Jeremy Bamber Forum
JEREMY BAMBER CASE => Jeremy Bamber Case Discussion => Topic started by: bob on June 19, 2011, 05:29:PM
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Rochy said it was all getting a bit pro-Bamber round this parish, and appealed for one of us sceptics to step in, so here's a bit if JB shiftiness to discuss...
Colin says that Jeremy visited him a few days before the murder to ask when the twins would be at the farm (http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/ (http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/))
I recall reading somewhere else that Colin said this was out of character, but I can't find a reference for that - maybe someone with a copy of Colin's book could check if this is in there?
If so, this is quite suspiscious behaviour, is it not?
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I believe Colin said in his book that he invited Sheila, Jeremy and Julie to a party at his on the Saturday before the murders.
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I believe Colin said in his book that he invited Sheila, Jeremy and Julie to a party at his on the Saturday before the murders.
im just looking at the book now, will post if i find mention of it :)
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I believe Colin said in his book that he invited Sheila, Jeremy and Julie to a party at his on the Saturday before the murders.
im just looking at the book now, will post if i find mention of it :)
Excellent work A :)
Clearly there are two completely different slants on this. If, as sarann says, JB was there because Colin invited him then that is not at all suspiscious, whereas the way it is phrased in the Independent article is completely different!
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colinn had indeed invited both julie and jeremy to the party, with no mention of jeremy asking where the twins were.
however he does mention the photos selling thing later on in the book.
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colinn had indeed invited both julie and jeremy to the party, with no mention of jeremy asking where the twins were.
however he does mention the photos selling thing later on in the book.
Looks like this report could be bogus then. +1 for the prompt looking up Andrea.
Makes my shiny new anti-JB thread a bit redundant though. I'll have to try harder next time...
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plug away bob, im trying to keep my opinions to myself now regarding the case, its only fair if im a mod :)
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Did u know bob that sheilas mental health problems started before she had even became pregnant with the twins? i was always under the impression that they started when she split up with colin. It was only when i read colin book that i learned she had been having problems for years.
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Rochy said it was all getting a bit pro-Bamber round this parish, and appealed for one of us sceptics to step in, so here's a bit if JB shiftiness to discuss...
Colin says that Jeremy visited him a few days before the murder to ask when the twins would be at the farm (http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/ (http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/))
I recall reading somewhere else that Colin said this was out of character, but I can't find a reference for that - maybe someone with a copy of Colin's book could check if this is in there?
If so, this is quite suspiscious behaviour, is it not?
Nice try bob. i read this a few weeks back. Cant see there being a link for this article on Jeremy's official site ;) Some pretty strong comments underneath article also....
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A detail often overlooked was that the twin boys who were murdered did not live at the farm. Because of their mother’s illness, they were being brought up by their father, who allowed them to visit their grandparents. A few days before the killings, Bamber visited Colin Caffell with the apparent aim of checking when the boys would be there. If they had not been killed, Jeremy Bamber would not have been the sole heir to the family fortune.
There is another rather creepy detail in Caffell’s book, that he later came to believe that Jeremy Bamber was studying him in the immediate aftermath of the murders to see how someone genuinely grief stricken behaved, in order to mimic him.
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/
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thats true jerry, colin also told the police that he thought the family were bullying jb for itrems from the house and colin got the impression that theye were ganging up on him.
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A detail often overlooked was that the twin boys who were murdered did not live at the farm. Because of their mother’s illness, they were being brought up by their father, who allowed them to visit their grandparents. A few days before the killings, Bamber visited Colin Caffell with the apparent aim of checking when the boys would be there. If they had not been killed, Jeremy Bamber would not have been the sole heir to the family fortune.
There is another rather creepy detail in Caffell’s book, that he later came to believe that Jeremy Bamber was studying him in the immediate aftermath of the murders to see how someone genuinely grief stricken behaved, in order to mimic him.
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/
I feel deep sympathy for Colin Caffell, his feelings are so often neglected in all of the dissussions of the murders.
However, this one dimensional view and biased view of what happened does no one any service, Jerry.
Colin had separated from Sheila at the time of the murders. I've read that, during the journey to WHF just days before the murders, Sheila pleaded with Colin to take her back, but he refused because he had a lover and no longer wanted Sheila as his wife.
So, Sheila lost her husband and her children. This must have been a factor making Sheila's depression worse. Any woman in her situation would have been depressed by losing her husband and children and Sheila had already been depressed and mentally ill prior to this happening.
It would therefore be natural if Colin's account of what happened is somewhat coloured by guilt and denial.
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A detail often overlooked was that the twin boys who were murdered did not live at the farm. Because of their mother’s illness, they were being brought up by their father, who allowed them to visit their grandparents. A few days before the killings, Bamber visited Colin Caffell with the apparent aim of checking when the boys would be there. If they had not been killed, Jeremy Bamber would not have been the sole heir to the family fortune.
There is another rather creepy detail in Caffell’s book, that he later came to believe that Jeremy Bamber was studying him in the immediate aftermath of the murders to see how someone genuinely grief stricken behaved, in order to mimic him.
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/
I feel deep sympathy for Colin Caffell, his feelings are so often neglected in all of the dissussions of the murders.
However, this one dimensional view and biased view of what happened does no one any service, Jerry.
Colin had separated from Sheila at the time of the murders. I've read that, during the journey to WHF just days before the murders, Sheila pleaded with Colin to take her back, but he refused because he had a lover and no longer wanted Sheila as his wife.
So, Sheila lost her husband and her children. This must have been a factor making Sheila's depression worse. Any woman in her situation would have been depressed by losing her husband and children and Sheila had already been depressed and mentally ill prior to this happening.
It would therefore be natural if Colin's account of what happened is somewhat coloured by guilt and denial.
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I agree, entirely...
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A detail often overlooked was that the twin boys who were murdered did not live at the farm. Because of their mother’s illness, they were being brought up by their father, who allowed them to visit their grandparents. A few days before the killings, Bamber visited Colin Caffell with the apparent aim of checking when the boys would be there. If they had not been killed, Jeremy Bamber would not have been the sole heir to the family fortune.
There is another rather creepy detail in Caffell’s book, that he later came to believe that Jeremy Bamber was studying him in the immediate aftermath of the murders to see how someone genuinely grief stricken behaved, in order to mimic him.
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/
I feel deep sympathy for Colin Caffell, his feelings are so often neglected in all of the dissussions of the murders.
However, this one dimensional view and biased view of what happened does no one any service, Jerry.
Colin had separated from Sheila at the time of the murders. I've read that, during the journey to WHF just days before the murders, Sheila pleaded with Colin to take her back, but he refused because he had a lover and no longer wanted Sheila as his wife.
So, Sheila lost her husband and her children. This must have been a factor making Sheila's depression worse. Any woman in her situation would have been depressed by losing her husband and children and Sheila had already been depressed and mentally ill prior to this happening.
It would therefore be natural if Colin's account of what happened is somewhat coloured by guilt and denial.
I fear you are being unfair to Colin Caffell, it was not his fault that the Bamber family were murdered and there is no reason for him to feel any guilt or denial. Sheila may have wished for a reunion but she knew that such a reunion was unlikely. I wonder who revealed the story that Sheila had pleaded with Colin to take her back, could it have been Colin?
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A detail often overlooked was that the twin boys who were murdered did not live at the farm. Because of their mother’s illness, they were being brought up by their father, who allowed them to visit their grandparents. A few days before the killings, Bamber visited Colin Caffell with the apparent aim of checking when the boys would be there. If they had not been killed, Jeremy Bamber would not have been the sole heir to the family fortune.
There is another rather creepy detail in Caffell’s book, that he later came to believe that Jeremy Bamber was studying him in the immediate aftermath of the murders to see how someone genuinely grief stricken behaved, in order to mimic him.
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/
I feel deep sympathy for Colin Caffell, his feelings are so often neglected in all of the dissussions of the murders.
However, this one dimensional view and biased view of what happened does no one any service, Jerry.
Colin had separated from Sheila at the time of the murders. I've read that, during the journey to WHF just days before the murders, Sheila pleaded with Colin to take her back, but he refused because he had a lover and no longer wanted Sheila as his wife.
So, Sheila lost her husband and her children. This must have been a factor making Sheila's depression worse. Any woman in her situation would have been depressed by losing her husband and children and Sheila had already been depressed and mentally ill prior to this happening.
It would therefore be natural if Colin's account of what happened is somewhat coloured by guilt and denial.
I fear you are being unfair to Colin Caffell, it was not his fault that the Bamber family were murdered and there is no reason for him to feel any guilt or denial. Sheila may have wished for a reunion but she knew that such a reunion was unlikely. I wonder who revealed the story that Sheila had pleaded with Colin to take her back, could it have been Colin?
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Yes, Colin revealed those details in one of his witness statements, Sheila askled Colin to take her back, she wanted them to live together as man and wife, with their children and to be a proper family - but Colin rejected her advances and the remainder of the journey to WHf was continued in complete silence (according to Colin)...
Hope this clears up your query?
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Yes, the clue was in the question.
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Yes, the clue was in the question.
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And the truth was in my reply...
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You only have Colin Caffell's word for that, do you believe him?
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A detail often overlooked was that the twin boys who were murdered did not live at the farm. Because of their mother’s illness, they were being brought up by their father, who allowed them to visit their grandparents. A few days before the killings, Bamber visited Colin Caffell with the apparent aim of checking when the boys would be there. If they had not been killed, Jeremy Bamber would not have been the sole heir to the family fortune.
There is another rather creepy detail in Caffell’s book, that he later came to believe that Jeremy Bamber was studying him in the immediate aftermath of the murders to see how someone genuinely grief stricken behaved, in order to mimic him.
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/
Page 25 refers to Colin's party a few days before the killings:
Bambs was delighted when we invited her, so then I asked if she would like to invite her brother and his girlfriend. I hadn't seen much of Jeremy since our separation and thought I might be able to get him to help me convince his parents that their money might be better spent on Bambs having a different kind of psychiatric treatment to that she'd been receiving.
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You only have Colin Caffell's word for that, do you believe him?
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Sheila was rejected by Colin en route to WHF, and I find that to be highlty significant and relevant in view of the fact that Sheila killed everyone else at whf, and then took her own life...
She was rejected...
Parents spoke about taking control of her children from her...
and that took her over the top, I am afraid...
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Absolute hogwash, we only have the word of a convicted murderer that any of that took place.
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Absolute hogwash, we only have the word of a convicted murderer that any of that took place.
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I did not know that Colin Caffell was a convicted murderer...
You must enlighten me...
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A detail often overlooked was that the twin boys who were murdered did not live at the farm. Because of their mother’s illness, they were being brought up by their father, who allowed them to visit their grandparents. A few days before the killings, Bamber visited Colin Caffell with the apparent aim of checking when the boys would be there. If they had not been killed, Jeremy Bamber would not have been the sole heir to the family fortune.
There is another rather creepy detail in Caffell’s book, that he later came to believe that Jeremy Bamber was studying him in the immediate aftermath of the murders to see how someone genuinely grief stricken behaved, in order to mimic him.
http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2011/01/30/the-strange-case-of-jeremy-bamber/
I feel deep sympathy for Colin Caffell, his feelings are so often neglected in all of the discussions of the murders.
However, this one dimensional view and biased view of what happened does no one any service, Jerry.
Colin had separated from Sheila at the time of the murders. I've read that, during the journey to WHF just days before the murders, Sheila pleaded with Colin to take her back, but he refused because he had a lover and no longer wanted Sheila as his wife.
So, Sheila lost her husband and her children. This must have been a factor making Sheila's depression worse. Any woman in her situation would have been depressed by losing her husband and children and Sheila had already been depressed and mentally ill prior to this happening.
It would therefore be natural if Colin's account of what happened is somewhat coloured by guilt and denial.
I fear you are being unfair to Colin Caffell, it was not his fault that the Bamber family were murdered and there is no reason for him to feel any guilt or denial. Sheila may have wished for a reunion but she knew that such a reunion was unlikely. I wonder who revealed the story that Sheila had pleaded with Colin to take her back, could it have been Colin?
I am not being unfair to Colin Caffell for whom I feel nothing but sympathy and I am not suggesting that it is in any sense Colin's fault that the family were murdered.
I am saying that if Colin did refuse to try again with Sheila, as claimed, then he would be a rare person indeed if he did not feel guilt about that in the light of Sheila's mental illness and what happened a few days later.
Guilt and denial go hand in hand and that appears to be reflected in Colin's one dimensional view of Jeremy Bamber.
Also, as Mike has rightly pointed out, Colin Caffell may be unaware of evidence which suggests that not Jeremy, who killed the family.
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Absolute hogwash, we only have the word of a convicted murderer that any of that took place.
no jerry, colin stated that in his book, that shiela had asked colin to give their relationship another go, colin refused and sheila did spend the rest of the journey staring out of the window not saying anything.
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I have a copy of Colins book, and I may be posting it on the forum to facilitate debate...
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I have a copy of Colins book, and I may be posting it on the forum to facilitate debate...
I wish you'd said that before I chipped out around £20 for it ;D
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Absolute hogwash, we only have the word of a convicted murderer that any of that took place.
no jerry, colin stated that in his book, that shiela had asked colin to give their relationship another go, colin refused and sheila did spend the rest of the journey staring out of the window not saying anything.
Well said, Andrea +1
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I have a copy of Colins book, and I may be posting it on the forum to facilitate debate...
I wish you'd said that before I chipped out around £20 for it ;D
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Sorry...
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thats cheap choc, ive seen copies going for 50 quid i got mine for a bargain £2.50, yep 2.50 i remember now!!!
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I have a copy of Colins book, and I may be posting it on the forum to facilitate debate...
I wish you'd said that before I chipped out around £20 for it ;D
20 quid? I got mine from the library.
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I have a copy of Colins book, and I may be posting it on the forum to facilitate debate...
I wish you'd said that before I chipped out around £20 for it ;D
20 quid? I got mine from the library.
I can't write notes all over a library book though and I haven't read a book until I've scribbled all over it ;D
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I have a copy of Colins book, and I may be posting it on the forum to facilitate debate...
I wish you'd said that before I chipped out around £20 for it ;D
20 quid? I got mine from the library.
I can't write notes all over a library book though and I haven't read a book until I've scribbled all over it ;D
I'm the same, with the addition of a few hundred post-it notes used as bookmarks.
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colins feeling guilt...hmm
dealing with those who are severely mentally ill is very difficult ....and something what may be as innocent as making remarks or decisions that the ill person is not happy with can have effects on them far out of proportion to how a mentally well person would react.
saying what may be perceived as the wrong thing can be all too easy....and from which guilt may form...
the position someone like Colin needs to take is that there was no intention of malice and so there should be no guilt should he form the impression that anything Sheila did was attributed to anything he may have done or said.
the question arises though....if colin felt some guilt....then he must also under the surface believe Sheila did kill the others.
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I have a copy of Colins book, and I may be posting it on the forum to facilitate debate...
I wish you'd said that before I chipped out around £20 for it ;D
20 quid? I got mine from the library.
I can't write notes all over a library book though and I haven't read a book until I've scribbled all over it ;D
I'm the same, with the addition of a few hundred post-it notes used as bookmarks.
Hi Gerald, good to have a conversation with you without grimacing ;)
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I have a copy of Colins book, and I may be posting it on the forum to facilitate debate...
I wish you'd said that before I chipped out around £20 for it ;D
20 quid? I got mine from the library.
I can't write notes all over a library book though and I haven't read a book until I've scribbled all over it ;D
I'm the same, with the addition of a few hundred post-it notes used as bookmarks.
Hi Gerald, good to have a conversation with you without grimacing ;)
Sorry if I made you grimace, I was only trying to educate.