Jeremy Bamber Forum
JEREMY BAMBER CASE => Jeremy Bamber Case Discussion => Topic started by: chelmsey on March 06, 2011, 04:25:PM
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I have seen on this forum,the notes regarding Pamelas 11pm phonecall to whf on night of murders,but unfortunately cannot seem to find it again.Could someone very kindly please post it up again for me?Many thanks in advance x
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Arrrghhh....have spent hours trying to refind them.Would anyone know then which thread they are on please?
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Can't remember - sorry.
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Is okay thankyou,have finally found it! It was a 10pm phonecall (my mistake).After Pamela spoke to Sheila,June tells Pamela.....sheila is going to bed now.Except she never went to bed as its being said that her bed was not slept in! Im wondering if maybe Sheila slept in bed with June that night? For reasons of comfort perhaps, as her mental state was deteriorating it has been said? I would love to have a bit more information on the gun kept under Ralph and Junes bed aswell.
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Is okay thankyou,have finally found it! It was a 10pm phonecall (my mistake).After Pamela spoke to Sheila,June tells Pamela.....sheila is going to bed now.Except she never went to bed as its being said that her bed was not slept in! Im wondering if maybe Sheila slept in bed with June that night? For reasons of comfort perhaps, as her mental state was deteriorating it has been said? I would love to have a bit more information on the gun kept under Ralph and Junes bed aswell.
I'd like to know where this rumour that Sheila's bed had not been slept in came from. I've seen a statement which says that the bed was used.
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Is okay thankyou,have finally found it! It was a 10pm phonecall (my mistake).After Pamela spoke to Sheila,June tells Pamela.....sheila is going to bed now.Except she never went to bed as its being said that her bed was not slept in! Im wondering if maybe Sheila slept in bed with June that night? For reasons of comfort perhaps, as her mental state was deteriorating it has been said? I would love to have a bit more information on the gun kept under Ralph and Junes bed aswell.
I'd like to know where this rumour that Sheila's bed had not been slept in came from. I've seen a statement which says that the bed was used.
One of the original entry teams made a 'similar' comment - but as usual it's been taken totally out of context.... he said in Sheila's room there were two single beds, one of which appeared undisturbed.
I would guess this is the source of the 'she never slept in the bed' - which gives a shockingly inaccurate impression.
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Thanks for clearing that up for me !
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Interesting that June told Pamela that she was trying to persuade Shiela to take a 'holiday' in a home in Bournmouth. What must Shiela have thought??
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The rumour about the bed stems from a website... where someone asserts that in a 'was Jeremy innocent' blog.
BUT
Police reports at the crime scene (and it's accepted as true) were that her room had TWO single beds, one of which appeared to be undisturbed).
The 'never slept in' statement is awfully made and gives rise to all the wrong impressions.
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Yes.I have since found out about the two single beds in Sheilas room.Thanks for that information.The bed behind the door was deemed as the spare.It was made up and had cosmetics and tampons upon it.The second bed (deemed Sheilas bed) had the covers pulled down.Apparantly it had the appearance that someone had got into it but not remained there for very long.
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I find the whole speed at which stuff was 'back to normal' (not in terms of where furniture was, but in more general terms) very difficult to understand.
Clearly they can't possibly all have been a totally cold family who couldn't care less. And it would probably be wrong to treat White House Farm as some shrine forever more...
But somehow, it just seemed all too quick.
If someone had said "it was boarded up for 18 months, then we struggled with what to do with it - it was a huge turmoil to have to go in, and try to forget the past - change the decor to help start 'afresh'" then I could understand all that.
But even after Ann Eaton moved back in, she didn't replace the lampshade that was damaged in the fight!... he reasoning being it was a rare style that was difficult to replace.
Who am I to say what is right and wrong? (but still... it doesn't fit in with my expectation of normal behaviour)
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The aga, carpets, wallpaper and much of the furniture is still in the house to this day.
If I had to live there I'd have ripped the lot out.
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TBM............I totally agree with you. I personally think that the charity that owns it should have demolished it out of respect,but maybe,being georgian it may be a listed building.I just think that AE must be made of pretty stern stuff,because I sure as hell could not live in that house.I cant understand how if she wanted to put the horrors behind her and move on with her life and have some privacy,why she would WANT to live in that house.She stated that herself and Peter never ever talk about it,but how can you really move on when pictures of your home often flash up on the tv or appear in the press and every now and then you have rubber-neckers trailing past your home.Its amazing what some people are prepared to overlook when money is involved!
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..........but maybe,being georgian it may be a listed building.
Yes it is a Grade II listed building.
http://www.imagesofengland.org.uk/details/default.aspx?id=353190
Actually that link shows a picture from the yard, it's the best picture I've seen so far of the yard door where the police entered, the kitchen window is to the right and the office window to the left.
At first floor the window furthest to the right is the box room between the master bedroom and the twins room, the next window is the twins room.
EDIT: Also the blue door is the coal shed/outhouse where one of the dogs was kept.
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Thankyou Hartley.That is a fantastic photo. You state top right-hand window is box room.Is that the window that is boarded or bricked up or the window to the left of that?
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Thankyou Hartley.That is a fantastic photo. You state top right-hand window is box room.Is that the window that is boarded or bricked up or the window to the left of that?
The window which appears to be bricked up is just a blank window, it has always been like that, the box room is the window next to it.
That blank window is where the main bedroom is.
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Thanks Hartley.So the main bedroom runs front to back I take it.?
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Thanks Hartley.So the main bedroom runs front to back I take it.?
Sort of.
I've added the floor plans in this thread: http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,540.msg9873.html#msg9873
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Ive bumped this thread due to learning something new,which is interesting.
In Pamelas statement,she says that she spoke to Sheila on the phone and that Sheila was quiet and not very talkative (or words to that effect).
Robert Boutflour describes in his statement how he was present when the phone call occurred and listened to the conversation.
In David Boutflours COLP interview,he states that he was also present when the call between Pam and June took place,but states that Sheila refused to come to the phone to speak to her Aunt Pam.
Which statement is correct?
Did Pamela speak to Sheila or not?
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According to Pamela Boutflours statement, as a result of speaking to June that evening (6th August 1985) she was expecting to see June on the following day, to speak to her about a suitible home in which to send Sheila for a rest and treatment, or something similar...
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Ive bumped this thread due to learning something new,which is interesting.
In Pamelas statement,she says that she spoke to Sheila on the phone and that Sheila was quiet and not very talkative (or words to that effect).
Robert Boutflour describes in his statement how he was present when the phone call occurred and listened to the conversation.
In David Boutflours COLP interview,he states that he was also present when the call between Pam and June took place,but states that Sheila refused to come to the phone to speak to her Aunt Pam.
Which statement is correct?
Did Pamela speak to Sheila or not?
I'm scraping my memory here but I think Pam did speak to Sheila, and then to June (again?) but when it came to saying goodbye at the end of the call Sheila had wandered off and didn't come back to the phone, which Pam thought unlike her. Or something. ;)
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That is correct Bridget and, JB told her sister she had gone to bed. :) :)
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I'm scraping my memory here but I think Pam did speak to Sheila, and then to June (again?) but when it came to saying goodbye at the end of the call Sheila had wandered off and didn't come back to the phone, which Pam thought unlike her. Or something. ;)
I find Sheila's withdrawal that evening really interesting because it is a symptom seen before a psychotic attack by a sufferer of shizophrenia.
Another interesting point is that Jeremy also states that Sheila wasn't with it, not joining in the conversation at all. If he was lying and setting the scene surely he would have said Sheila was argumentative or angry. It's highly unlikely he would know this was a warning of a psychotic attack.
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I find Sheila's withdrawal that evening really interesting because it is a symptom seen before a psychotic attack by a sufferer of shizophrenia.
Another interesting point is that Jeremy also states that Sheila wasn't with it, not joining in the conversation at all. If he was lying and setting the scene surely he would have said Sheila was argumentative or angry. It's highly unlikely he would know this was a warning of a psychotic attack.
Withdrawal? By going to bed at 11pm? ?
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I find Sheila's withdrawal that evening really interesting because it is a symptom seen before a psychotic attack by a sufferer of shizophrenia.
Another interesting point is that Jeremy also states that Sheila wasn't with it, not joining in the conversation at all. If he was lying and setting the scene surely he would have said Sheila was argumentative or angry. It's highly unlikely he would know this was a warning of a psychotic attack.
I tend to agree with that Maggie, although I think there's also room for the idea that he was painting a picture of her illness generally, and not trying to claim that there was anything much noticeably wrong on that particular night.
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I tend to agree with that Maggie, although I think there's also room for the idea that he was painting a picture of her illness generally, and not trying to claim that there was anything much noticeably wrong on that particular night.
Yes, but I think he said she waasn't joining in with the conversation ....wasn't involved at all. I see what you mean, just would have thought anything he knew about paranoid schizophrenia would be more likely to be the violent side and if he was trying to paint a picture of a person capable of shooting her children and her parents he would be more inclined to portray her mood as at least agitated. Withdrawn and not involved would have been a strange choice imo.
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Yes, but I think he said she waasn't joining in with the conversation ....wasn't involved at all. I see what you mean, just would have thought anything he knew about paranoid schizophrenia would be more likely to be the violent side and if he was trying to paint a picture of a person capable of shooting her children and her parents he would be more inclined to portray her mood as at least agitated. Withdrawn and not involved would have been a strange choice imo.
If he'd made up a story about her state that evening he couldn't have known whether or not someone would have countered it by saying that they had spoken to her, or even seen her, after he left the farm and she was fine, or even a little withdrawn. That said, I don't think that fits very well with the theory of his general arrogance with regard to getting away with it, which is why I think your point is a valid one.
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If he'd made up a story about her state that evening he couldn't have known whether or not someone would have countered it by saying that they had spoken to her, or even seen her, after he left the farm and she was fine, or even a little withdrawn. That said, I don't think that fits very well with the theory of his general arrogance with regard to getting away with it, which is why I think your point is a valid one.
Thank you Bridget, its hard to know, I see what you're saying too, that's the trouble with this case!! :-\
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I find Sheila's withdrawal that evening really interesting because it is a symptom seen before a psychotic attack by a sufferer of shizophrenia.
Another interesting point is that Jeremy also states that Sheila wasn't with it, not joining in the conversation at all. If he was lying and setting the scene surely he would have said Sheila was argumentative or angry. It's highly unlikely he would know this was a warning of a psychotic attack.
Withdrawal is right Maggie,,,as is the fact that sufferers also believe that they're being spied on,no matter who it is who may be innocently carrying out work on the property itself. All sufferers seem to have this in-built phenomena. It's all related to their illness of course,and poor Sheila,even with the treatment she'd had and was having,was having little or no effect.
I actually know somebody who is going down the same road,following the same pattern,but without a GP's intervention as the person concerned doesn't think there's anything wrong.
Jeremy wouldn't have seen the behaviour as predestine at all.
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Yes, but I think he said she waasn't joining in with the conversation ....wasn't involved at all. I see what you mean, just would have thought anything he knew about paranoid schizophrenia would be more likely to be the violent side and if he was trying to paint a picture of a person capable of shooting her children and her parents he would be more inclined to portray her mood as at least agitated. Withdrawn and not involved would have been a strange choice imo.
I thought Jeremy went out to shoot rabbits, so could have had no knowlege if Sheila had argued with her parents or not.
When he returned to the farm he placed the rifle in the settle, and went home to Goldhanger.. He would havenot known if she was agitated.
On the other hand Colin had allegledy said " she has done it then" after being contacted by the police.
Interestingly he did not believe it was Jeremy at first.
If it was Jeremy the mistake he made was claiming a telephone call from his father. It would have been better to discover the bodies" the next morning.
To be clear I do not believe Mugford about the "tonights the night" phone call, and have always been of the opinion that she should have been beside him in the dock. She was one of the first supergrasses to escape prosecution for turning states evidence.
I don't post much now as we have chewed this cud before, but remain convinced that their is a masonic connection, guilty, or not. Misguided or not Robert was to the fore. I think he convinced himself that Jeremy did it. It was nothing to do with the money, just his belief.
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I thought Jeremy went out to shoot rabbits, so could have had no knowlege if Sheila had argued with her parents or not.
When he returned to the farm he placed the rifle in the settle, and went home to Goldhanger.. He would havenot known if she was agitated.
On the other hand Colin had allegledy said " she has done it then" after being contacted by the police.
Interestingly he did not believe it was Jeremy at first.
If it was Jeremy the mistake he made was claiming a telephone call from his father. It would have been better to discover the bodies" the next morning.
To be clear I do not believe Mugford about the "tonights the night" phone call, and have always been of the opinion that she should have been beside him in the dock. She was one of the first supergrasses to escape prosecution for turning states evidence.
I don't post much now as we have chewed this cud before, but remain convinced that their is a masonic connection, guilty, or not. Misguided or not Robert was to the fore. I think he convinced himself that Jeremy did it. It was nothing to do with the money, just his belief.
Hi Buddy
Jeremy said Sheila was not involved in the conversation as he stood by the sink eating something then loading the gun. He said she wasn't speaking and hardly paying attention which I think is withdrawn not agitated. Don't think he was outside many minutes and from what he said was only half paying attention himself as not that interesting for a 24 yeard old. So his statement that she was NOT agitated surely was contrary as to what you may have expected from Jeremy if he was setting the scene with Sheila as the murderer? I would think.
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I tend to agree that if Jeremy was setting the scene for the slaughter of his family.
I did find it interesting that an earlier post that Sheila joined her mother in bed that night because she may have been unsettled, and Ralph retired to Sheila's bed. When the shooting started he ran downstairs hence the bullet case on the stairs.. I still find it difficult that one shooter was involved, with two adults upstairs, and one down. The degree of brutallity also troubles me if the intention was just to kill his family. There was no need for this brutality, and added to the time it would take.
Hope this makes sense. Regards.
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I tend to agree that Jeremy was setting the scene for the slaughter of his family.
I did find it interesting that an earlier post that Sheila joined her mother in bed that night because she may have been unsettled, and Ralph retired to Sheila's bed. When the shooting started he ran downstairs hence the bullet case on the stairs.. I still find it difficult that one shooter was involved, with two adults upstairs, and one down. The degree of brutallity also troubles me if the intention was just to kill his family. There was no need for this brutality, and added to the time it would take.
Hope this makes sense. Regards.
By all accounts,Sheilas' bed hadn't been slept in,with no visible disturbance of bedclothes having been turned back ready to step into. Only the top of the made bed did it show an impression of someone having just lain on top.
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I tend to agree that Jeremy was setting the scene for the slaughter of his family.
I did find it interesting that an earlier post that Sheila joined her mother in bed that night because she may have been unsettled, and Ralph retired to Sheila's bed. When the shooting started he ran downstairs hence the bullet case on the stairs.. I still find it difficult that one shooter was involved, with two adults upstairs, and one down. The degree of brutallity also troubles me if the intention was just to kill his family. There was no need for this brutality, and added to the time it would take.
Hope this makes sense. Regards.
Buddy, Hi. I suggested some time ago the possibility that Sheila had been in, or on the bed with June. That maybe June had read some Bible passages to her, as she may have done when Sheila was a child, as a means of calming her.
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By all accounts,Sheilas' bed hadn't been slept in,with no visible disturbance of bedclothes having been turned back ready to step into. Only the top of the made bed did it show an impression of someone having just lain on top.
Yes Lookout it does appear that way. That is why I am suggesting that it was not Sheila that retired to that bedroom. The tampax on the bed suggest she had removed one from the box, and left the others insitu.. Of course this is only a thought, and may be wide of the mark.
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Buddy, Hi. I suggested some time ago the possibility that Sheila had been in, or on the bed with June. That maybe June had read some Bible passages to her, as she may have done when Sheila was a child, as a means of calming her.
I agree April.
That was the reason that ONE of the bibles was found next to Sheila's body, as we know that poor June owned several bibles.
I think that at this stage of Sheila's life she was so confused with all the religious stuff from June that she started to go along with June's thinking, as her life at the time was a mess.
Sheila had lost her husband, and children, and probably the will to live.
It's so hard now to discuss this seriously, as it all ends in silly banter on threads that need to be discussed.
It is disheartening when good topics denegrate to talking nonsense. There are threads off topic where this can be done.
I have been reading the topics I have missed. Guess what, I hav'nt missed them at all.
Some brilliant posters have abstained because of this. We need to stay at serious posts only. There are places you can go for off topic discussion.
Moan over. :D
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Yes Lookout it does appear that way. That is why I am suggesting that it was not Sheila that retired to that bedroom. The tampax on the bed suggest she had removed one from the box, and left the others insitu.. Of course this is only a thought, and may be wide of the mark.
Buddy,,I did also read somewhere that Sheila was found shot on her fathers' side of the bed.
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Buddy,,I did also read somewhere that Sheila was found shot on her fathers' side of the bed.
Lookout that has always been a bone of contention.
The report says that Sheila was on the far side of the bed {ralph's side}. It has been argued that this meant the the floor.
Given that Ann was told that both June, and Sheila were found on the bed I give some credence to this.
Even if Ann cannot recall Which officer told her it remains a fact she was told, and she passed this info onto Mugford, who agreed with Ann.
All of a sudden Sheila's body has been moved about, as testified by the photo's.
Bewes could not explain this, as witnessed in his youtube interveiw.
Bewes left the police, and took up taxi driving, until he secured a job as as a security consultant.
I will endeaver to find out where his expertise is needed, and report back ASAP.
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Lookout that has always been a bone of contention.
The report says that Sheila was on the far side of the bed {ralph's side}. It has been argued that this meant the the floor.
Given that Ann was told that both June, and Sheila were found on the bed I give some credence to this.
Even if Ann cannot recall Which officer told her it remains a fact she was told, and she passed this info onto Mugford, who agreed with Ann.
All of a sudden Sheila's body has been moved about, as testified by the photo's.
Bewes could not explain this, as witnessed in his youtube interveiw.
Bewes left the police, and took up taxi driving, until he secured a job as as a security consultant.
I will endeaver to find out where his expertise is needed, and report back ASAP.
In order to understand fully,,if Sheila had been found on the floor,then it would have stated the floor and not her fathers' side of the bed,,,,which tells me me quite simply that she was actually on the bed and not the floor. Both entirely different places.
If I said I was going to sleep on my fathers' side of the bed,,I wouldn't mean on the floor,but the bed itself.
Not knocking taxi drivers,,but what a come-down eh ? So he left as opposed to being retired.? When was this,do you know.?
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In order to understand fully,,if Sheila had been found on the floor,then it would have stated the floor and not her fathers' side of the bed,,,,which tells me me quite simply that she was actually on the bed and not the floor. Both entirely different places.
If I said I was going to sleep on my fathers' side of the bed,,I wouldn't mean on the floor,but the bed itself.
Not knocking taxi drivers,,but what a come-down eh ? So he left as opposed to being retired.? When was this,do you know.?
No lookout. the report said Sheila was on the far side of the bed. Not the bed itself. I understand this is a play on words.
Lookout, Sheila just went to bed. Whether she went to her parents bed is a matter of conjecter. I suspect she did at some time that night, and Ralph took to her bed, as he understood she was upset at the time, and tossed her tampax ect onto the spare bed..
This nonsense that Jeremy used a tampax as some sort of a pull through is daft. There was no need to clean the rifle, as this was supposed to be the murder weapon.
I honestly believe the rifle was cleaned down by the police, because so many of them had handled it.
It seems that Sheila was a loose cannon, and not the loving mother that people would have us believe.
She was a violent drug addict who was capable of anything.. That is why Colin left her in the first place, and why he got custody of the twins.
He knew she could be violent, and on occasions hurt the twins. One in particular.
She was not the loving mother that others would have us believe. She was a troubled person that needed to be in care.
Sheila was apparently involved in the drug trade, and owed some sum to her suppliers.
Is it impossible that someone wanted their money back. I think more attention should be paid to this.
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No lookout. the report said Sheila was on the far side of the bed. Not the bed itself. I understand this is a play on words.
Lookout, Sheila just went to bed. Whether she went to her parents bed is a matter of conjecter. I suspect she did at some time that night, and Ralph took to her bed, as he understood she was upset at the time, and tossed her tampax ect onto the spare bed..
This nonsense that Jeremy used a tampax as some sort of a pull through is daft. There was no need to clean the rifle, as this was supposed to be the murder weapon.
I honestly believe the rifle was cleaned down by the police, because so many of them had handled it.
It seems that Sheila was a loose cannon, and not the loving mother that people would have us believe.
She was a violent drug addict who was capable of anything.. That is why Colin left her in the first place, and why he got custody of the twins.
He knew she could be violent, and on occasions hurt the twins. One in particular.
She was not the loving mother that others would have us believe. She was a troubled person that needed to be in care.
Sheila was apparently involved in the drug trade, and owed some sum to her suppliers.
Is it impossible that someone wanted their money back. I think more attention should be paid to this.
Sheila may have been difficult to live with,needing constant emotional support and raising the topic of religion far more than the average person's liking,but I doubt she was involved in the drug trade. In Clare Powell's book we have an anecdote where drugs are left lying around near children at a friend's house and Sheila is horrified. The twins always came first in her life,it's just that her medication would make her drowsy and guilty of omission more than anything.
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Sheila may have been difficult to live with,needing constant emotional support and raising the topic of religion far more than the average person's liking,but I doubt she was involved in the drug trade. In Clare Powell's book we have an anecdote where drugs are left lying around near children at a friend's house and Sheila is horrified. The twins always came first in her life,it's just that her medication would make her drowsy and guilty of omission more than anything.
Sho owed a drug dealor friend £50,000...
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Sho owed a drug dealor friend £50,000...
Says who?
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Says who?
Steve will know that one. ;)
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Says who?
Jeremy...
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The only drug dealor reputed to be in Sheila's life around thr time she was killed, was none other than Freddie Emani...
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If Sheila was unwell enough for her parents to try talk her into going for a "holiday" then things must have been pretty bad.
I would imagine she would object strongly to this and there had been a row about it. she would see this as them ganging up on her and trying to get rid of her.
I see the mention of tampax, with one just being out the pack. I might be way off here but it could be that she also suffered severe hormonal problems on top of everything else. I know how we can joke about PMS but it is horrible and in someone already with mental problems it would make her emotions and feelings even more intense.
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If Sheila was unwell enough for her parents to try talk her into going for a "holiday" then things must have been pretty bad.
I would imagine she would object strongly to this and there had been a row about it. she would see this as them ganging up on her and trying to get rid of her.
I see the mention of tampax, with one just being out the pack. I might be way off here but it could be that she also suffered severe hormonal problems on top of everything else. I know how we can joke about PMS but it is horrible and in someone already with mental problems it would make her emotions and feelings even more intense.
Michaela we know only too well that women who suffer PMT are most likely to kill,,,without having been diagnosed with any mental problems. Hormones have a lot to answer for at the best of times and can,,,and are problematic as one gets older.
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If Sheila was unwell enough for her parents to try talk her into going for a "holiday" then things must have been pretty bad.
I would imagine she would object strongly to this and there had been a row about it. she would see this as them ganging up on her and trying to get rid of her.
I see the mention of tampax, with one just being out the pack. I might be way off here but it could be that she also suffered severe hormonal problems on top of everything else. I know how we can joke about PMS but it is horrible and in someone already with mental problems it would make her emotions and feelings even more intense.
Michaela, hello. Whilst I have on numerous occasions said I believe it possible that her parents MAY have suggested a "holiday", unlike Steve, I'm not trying to say it DID happen. Had it, I am convinced that in the fragile mental state she undoubtedly was, she would have seen it as a conspiracy to seperate her from the twins.
It's not impossible that she also suffered PMS which may have been exacerbated by the onset of psychosis. The poor girl seemed to be in a place where she had very little going for her.
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If Sheila was unwell enough for her parents to try talk her into going for a "holiday" then things must have been pretty bad.
I would imagine she would object strongly to this and there had been a row about it. she would see this as them ganging up on her and trying to get rid of her.
I see the mention of tampax, with one just being out the pack. I might be way off here but it could be that she also suffered severe hormonal problems on top of everything else. I know how we can joke about PMS but it is horrible and in someone already with mental problems it would make her emotions and feelings even more intense.
Hi Michaela
I've said the same thing before; she was also getting ready for another injection, which had been halved by a locum doctor.... :) :) :) :)
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If Sheila was unwell enough for her parents to try talk her into going for a "holiday" then things must have been pretty bad.
I would imagine she would object strongly to this and there had been a row about it. she would see this as them ganging up on her and trying to get rid of her.
I see the mention of tampax, with one just being out the pack. I might be way off here but it could be that she also suffered severe hormonal problems on top of everything else. I know how we can joke about PMS but it is horrible and in someone already with mental problems it would make her emotions and feelings even more intense.
Hi Michaela, I agree, the 'hormonal' aspect certainly wouldn't help to improve a psychotic episode.
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Hi Michaela
I've said the same thing before; she was also getting ready for another injection, which had been halved by a locum doctor.... :) :) :) :)
Patti
What was she getting injections for?
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Patti
What was she getting injections for?
She was diagnosed with schizophrenia. Shelia was hit a miss with her medication and had a habit of missing her doctor's appointments, all of which is documented. Her doctor decided it would be best if she had injections monthly...which was 200gms per month. The drug haloperidol had side effects which caused her to loose her co-ordination, but the doctors provided another drug to counter act that one.
During the last couple of months of her life, while she was living in her flat in London. Sheila had an all night psychotic episode. Her friend Freddie was present when she was having this episode and became very concerned and was frightened, for Sheila and himself. He called her mother in law to come over and called Nevill....who said it was too late in the night and that he would deal with it the next day. Colin's mum came over, but she was ordered out of the house by Sheila....Sheila was saying that Freddie was the devil, she was running up and down stairs and thumping the walls, she also went mad when Freddie picked up the phone and dialed for help. The locum doctor came out to see her at the request of Freddie, who gave her a reduced injection on Sheila's request. Nevill got Sheila back into hospital, but according to her doctor she left the hospital before it was safe for her to do so.....By this time Colin was looking after the twins, but Sheila saw them on a regular basis. Hope this helps.... :) :) :)
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She was diagnosed with schizophrenia. Shelia was hit a miss with her medication and had a habit of missing her doctor's appointments, all of which is documented. Her doctor decided it would be best if she had injections monthly...which was 200gms per month. The drug haloperidol had side effects which caused her to loose her co-ordination, but the doctors provided another drug to counter act that one.
During the last couple of months of her life, while she was living in her flat in London. Sheila had an all night psychotic episode. Her friend Freddie was present when she was having this episode and became very concerned and was frightened, for Sheila and himself. He called her mother in law to come over and called Nevill....who said it was too late in the night and that he would deal with it the next day. Colin's mum came over, but she was ordered out of the house by Sheila....Sheila was saying that Freddie was the devil, she was running up and down stairs and thumping the walls, she also went mad when Freddie picked up the phone and dialed for help. The locum doctor came out to see her at the request of Freddie, who gave her a reduced injection on Sheila's request. Nevill got Sheila back into hospital, but according to her doctor she left the hospital before it was safe for her to do so.....By this time Colin was looking after the twins, but Sheila saw them on a regular basis. Hope this helps.... :) :) :)
If I may add to this. Her consultant agreed to reduce the dose from 200mg to 150mg. The locum, without further consultation, reduced it to 100mg, so her anti psychotic was reduced in one fell swoop by half, just about THE most dangerous thing that can be done with anti psychotic meds.
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What a poor tormented soul Sheila was. It is so tragic.
That is one awful drug she was given. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haloperidol
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What a poor tormented soul Sheila was. It is so tragic.
That is one awful drug she was given. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haloperidol
It was probably the best thing available in 1985.
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If I may add to this. Her consultant agreed to reduce the dose from 200mg to 150mg. The locum, without further consultation, reduced it to 100mg, so her anti psychotic was reduced in one fell swoop by half, just about THE most dangerous thing that can be done with anti psychotic meds.
You're absolutely correct April....thank you! :D :D :D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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The only drug dealor reputed to be in Sheila's life around thr time she was killed, was none other than Freddie Emani...
'she was killed' ? is there something more to this that you know then ?
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Michaela, hello. Whilst I have on numerous occasions said I believe it possible that her parents MAY have suggested a "holiday", unlike Steve, I'm not trying to say it DID happen. Had it, I am convinced that in the fragile mental state she undoubtedly was, she would have seen it as a conspiracy to seperate her from the twins.
It's not impossible that she also suffered PMS which may have been exacerbated by the onset of psychosis. The poor girl seemed to be in a place where she had very little going for her.
The part about Sheila's so-called separation from the twins is a complete red herring. My guess is at most June offered Sheila the prospect of bringing in some of the local girls to babysit the twins as had been done previously.
We know from Helen Grimster's statement that Sheila was happy with the arrangement she had with Colin and indeed the divorce had brought them closer together. Dr Hugh Ferguson had previously stated he did not consider Sheila a suicide risk as "she had too much to live for".
If you can't work out by now who was behind all these rumours,the man who embellished half-truths into downright lies such as Sheila having to stay in a NHS hospital the next time she was ill when her parents were millionaires by today's standards,the lies about the rabbits and gun which was primed for murder,then I am genuinely sorry for you.
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The part about Sheila's so-called separation from the twins is a complete red herring. My guess is at most June offered Sheila the prospect of bringing in some of the local girls to babysit the twins as had been done previously.
We know from Helen Grimster's statement that Sheila was happy with the arrangement she had with Colin and indeed the divorce had brought them closer together. Dr Hugh Ferguson had previously stated he did not consider Sheila a suicide risk as "she had too much to live for".
If you can't work out by now who was behind all these rumours,the man who embellished half-truths into downright lies such as Sheila having to stay in a NHS hospital the next time she was ill when her parents were millionaires by today's standards,the lies about the rabbits and gun which was primed for murder,then I am genuinely sorry for you.
And if you haven't the sensitivity to understand that Sheila may have seen their "getting on better since the divorce" as reason to hope for reconciliation, I fear you know little of women.
As for the "red herring" of separating her from the twins, I rather imagine that if Sheila had been persuaded to take that "holiday", her parents, at 60 plus may have found it too much, caring full time for two boisterous boys.
Nobody needs to have been behind "embellished half truths" and "downright lies". Sheila's health was deteriorating. It matters little what Dr Ferguson noted about her back in March. By August it appears, for various reasons, she was a very different person. Didn't she say, in her letter to AE, that God had a mission for her to rid the world of evil? My apologies if she didn't.
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And if you haven't the sensitivity to understand that Sheila may have seen their "getting on better since the divorce" as reason to hope for reconciliation, I fear you know little of women.
As for the "red herring" of separating her from the twins, I rather imagine that if Sheila had been persuaded to take that "holiday", her parents, at 60 plus may have found it too much, caring full time for two boisterous boys.
Nobody needs to have been behind "embellished half truths" and "downright lies". Sheila's health was deteriorating. It matters little what Dr Ferguson noted about her back in March. By August it appears, for various reasons, she was a very different person. Didn't she say, in her letter to AE, that God had a mission for her to rid the world of evil? My apologies if she didn't.
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And if you haven't the sensitivity to understand that Sheila may have seen their "getting on better since the divorce" as reason to hope for reconciliation, I fear you know little of women.
As for the "red herring" of separating her from the twins, I rather imagine that if Sheila had been persuaded to take that "holiday", her parents, at 60 plus may have found it too much, caring full time for two boisterous boys.
Nobody needs to have been behind "embellished half truths" and "downright lies". Sheila's health was deteriorating. It matters little what Dr Ferguson noted about her back in March. By August it appears, for various reasons, she was a very different person. Didn't she say, in her letter to AE, that God had a mission for her to rid the world of evil? My apologies if she didn't.
No she did say it,but I think that was to Helen Grimster. I wonder if Jeremy was around when those words were spoken;he seems to have known everything else which was going on including his parents' financial affairs and the location of the key to the safe.
Sheila's letter to Ann had rather a diffident tone as if she were apologizing for being ill. It's typical behaviour of a Blood Type A as is the comment in her diary about being sorry for being horrible to Jeremy.
Incidentally I've had some stress this weekend so apologies for some of my posts in the past hour. I'm a Blood Type A..
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Interesting response, Steve :)