Jeremy Bamber Forum
JEREMY BAMBER CASE => Jeremy Bamber Case Discussion => Topic started by: mike tesko on November 10, 2013, 10:49:PM
-
The handwritten note inside the pages of the blue bible could not be any more specific, since not only was it written in Sheila's own handwriting, but the 'LOVE ONE ANOTHER' note starts off by saying that "On the 7th August, everything she had decided to do, was going to be done, so that all her family could be together in one place, enjoying the love of god together...
There can be no doubt whatsoever, now, that Sheila intended to kill her entire family on the 7th August 1985...
-
The next line 'looks like' "a determination always to act in the" can't make out the rest.
-
The next line 'looks like' "a determination always to act in the" can't make out the rest.
Could it be "A determination at---"? Looks like there is a line in the L making it a T and not a L, to me anyway.
-
Could it be "A determination at---"? Looks like there is a line in the L making it a T and not a L, to me anyway.
Could be.
-
"A determination always to act in the......" ?
In my own humble opinion these just look like notes made about a certain verse of scripture as some people do? I cannot with any degree of wishful thinking make this into a suicide note?
-
"A determination always to act in the......" ?
In my own humble opinion these just look like notes made about a certain verse of scripture as some people do? I cannot with any degree of wishful thinking make this into a suicide note?
If that is so, Grahame, and I'm perfectly prepared to accept it is, MIGHT these have been notes written by June in preparation for her next Bible class, and might it have been that meeting which she failed to attend that night.
-
If that is so, Grahame, and I'm perfectly prepared to accept it is, MIGHT these have been notes written by June in preparation for her next Bible class, and might it have been that meeting which she failed to attend that night.
Possible April? But I fear that anything we say about these few words can be nothing but speculation? They could have been written at any time?
-
If that is so, Grahame, and I'm perfectly prepared to accept it is, MIGHT these have been notes written by June in preparation for her next Bible class, and might it have been that meeting which she failed to attend that night.
April,,it's Sheilas' diaries that I'm sure would have been of interest. After all,,it was the diaries which were produced during the 16th year of Eddie Gilfoyles' sentence. Even then,it was two years later that he was released ( complete with gagging order ) and to this day he's still waiting for a pardon,,as the Merseyside police bungled that case.
-
April,,it's Sheilas' diaries that I'm sure would have been of interest. After all,,it was the diaries which were produced during the 16th year of Eddie Gilfoyles' sentence. Even then,it was two years later that he was released ( complete with gagging order ) and to this day he's still waiting for a pardon,,as the Merseyside police bungled that case.
Undoubtedly so, Lookout, but what do you think are the chances of them ever coming to light now?
-
Undoubtedly so, Lookout, but what do you think are the chances of them ever coming to light now?
Doubtful,,April,as I seem to remember that her diaries were given to one of the relatives. I wonder !!!
-
"A determination always to act in the......" ?
In my own humble opinion these just look like notes made about a certain verse of scripture as some people do? I cannot with any degree of wishful thinking make this into a suicide note?
I agree that on the face of it nothing conclusive can be ascertained from the words shown .
However , the behaviour of EP regarding this "crucial" piece of evidence suggests that they have something to hide .
Police initially denied that any photographs had been taken of the bible , until they showed up .
Bloodied prints found and tested positively but never disclosed so clearly not Jeremy's .
Too much effort to cover up nothing so I have to conclude that EP are covering up what would be the "smoking gun" .
-
Doubtful,,April,as I seem to remember that her diaries were given to one of the relatives. I wonder !!!
Like an X file in FBI vaults lost forever or well hidden.
-
There is no way we can know who wrote this note, when, where and why, so it is futile specilation.
Another thing is, it always strikes me when I see that bible that it was placed there - and I do believe it was placed there by the EP. I would like to know why that was!
-
"A determination always to act in the......" ?
In my own humble opinion these just look like notes made about a certain verse of scripture as some people do? I cannot with any degree of wishful thinking make this into a suicide note?
"A determination always to act in the..others best interest????????
If we stick at this we might get it......I think its in the bible. :-\ :) :) :) :)
-
"A determination always to act in the..others best interest????????
If we stick at this we might get it......I think its in the bible. :-\ :) :) :) :)
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+6%3A31&version=ESV
Any use Patti? :)
-
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+6%3A31&version=ESV
Any use Patti? :)
Not sure Maggie....If I cross my eyes, stand on me legs I might be able to read it lol ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
Not sure Maggie....If I cross my eyes, stand on me legs I might be able to read it lol ;D ;D ;D ;D
What d'you mean? ;D ;D
-
What d'you mean? ;D ;D
I'm not sure Maggie....Do you think I'm a NUTTA!!!!!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
I'm not sure Maggie....Do you think I'm a NUTTA!!!!!!! ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
I think you very well may be a NUTTA!!!!!! Patti ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
I think you very well may be a NUTTA!!!!!! Patti ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
-
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
What about this?? ;)
http://www.acts17-11.com/servant.html
-
What about this?? ;)
http://www.acts17-11.com/servant.html
I've just looked at that Maggie....we are on the same wavelength. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
I've just looked at that Maggie....we are on the same wavelength. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
I can see it may have been something written by June for her Bible class or I believe June used to write religious texts and leave them about the house. May be one of those???
-
Maggie I can't find anything, I need to look at it tomorrow.....Night night... ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
I can see it may have been something written by June for her Bible class or I believe June used to write religious texts and leave them about the house. May be one of those???
I think you might be right and put it in her own words...I think the answer to this is in the bible...Maybe Tyler can have a look for us.... ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
I think you might be right and put it in her own words...I think the answer to this is in the bible...Maybe Tyler can have a look for us.... ;D ;D ;D ;D
Good idea we need the New English Translation Version of this. ;) ;)
-
Maggie I can't find anything, I need to look at it tomorrow.....Night night... ;D ;D ;D ;D
Night Patti x
-
Maggie I'm still here...lol
I think its a letter to John...which is in the bible John 13:34. The letter is called Love One Another.... ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
Oh crikey its about murder and the killing of Abel by Cain who slaughtered his brother....Where is Grahame and Tyler when you need em!!! ;) :) :) :) :)
-
"A determination always to act in the..others best interest????????
If we stick at this we might get it......I think its in the bible. :-\ :) :) :) :)
Here you are. The verse as from the New International version. You might find something here:
http://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=love+one+another&qs_version=NIV
-
I can see it may have been something written by June for her Bible class or I believe June used to write religious texts and leave them about the house. May be one of those???
Whatever the note says and whoever wrote it , what cannot be avoided is the impression that EP have gone to great lengths to suppress this vital piece of evidence .
It would be interesting to see the paperwork from the initial investigation which concluded four murders and a suicide . I feel sure that the bible and note were vital pieces of evidence in that investigation .
The blue bible does appear key to solving the case . Were it to be found that the prints found on the bible were Jeremy's then that would put him at the scene and there would be no debate over the safety of the conviction . If the note was nothing more than a note written by June for bible class then EP would have disclosed it when asked .
EP instead have lied about the existence of the bible , lied about the existence of photographs of the bible and destroyed evidence . Now call me a cynic but this appears to me to be the behaviour of someone who has something to hide and who knows that the full disclosure of the bible evidence would begin the unravelling of the whole web of lies and deceit .
-
Maggie I'm still here...lol
I think its a letter to John...which is in the bible John 13:34. The letter is called Love One Another.... ;D ;D ;D ;D
Of course it is Patti, forgot about that for a minute ...... oooops ;)
-
Hi gringo do agree with you and I do believe the bible holds many secrets which could unlock this case. Am pretty sure the heavy bloodstains on the page of the bible is a palm print which very possibly belonged to Sheila. So where is that blue bible??
-
A new commandment I give you;Love one another. As I have loved you,so you must love one another. All men will know that you are my disciples if you love one another.
Simon Peter asked him "Lord,where are you going?"
Jesus replied,"Where I am going,you cannot follow now,but you will follow later"
Peter asked,"Lord,why can't I follow you now? I will lay down my life for you".
Then Jesus answered,"Will you really lay down your life for me? I tell you the truth,before the cock crows,you will disown me three times!
-
A new commandment I give you;Love one another. As I have loved you,so you must love one another. All men will know that you are my disciples if you love one another.
Simon Peter asked him "Lord,where are you going?"
Jesus replied,"Where I am going,you cannot follow now,but you will follow later"
Peter asked,"Lord,why can't I follow you now? I will lay down my life for you".
Then Jesus answered,"Will you really lay down your life for me? I tell you the truth,before the cock crows,you will disown me three times!
Thank you tyler. Love those words, they are very special x
-
Spooky words Maggie,when considering the letter JB found from June 'to be opened in the event of my death' in which she wanted to tell them she loved them all. Note the mention of the number '3' in the passage? And the "before the cock crows"...they all died before dawn. (Apart from possibly Sheila)
-
Spooky words Maggie,when considering the letter JB found from June 'to be opened in the event of my death' in which she wanted to tell them she loved them all. Note the mention of the number '3' in the passage? And the "before the cock crows"...they all died before dawn. (Apart from possibly Sheila)
Yes there's that 3 again. Those words are spooky.x
-
Spooky words Maggie,when considering the letter JB found from June 'to be opened in the event of my death' in which she wanted to tell them she loved them all. Note the mention of the number '3' in the passage? And the "before the cock crows"...they all died before dawn. (Apart from possibly Sheila)
Sheila would have probably waited to make sure that all had died,hence the reason why she was the last one.
The woman would NOT have allowed anyone,,not even Jeremy,,to harm her children,,,it had to be her,herself,,as sadly the illness goes.
A sad case yesterday where a poor soul suffered PND and killed her 5/6 week old baby.
-
Sheila would have probably waited to make sure that all had died,hence the reason why she was the last one.
The woman would NOT have allowed anyone,,not even Jeremy,,to harm her children,,,it had to be her,herself,,as sadly the illness goes.
A sad case yesterday where a poor soul suffered PND and killed her 5/6 week old baby.
It's since been learned that the woman who killed her baby hadn't been taking her anti-depressants because of the stigma that the woman felt which signified her illness. How very very sad.
-
It's since been learned that the woman who killed her baby hadn't been taking her anti-depressants because of the stigma that the woman felt which signified her illness. How very very sad.
Since posting this,,the body of a GP has been found. The woman went missing last week after suffering depression since the birth of her baby.
Also,in todays paper,another poor soul has committed suicide through PMD,and she'd thrown herself in front of a train after dropping her baby off at a nursery. Her husband,an Army Major had said that she appeared normal before going out. RIP to both these women whose illnesses still remain to be underestimated after giving birth.Bless them both,it's so sad,but we're hearing of more PND cases,,the latter one seemingly having been the worst,as the poor woman had started losing her hair.
-
Sadly yet another suicide by hanging,of a new mum with a 3 month old daughter. Her soldier partner discovered her on his return from Afghanistan. Another PND sufferer.
-
Why won't anyone get the message that PND,kills ? How many more are there going to be before this illness is taken seriously and can,and does lead to worse symptoms if left untreated ?
Babies/children are left without a mother,,or worse,,they too could lose their lives as a result of this illness too.
-
Would someone in the throws of a psychotic episode actually sit down and write a suicide note?
-
Would someone in the throws of a psychotic episode actually sit down and write a suicide note?
No.
-
personally I think the title of the thread should be changed to "there was a note in the bible" - because that is all we can see.
-
personally I think the title of the thread should be changed to "there was a note in the bible" - because that is all we can see.
Hi Janus :)
I think we have all come to the conclusion that is was not a suicide note at all. The note as you put it was titled "Love One Another" which is from the bible all about John's letters. Who wrote it and which letter it is ,is unknown as yet. ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
I'm here again with the PND argument,,which was sorely missed out during this trial of Jeremys'.
This comes after the sufferings of previous posts I've made on the subject.
Again,,reading in the Mail Online,,there is a powerful insight into post-natal depression,,as spoken by a very attractive woman ( as was Sheila ) who,on the outside,didn't look as though she had a care in the world. Husband,,two other children,and her latest beautiful child,who,when the baby was weeks old,,the poor woman had the urge to kill the baby,as well as herself.
Nobody on the outside suspected that the woman was having what she called were " dark moments ".
Now the difference in this woman not having killed herself and her baby,was the thought of her husband arriving home to the carnage,,as he was supportive and still around,,whereas,in Sheilas' case,,that poor soul didn't have anyone and was even deserted by her husband because he didn't bother to either find out,nor understand her plight. He took the easy way out,,to which I have nothing but contempt for.
The illness is well hidden in most women,,as it doesn't come to light until something tracic happens,then it's too late. They all have one thing in common,and that's the thought that they'd be better off dead,along with their child,or children,,but it's rarely done out of malice,instead,it's a love for their children as the mothers realise that they can't carry on caring for them and don't wish to leave them for someone else to look after.
Surely to goodness somebody will bring this subject to the fore even if it meant avoiding any more deaths of mothers and children.
-
It is also front page news that a slightly built woman has murdered 3 men ! Granted not all at once,,but why couldn't any of these men overpower a young woman,,who was brandishing a knife ?
I don't know any details of the womans' health ( mentally,that is ) but she has fully admitted being a " serial killer " and has pleaded guilty. Circumstances I don't yet know of.
-
It is also front page news that a slightly built woman has murdered 3 men ! Granted not all at once,,but why couldn't any of these men overpower a young woman,,who was brandishing a knife ?
I don't know any details of the womans' health ( mentally,that is ) but she has fully admitted being a " serial killer " and has pleaded guilty. Circumstances I don't yet know of.
I heard that on the radio on the way home Lookout. :-\ :-\ :-\
-
I heard that on the radio on the way home Lookout. :-\ :-\ :-\
Hi Patti,,the woman has to have some sort of mental illness to do what she did,but so far there aren't any details as regards circumstances. The killings might have been drug-induced,in which case,,the brain wouldn't have been in normal balance.
Would you believe her partner is 7ft 3ins tall ? All brawn and no brains,,though he denies murdering,or disposing of the bodies of the 3 men,,as well as attempting to murder the other two. It was seemingly all her doing.
How can a woman overpower a man,,,,is my question,,and there wasn't even a gun in sight ?
-
I'm here again with the PND argument,,which was sorely missed out during this trial of Jeremys'.
This comes after the sufferings of previous posts I've made on the subject.
Again,,reading in the Mail Online,,there is a powerful insight into post-natal depression,,as spoken by a very attractive woman ( as was Sheila ) who,on the outside,didn't look as though she had a care in the world. Husband,,two other children,and her latest beautiful child,who,when the baby was weeks old,,the poor woman had the urge to kill the baby,as well as herself.
Nobody on the outside suspected that the woman was having what she called were " dark moments ".
Now the difference in this woman not having killed herself and her baby,was the thought of her husband arriving home to the carnage,,as he was supportive and still around,,whereas,in Sheilas' case,,that poor soul didn't have anyone and was even deserted by her husband because he didn't bother to either find out,nor understand her plight. He took the easy way out,,to which I have nothing but contempt for.
The illness is well hidden in most women,,as it doesn't come to light until something tracic happens,then it's too late. They all have one thing in common,and that's the thought that they'd be better off dead,along with their child,or children,,but it's rarely done out of malice,instead,it's a love for their children as the mothers realise that they can't carry on caring for them and don't wish to leave them for someone else to look after.
Surely to goodness somebody will bring this subject to the fore even if it meant avoiding any more deaths of mothers and children.
totally agree . One of my relatives suffered with PND and the worse thing is people are scared to admit it in case the children are taken away. I used to take the children in when it was really bad.
-
totally agree . One of my relatives suffered with PND and the worse thing is people are scared to admit it in case the children are taken away. I used to take the children in when it was really bad.
I would have said that Sheila was already on a downward spiral most certainly after her abortion at 17 years of age,where they're supposed to be counselled both before and definitely after because of the trauma. I reckon this didn't happen and Sheila would have experienced these " dark moments " which very likely led her down the path of drug-taking to block it out.
If very little is known about this illness in 2013,,then back in the 70's/80's you were completely in the dark,as was everyone around you at that time.
As Sheila went on to have yet another abortion,,then miscarriages,then the twins,,it's no wonder the poor woman was out of her mind,,as goodness knows what damage the drugs would have caused too. Cannabis,likes of cocaine,partying,etc----------all done to try and block out her horrendous illness.
It's no wonder,,or surprise,that she snapped.
-
The young woman who murdered 3 men came from " the perfect middle-class family ",it said in the news today.
Her downfall was when,,as a teenager,she got in with the wrong crowd. Her parents have had no contact with their daughter since she was a teenager.Joanna is now 30. Joannas' sister spoke of how it's ruined her parents with the news of the crimes,,and is utterly shocked and devastated to think that she gave birth to someone like this.
So it blows the theory straight out of the water, that this sort of thing only happens to those who are adopted. I'd argued that it makes no difference whatsoever. If they're going to be bad,,they will be bad no matter who the parents are,regardless of circumstances of birth,etc. It's a load of bolony.
Similar family background as Sheila. Comprehensive school,,private tuition and music lessons. £350,000 house in Hertfordshire,dad was a signaller in the Army and worked for NATO.
Joanna left home in her early teens and before long got into drugs,etc,,the usual downward slippery slope of life.
-
I had an idea we were going to hear about drug connections to these murders.It goes without saying.
-
How did this " slip of a 30 year old woman " manage to overpower and kill three strong men ???
Answers on a postage stamp ! Joanna Dennehey stabbed them to death. Why didn't they overpower her ?
-
Good news at last. PND has now reached the forefront as being an " illness " that has been overlooked for years. On the news this morning,it desribes PND as something which has been poorly misunderstood,and a woman wrote in saying that she's suffered for over 40 years,,has taken all kinds of anti-depressants,etc which haven't worked.
There is now,,after all these years,,counselling clincs being set up for those who need them. Also,a midwife in-situ who will be qualified to recognise the symptoms of PND ( which it said can lead to more drastic situations if left untreated ) Those women who spoke of their PND said they have contemplated suicide,,hurting/neglecting their babies/children,blaming them for their state of mind.
I'm sure that this will now keep making news as finally it's been recognised. There is now a support system under way with specialised teams for home visits.
Most women who had PND said they were in a dark place more often than not and couldn't cope.
Families have never known how to deal with this,as it also affects them too.
Imagine being ill all your life,no understanding,no support,no treatment,nobody to turn to for any help.
Poor Sheila would have suffered for years,not knowing what ailed her,and so she masked it with drugs/drink.
-
Here again with my sixpenn'orth. Now reading about a young 33 year old paranoid schizophrenic who is presently in a stable relationship with a criminologist.
This woman has suffered for the past 10 years,,is on medication and appears stabilised for the time being,but----------------she wants a family and fears that she may pass on her condition to an unborn child. Besides having this in mind,,it would mean that during pregnancy,she would have to stop the medication which is keeping her free from suicidal thoughts,dark moments,etc etc.
Something which I didn't take into consideration when Sheila was pregnant with the twins. After having had two ? miscarriages,,was this caused with taking medication before the twins birth ?
Maybe so,,then the answer was to go through the pregnancy medication-free,,which would have had disasterous results on the state of her mind,coupled with PND.
There is no safe medication to take during pregnancy,,though there " might " be a possibility that Lithium could be taken,,but not enough research has gone into whether the child/children will be affected.
I'm more than convinced that Sheilas mental' problem alone would have caused the tragedy,,,besides all the other issues that went with it.
-
Here again with my sixpenn'orth. Now reading about a young 33 year old paranoid schizophrenic who is presently in a stable relationship with a criminologist.
This woman has suffered for the past 10 years,,is on medication and appears stabilised for the time being,but----------------she wants a family and fears that she may pass on her condition to an unborn child. Besides having this in mind,,it would mean that during pregnancy,she would have to stop the medication which is keeping her free from suicidal thoughts,dark moments,etc etc.
Something which I didn't take into consideration when Sheila was pregnant with the twins. After having had two ? miscarriages,,was this caused with taking medication before the twins birth ?
Maybe so,,then the answer was to go through the pregnancy medication-free,,which would have had disasterous results on the state of her mind,coupled with PND.
There is no safe medication to take during pregnancy,,though there " might " be a possibility that Lithium could be taken,,but not enough research has gone into whether the child/children will be affected.
I'm more than convinced that Sheilas mental' problem alone would have caused the tragedy,,,besides all the other issues that went with it.
Lookout nobody is saying that Sheila wasn't a good suspect:of course she was.What one has to weigh in the balance is whether on that particular morning on the occasion when most of the family was gathered under one roof Sheila was the perpetrator when there is another suspect lurking who was reportedly attempting to devise a means of doing away with his family for almost a year beforehand and who boasted to his girlfriend after the event that this was "the perfect crime".
-
Lookout nobody is saying that Sheila wasn't a good suspect:of course she was.What one has to weigh in the balance is whether on that particular morning on the occasion when most of the family was gathered under one roof Sheila was the perpetrator when there is another suspect lurking who was reportedly attempting to devise a means of doing away with his family for almost a year beforehand and who boasted to his girlfriend after the event that this was "the perfect crime".
What one has to weigh is the motive behind Julie's 'sudden fit of conscience' which just happened to coincide with being dumped. Personally, I don't believe for one moment that she 'offered' her 'story' to SJ, I believe that he threatened to charge her as an accessory and they both developed her statement over the many interviews which followed.
-
What one has to weigh is the motive behind Julie's 'sudden fit of conscience' which just happened to coincide with being dumped. Personally, I don't believe for one moment that she 'offered' her 'story' to SJ, I believe that he threatened to charge her as an accessory and they both developed her statement over the many interviews which followed.
Well Julie couldn't win either way could she? If she telephoned the Police about a non-existent murder plan she was a fantasist wasting Police time,if she kept silent she was an accessory..if she went to the Police Station of her own accord after the murders she was a drama queen;if she went on the instigation of Liz Rimington her hand was forced..
-
What one has to weigh is the motive behind Julie's 'sudden fit of conscience' which just happened to coincide with being dumped. Personally, I don't believe for one moment that she 'offered' her 'story' to SJ, I believe that he threatened to charge her as an accessory and they both developed her statement over the many interviews which followed.
That's how it looks to me.
-
Well Julie couldn't win either way could she? If she telephoned the Police about a non-existent murder plan she was a fantasist wasting Police time,if she kept silent she was an accessory..if she went to the Police Station of her own accord after the murders she was a drama queen;if she went on the instigation of Liz Rimington her hand was forced..
If ifs and buts were sweets and nuts then we'd all have a merry Christmas!!
She could most certainly have won, she could have told the family BEFORE they died. She could have told Colin, the Eaton's, the Boutflour's or even the Bambers and had anything happened to them then it would have been obvious who was responsible. But on hearing 'Tonight's the night' she went to bed and after hearing that the deed had been done, she did the same thing. I'd have been hysterical and wouldn't have been able to stop myself from telling everyone that I KNEW who was responsible. 'But' she said nothing and calm as you like, went off to identify the victims.
-
Well Julie couldn't win either way could she? If she telephoned the Police about a non-existent murder plan she was a fantasist wasting Police time,if she kept silent she was an accessory..if she went to the Police Station of her own accord after the murders she was a drama queen;if she went on the instigation of Liz Rimington her hand was forced..
Steve, she didn't have to do ANY of those things. At the first mention of "murder" she COULD have smelled DANGER, turned her back and walked away. Instead of which, it seems she smelled MONEY and stayed. That money WASN'T her raison d'etre, she herself makes it hard to believe when it's recalled how she presented herself with such triumph and SOOOOO tastelessly after the trial. Nothing will EVER persuade me that she would have done what she did had Jeremy put the ring on her finger that she was hoping for, and therefore nothing will easily persuade me that Jeremy would have thrown away a chance of getting away with murder by dumping the one person who could have pointed the finger at him.
-
Steve, she didn't have to do ANY of those things. At the first mention of "murder" she COULD have smelled DANGER, turned her back and walked away. Instead of which, it seems she smelled MONEY and stayed. That money WASN'T her raison d'etre, she herself makes it hard to believe when it's recalled how she presented herself with such triumph and SOOOOO tastelessly after the trial. Nothing will EVER persuade me that she would have done what she did had Jeremy put the ring on her finger that she was hoping for, and therefore nothing will easily persuade me that Jeremy would have thrown away a chance of getting away with murder by dumping the one person who could have pointed the finger at him.
You do have a point.I don't think Jeremy understood women very well,the two closest females to him being Sheila and June.
-
You do have a point.I don't think Jeremy understood women very well,the two closest females to him being Sheila and June.
How right you are,Steve.
-
Is there no end to how cruel the Essex Council is ? Because a poor woman suffered a mental breakdown,social workers obtained a court order to forcibly remove an unborn child through caesarean section,in order for it to be whipped away and adopted.
-
You do have a point.I don't think Jeremy understood women very well,the two closest females to him being Sheila and June.
Thanks for that Steve. I would agree with you that Jeremy had little understanding of women. Sadly neither Sheila nor June were examples of uncomplicated women.
-
Is there no end to how cruel the Essex Council is ? Because a poor woman suffered a mental breakdown,social workers obtained a court order to forcibly remove an unborn child through caesarean section,in order for it to be whipped away and adopted.
Absolutely horrifying and evil.
-
Absolutely horrifying and evil.
It upset me when I read that,HME. As if by doing that it was going to improve the womans' health ? It's going to cause the poor soul untold damage. Nobody should have the right to do such a thing,only under exceptional circumstances where the woman has been either sectioned as criminally insane,or is a known killer.
-
It upset me when I read that,HME. As if by doing that it was going to improve the womans' health ? It's going to cause the poor soul untold damage. Nobody should have the right to do such a thing,only under exceptional circumstances where the woman has been either sectioned as criminally insane,or is a known killer.
It's like something out of a horror film - the 'state' stealing babies - except it is true. No wonder it's causing outrage.
-
This unfortunate happening occurred nearly 18months ago.
Apparently it started with a 'panic call' to Essex Police, and escalated through the secret Courts of Protection to its present situation of bein a 'cause célèbre', between the Italian and British (so-called Justice) Systems.
Ms Pascale's case has been taken up by Lib MP John Hemming.
The 'current account' may be followed in the Telegraph.
Thankyou Lookout for alerting us to what may seem to be 'Off Topic', but in my opinion it resonates with JB's cause.
-
On reflection, Lookout and HMEssex, it appears to me that one must not even ask aPoliceman what the time is, as quite likely one may end up 'doing time'. Sad, but apparently so, but not 'Just', or Justice!
Just look at Lord Denning's Noble Cause Corruption effusions, - Justice for the Nobles indeed!
-
On reflection, Lookout and HMEssex, it appears to me that one must not even ask aPoliceman what the time is, as quite likely one may end up 'doing time'. Sad, but apparently so, but not 'Just', or Justice!
Just look at Lord Denning's Noble Cause Corruption effusions, - Justice for the Nobles indeed!
Well firstly,Campion,,the watch/time could be 10 minutes out !!!
Secondly,the devil always looks after himself.
-
Well firstly,Campion,,the watch/time could be 10 minutes out !!!
Secondly,the devil always looks after himself.
Hi Lookout :)
The clock and SJ's....
It could be argued that SB had already consciously deducted 10 minutes from the time when she gave the time of 3:15 to Julie.
Of course it could also be argued that the clock was never 10 minutes fast at all and who is to know that the clock was not altered after the murders? We have not only one change in late October, but one in March....So taking this into consideration, the actual clock had been reset accordingly on two occasions. ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
Hi Lookout :)
The clock and SJ's....
It could be argued that SB had already consciously deducted 10 minutes from the time when she gave the time of 3:15 to Julie.
Of course it could also be argued that the clock was never 10 minutes fast at all and who is to know that the clock was not altered after the murders? We have not only one change in late October, but one in March....So taking this into consideration, the actual clock had been reset accordingly on two occasions. ;D ;D ;D ;D
Hi Patti,,there was so much jiggery-pokery going on,you'd be hard pushed to know what was the truth and what wasn't.
-
On reflection, Lookout and HMEssex, it appears to me that one must not even ask aPoliceman what the time is, as quite likely one may end up 'doing time'. Sad, but apparently so, but not 'Just', or Justice!
Just look at Lord Denning's Noble Cause Corruption effusions, - Justice for the Nobles indeed!
Something happened about a year ago with a friend of mine.
It involved a young mother of two young children who had had problems with her own mother for years, resulting in this young mother being proscribed anti-depressants, and this escalated one summer day last year.
It all got sorted out and she is fine now, but this did involve the police at quite some expense to them. However, they said at the time to her close family, "Whatever you do, DO NOT involve Social Services, you are a nice family."
When I heard this, I thought this speaks volumes! Even the police know once somebody is in 'the system' there is no way out, without a struggle.
Maybe some are more savvy than others. :(
-
Bon Matin, HMEssex,
Referring to your ultimate sentence, how does one qualify the word 'savvy'?
It was one of my late Mother's most commonly quoted questions of qualification of a person. She used it in the nuance of common sense, rationality, or more commonly - 'being Streetwise'.
How would you rate DS 'Stan' Brian Jones in the 'savvy' stakes?
Moreover, as I understand from things you have posted on, that you are domiciled in the area N of the Blackwater, you will (and 'and I will say' this only once!) comprehend me when I ask, "Is he still 'coaching'"?
Everytime I see one of the omnibuses, I muse on whether 'Stan' is still living, in the 'Land of the Tolles'.
-
Morning camps does Stan now work on the buses. ;D
-
pssssss, Bring back the PC 49 (Dixon of Dock Green) !
Do you recall Dr ENorthcote Parkinson ? Had he still been alive, I consider he would usefully write a 3rd Law, being a Treatise on 'The Law of the Law'!!!
V timely remark Susan, in your usual circumspect Manor (Savvy or en Francais-Savvez vous!)
To answer your valid question 'I will say' that our "Stan" was more akin to Blakey than Butler in the TV comedy sit-com.
-
Bon Matin, HMEssex,
Referring to your ultimate sentence, how does one qualify the word 'savvy'?
It was one of my late Mother's most commonly quoted questions of qualification of a person. She used it in the nuance of common sense, rationality, or more commonly - 'being Streetwise'.
How would you rate DS 'Stan' Brian Jones in the 'savvy' stakes?
Moreover, as I understand from things you have posted on, that you are domiciled in the area N of the Blackwater, you will (and 'and I will say' this only once!) comprehend me when I ask, "Is he still 'coaching'"?
Everytime I see one of the omnibuses, I muse on whether 'Stan' is still living, in the 'Land of the Tolles'.
Evening Campers! I live in SE Essex - Rayleigh to be precise. It almost seems like a different 'country' altogether, compared to the northern parts of the county - not many bumpkins round here.
All I know about our man Stan is what I've read on here.
I meant savvy in the sense that these particular PCs knew about the realities of getting involved with the SS.
-
Evening Campers! I live in SE Essex - Rayleigh to be precise. It almost seems like a different 'country' altogether, compared to the northern parts of the county - not many bumpkins round here.
All I know about our man Stan is what I've read on here.
I meant savvy in the sense that these particular PCs knew about the realities of getting involved with the SS.
Speaking of the ss,HME,I read a harrowing story in my local rag about a mother who'd given birth to twins,,so newborn,,and she also had a 3 year old toddler. The mother had already had a warning about her drinking while looking after children. Anyway,,she was tanked-up,so the 3 year old decided he'd bath the babies,so he put them in 16ins of cold water,then woke his mum to say he'd been keeping the babies clean.As a result,she panicked,phoned 999 tried to rescusitate them and the police tried,but one died and the other one survived but will be severely disabled.
The mother admitted neglect and received a 1 year prison sentence suspended for two years,and a supervision order,,so presumably she was allowed to keep the toddler and remaining baby.
I'm utterly disgusted with this result.
-
My apologies Ms HMEssex, Naughty step for me!
I thought I read, a few weeks ago that you nipped out for some shopping at Heybridge, and unfortunately had to abandon your vehicle in floodwater.
Now I have established where you live (apparently quite near Tyler), did you get caught out in a flood, if so where, perhaps Hullbridge Watery Lane say?
Stan's Coaches operates out of a yard at Great Totham, in the 'Land of the Tolles'.
-
My apologies Ms HMEssex, Naughty step for me!
I thought I read, a few weeks ago that you nipped out for some shopping at Heybridge, and unfortunately had to abandon your vehicle in floodwater.
Now I have established where you live (apparently quite near Tyler), did you get caught out in a flood, if so where, perhaps Hullbridge Watery Lane say?
Stan's Coaches operates out of a yard at Great Totham, in the 'Land of the Tolles'.
I avoid Watery Lane at the best of times, the name says it all. I don't fancy aqua-planing!
I go to Heybridge about once a month to visit a friend (was there yesterday).
-
...