Author Topic: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case  (Read 6629 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline grahameb

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 11830
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #30 on: July 27, 2011, 05:34:PM »
I cannot wait to see Houdini of Essex police conjure up some threatening emails I alledgedly sent personally to a police officer.

That on it's own should be a sacking offence and that's just for starters.

And it's all about covering up for her mates


One down and god knows how many more will be following

Get rid of every single bent copper!!'
Unfortunately the police will always take the word of a police officer over the word of a member of the public.

Offline grahameb

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 11830
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #31 on: July 27, 2011, 05:47:PM »
Isn't it the case that The City of London Police were instructed to review the Essex Police investigation and also Scotland Yard officers have also reviewed it. Surely they had access to all relevent materials?

The Essex Police have been highly criticised for an almost incompetent investigation but deemed not to have conspired illegally as they accused of on here everyday.

Furthermore wasn't it descided that any faults did not materially effect the verdict or prejudice the trial?

And lastly haven't all these alligations been placed before the Appeal Courts and CCRC and the original verdict upheld everytime.

If that is all correct (?) .... why are you still going on and on about the Essex Police as if they were conspiring criminals?

The Essex Police originally believed Bamber's murder/suicide plan; they had to admit they were totally wrong when the truth came out. Therefore admitting mistakes .... are you seriously suggesting they changed their investigation just to 'get' Bamber?

PB is everything as straighforward as placing your trust in the justice system to have done right?  Are there never any darker forces at play?  The following quote by Lord Denning has been mentioned on the forum recently.  And given how the Birmingham Six case finally turned out, it is quite a chilling quote...

Quote
Just consider the course of events if their [the Six's] action were to proceed to trial ... If the six men failed it would mean that much time and money and worry would have been expended by many people to no good purpose. If they won, it would mean that the police were guilty of perjury; that they were guilty of violence and threats; that the confessions were involuntary and improperly admitted in evidence; and that the convictions were erroneous. That would mean that the Home Secretary would have either to recommend that they be pardoned or to remit the case to the Court of Appeal. That was such an appalling vista that every sensible person would say, 'It cannot be right that these actions should go any further.' They should be struck out either on the ground that the men are stopped from challenging the decision of Mr. Justice Bridge, or alternatively that it is an abuse of the process of the court. Whichever it is, the actions should be stopped.[

They spent a further 10 years in prison after this quote.


It is a very famous quote and it is chilling.  This was a statement made by Lord Denning when he was Master of the Rolls (i.e. the head of the Court of Appeal, Civil Division) in the civil action brought by the Birmingham 6 for assault.  Denning was one of the most senior and respected judges at that time. I remember it well as barristers from my chambers were involved.  The evidence of the assaults was overwhelming.  Denning never apologised for these remarks, in the same way that he said he had never had a moment's regret about any of those he had sentenced to death in his time as a High Court Judge.  As I have said several times before, our judiciary have a very poor record in righting miscarriages of justice.
I never did like Lord Denning. He always seemed more adamant that the process of the law be observed instead of considering whether a person was the victim of a miscarriage of justice. In his eyes a verdict must never be questioned. A bit like PB in fact. He had "total faith" in the process of the law. To my mind he often made some pretty dumb decisions.

Offline Roch

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17579
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #32 on: July 27, 2011, 05:55:PM »
Quote
Lord Denning. He always seemed more adamant that the process of the law be observed instead of considering whether a person was the victim of a miscarriage of justice. In his eyes a verdict must never be questioned. A bit like PB in fact. He had "total faith" in the process of the law.

 ::) Aye... I think a lot of people fall in to the trap of making assumptions, as opposed to having their eyes opened.

Offline jon

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1437
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #33 on: July 27, 2011, 05:59:PM »
Quote
Lord Denning. He always seemed more adamant that the process of the law be observed instead of considering whether a person was the victim of a miscarriage of justice. In his eyes a verdict must never be questioned. A bit like PB in fact. He had "total faith" in the process of the law.

 ::) Aye... I think a lot of people fall in to the trap of making assumptions, as opposed to having their eyes opened.
Haha great post !!

Offline Roch

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17579
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #34 on: July 27, 2011, 06:02:PM »
Quote
Lord Denning. He always seemed more adamant that the process of the law be observed instead of considering whether a person was the victim of a miscarriage of justice. In his eyes a verdict must never be questioned. A bit like PB in fact. He had "total faith" in the process of the law.

 ::) Aye... I think a lot of people fall in to the trap of making assumptions, as opposed to having their eyes opened.
Haha great post !!

Jon... I still keep meaning to do my scale of guilt diagram.  I'm not sure if you and VORTEX will still be closest to me on it.  I'm sliding towards 10% guilt.   ;D

Online ngb1066

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6671
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #35 on: July 27, 2011, 06:03:PM »
Isn't it the case that The City of London Police were instructed to review the Essex Police investigation and also Scotland Yard officers have also reviewed it. Surely they had access to all relevent materials?

The Essex Police have been highly criticised for an almost incompetent investigation but deemed not to have conspired illegally as they accused of on here everyday.

Furthermore wasn't it descided that any faults did not materially effect the verdict or prejudice the trial?

And lastly haven't all these alligations been placed before the Appeal Courts and CCRC and the original verdict upheld everytime.

If that is all correct (?) .... why are you still going on and on about the Essex Police as if they were conspiring criminals?

The Essex Police originally believed Bamber's murder/suicide plan; they had to admit they were totally wrong when the truth came out. Therefore admitting mistakes .... are you seriously suggesting they changed their investigation just to 'get' Bamber?

PB is everything as straighforward as placing your trust in the justice system to have done right?  Are there never any darker forces at play?  The following quote by Lord Denning has been mentioned on the forum recently.  And given how the Birmingham Six case finally turned out, it is quite a chilling quote...

Quote
Just consider the course of events if their [the Six's] action were to proceed to trial ... If the six men failed it would mean that much time and money and worry would have been expended by many people to no good purpose. If they won, it would mean that the police were guilty of perjury; that they were guilty of violence and threats; that the confessions were involuntary and improperly admitted in evidence; and that the convictions were erroneous. That would mean that the Home Secretary would have either to recommend that they be pardoned or to remit the case to the Court of Appeal. That was such an appalling vista that every sensible person would say, 'It cannot be right that these actions should go any further.' They should be struck out either on the ground that the men are stopped from challenging the decision of Mr. Justice Bridge, or alternatively that it is an abuse of the process of the court. Whichever it is, the actions should be stopped.[

They spent a further 10 years in prison after this quote.


It is a very famous quote and it is chilling.  This was a statement made by Lord Denning when he was Master of the Rolls (i.e. the head of the Court of Appeal, Civil Division) in the civil action brought by the Birmingham 6 for assault.  Denning was one of the most senior and respected judges at that time. I remember it well as barristers from my chambers were involved.  The evidence of the assaults was overwhelming.  Denning never apologised for these remarks, in the same way that he said he had never had a moment's regret about any of those he had sentenced to death in his time as a High Court Judge.  As I have said several times before, our judiciary have a very poor record in righting miscarriages of justice.
I never did like Lord Denning. He always seemed more adamant that the process of the law be observed instead of considering whether a person was the victim of a miscarriage of justice. In his eyes a verdict must never be questioned. A bit like PB in fact. He had "total faith" in the process of the law. To my mind he often made some pretty dumb decisions.

Grahame  - I agree with you entirely.  Denning was the great proponent of "judge made law" and for some unjustified reason he tended to be regarded as forward thinking and progressive.  In fact his judgements tended to reflect his own very reactionary prejudices and some of his decisions were absolute stinkers. He was finally forced to go (there was no compulsory retirement age for judges then so he carried on well past his sell by date) when he started to embarrass even some of his fellow senior judges.

 

Offline Enigma

  • Senior Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 506
  • Fiat justitia ruat caelum
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #36 on: July 27, 2011, 06:11:PM »
Jesus Christ!
I just wrote a really long post agreeing with the Denning stuff; even quoting the Timothy Evans case and I post it and it's dissappeared into the effing ether!
It's a conspiracy!!!!!  ;D :-\

Offline Roch

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 17579
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #37 on: July 27, 2011, 06:15:PM »
Jesus Christ!
I just wrote a really long post agreeing with the Denning stuff; even quoting the Timothy Evans case and I post it and it's dissappeared into the effing ether!
It's a conspiracy!!!!!  ;D :-\

I saw that you were writing and i was thinking 'this must be a long post coz he's been at it for ages'  ;D
Maybe you got timed out?

Offline grahameb

  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 11830
Re: Its only evidence, if it supports the prosecutions case
« Reply #38 on: July 27, 2011, 06:22:PM »
Jesus Christ!
I just wrote a really long post agreeing with the Denning stuff; even quoting the Timothy Evans case and I post it and it's dissappeared into the effing ether!
It's a conspiracy!!!!!  ;D :-\
Not sure what happened to your post PB. I haven't deleted anything. Perhaps it was Jesus Christ? ;D