the locacility and not one single soul clocking Bamber they had to get creative.

Do you believe EP should have replicated a sea wall journey in the timeframe that Jeremy Bamber is supposed to have made the murder journey?

Your first paragraph. And?

Second paragraph. Not that creative. Staring them in the face.

Third paragraph. Why?

[Rob_]

But without a reg number or even a description of the car make ( which you would not remember as you'd have no reason to) the information would be rendered useless.

However a visual ID walk or cycle, you could make a description ( brown hair, male, in his twenties)

If you made eye contact or even a fleeting glance you could make a positive ID parade.

The reg/make does not matter, they would say it was a small red car or something like that and Bamber is done for.

[Adam]

He says he has no idea of it

You can make assumptions, but you cannot disprove what he states in this regard. You will never be able to.

You know this.

He lived 5 minutes from it.

He grew up 5 minutes from it.

He worked 5 minutes from it.

You know this.

[Cambridgecutie]

Absolutely no risk of him getting clocked moving his astra out of head street. Let alone driving the route.

Please stop being silly.  He had to start the car up and drive out of Goldhanger through narrow lanes with properties either side all of which probably had windows open given it was the height of summer.

[Cambridgecutie]

The reg/make does not matter, they would say it was a small red car or something like that and Bamber is done for.

Exactly.